Amplifier Mistake (Blackstar)

thomasross20

I'm going to do a lot of "research" over Crimbo and see what there is I can play in shops... That Victory amp looks great. I think it's between something like that or a Blackstar head. If I got the Blackstar head, I'd get the Blackstar cab. If I got the Victory head, I'd go for an NL12 or NL212 (super-light) cab. 

Only thing I'd say is.. it's good to have the option to use the blackstar FX and channels even though single channel with pedals is more suited to me. Because if the pedal board ever blew out, I'd be stuck....!

ICBM

thomasross20 said:

I'm going to do a lot of "research" over Crimbo and see what there is I can play in shops... That Victory amp looks great. I think it's between something like that or a Blackstar head. If I got the Blackstar head, I'd get the Blackstar cab. If I got the Victory head, I'd go for an NL12 or NL212 (super-light) cab. 

Only thing I'd say is.. it's good to have the option to use the blackstar FX and channels even though single channel with pedals is more suited to me. Because if the pedal board ever blew out, I'd be stuck....!

That's a very important point. Having the extra channels and effects doesn't mean you have to use them unless you need to.

Even used as a single-channel amp it's much more flexible than most with the gain modes and the power valve emulation. There aren't many traditional amps which you can set to sound roughly either like a Twin, an AC30, a Hiwatt or a Marshall Major depending on exactly what sort of clean-with-pedals sound you want .

thomasross20

Exactly. You know what, I think I'm going to get the Blackstar head & cab. 

Question is.... 

ID100 or ID60 head? 

And which cab for those??

I don't want to get the 100 if the 60 will do. Sent you a message...

ICBM

Actually having thought about it, on balance I think the 100 will restrict your cabinet options more than the 60 in terms of physical size and power handling, although the other way round in terms of impedance. Not really an issue if you're going to use your own cab rather than borrowed ones though - just make sure that what you get isn't 16 ohms.

thomasross20

16 ohms not loud enough? 16,8,4 seem to be most common. Is the 100 physically that much bigger than the 60 ? Will check later

ICBM

thomasross20 said:

16 ohms not loud enough? 16,8,4 seem to be most common. Is the 100 physically that much bigger than the 60 ? Will check later

The problem is that the power stage is very linear regarding impedance - full power into 4 ohms, half power into 8, and only a quarter into 16. The ID60 I tried was very loud into 4, but only just about adequate into 16. The 100W would give you more into 16, just because it's more powerful in the first place - this is not a real issue unless you're going to use borrowed cabs though, since if it's your own you just make sure it's 8.

The 100 seems to be 102mm (4") wider than the 60, which is quite a lot and makes it a lot wider than most 1x12" cabs.

thomasross20

Yeah, that is a bummer...
The HTV112 (celestion speakers) looks good but is 18kg!! The HT112 (blackstar's own speaker) is about 11kg but unless I'm wrong it's not large enough to hold either the id60 or id100 heads.
And then if the single 16ohm speaker won't be loud enough... There's no way I'm lugging a 2x12 cab.

Are all 16ohm 1x12 cabs 16 ohms?

The only downer about the 260 is the weight

ICBM

You definitely want my friend's Montage . 10Kg empty, plus 4.7Kg with a Classic Lead 80 in it - or you could replace the speaker with a Century Vintage which would save about 3Kg!

I can do it with the Classic Lead for £100. The Century would be more expensive unless I can find you a second hand one - not impossible, I know someone who might have one for sale. The CL80 is 8-ohm, not sure about the Century.

Personally I'd go for the Classic Lead since it's the more efficient and bigger-sounding, and has a safer power rating (the Century is 60W) but it's also the heavier - although just under 15Kg for a cab is still not a lot.

thomasross20

I was saying in the gig thread I *might* stick with the combo, no sure. I saw the ID100 head on youtube and it fits onto a 4x12. Way, way too big. Ridiculous. Even the ID60 head looks too big. They definitely don't need to be that big!!

ThePrettyDamned

thomasross20;452475" said:

I was saying in the gig thread I *might* stick with the combo, no sure. I saw the ID100 head on youtube and it fits onto a 4x12. Way, way too big. Ridiculous. Even the ID60 head looks too big. They definitely don't need to be that big!!

It might overlap a but (maybe?) but the 60 watt head should sit on a 1x12 cab.

The id 100 head would fit on a 2x12 that's the same width as the 4x12 (obviously).

I don't see any reason the id60 head and 1x12 cab would be too little to be honest - assuming the cab is 4 or 8ohm anyway.

ICBM

thomasross20 said:

Even the ID60 head looks too big. They definitely don't need to be that big!!

Indeed they don't.

This is the ID60:

http://www.theangelconversations.com/pics/Blackstar/Cabinet.jpg

http://www.theangelconversations.com/pics/Blackstar/Chassis2.jpg

As you can see, not only is the top half of the cabinet completely empty, but - apart from the control board, which does run nearly the full length - you could get the contents of the chassis into about half the space if you wanted to… certainly no more than two thirds.

i'd really like to see them do a 'lunch box' format of this amp - it should be fairly easy, with the control board split and stacked vertically you could get the whole lot into something about the size of a Tiny Terror.

Voxman

I think it's an image/marketing thing - to make it look more beefy and look like the heads buyers expect to see.  But I too would love to see this condensed into a lighter more compact offering, with the same (or even better) features.  

thomasross20

Yep, totally agreed. All that space - pain in the a$$

ICBM

If I had one I would probably fit a shelf to it and make an access hole in the back panel, so it could be used to carry your cables, footswitch etc. Considering the cost of one extra piece of MDF it's rather an oversight that Blackstar didn't.

Even the combo isn't that well-designed from that point of view - the port in the back is slightly too small, and right at the bottom so things would fall out.

thomasross20

Thanks for taking those pics - I never realised just how space inefficient they were!

ICBM

thomasross20 said:

Thanks for taking those pics - I never realised just how space inefficient they were!

Yes, ridiculous! Basically the chassis is identical to the one in the ID60 combo - not even mounted the opposite way up like a Marshall valve head and combo are - so it can't even be for ventilation since in the combo, it's right up against the top of the cabinet.

That amp belongs to a local rehearsal studio I work for by the way - they've had it for nearly two years and haven't killed it yet, so I reckon it's totally bombproof! Rehearsal rooms are the hardest use for any gear - almost every other amp they have has died sooner or later, the only exception being the old Peavey Stereo Chorus which just blew its speakers.

So I wouldn't worry too much about gigging an ID with no backup. I'd still take a direct-to-PA solution for dire emergencies, but no more than that.

Jalapeno

No valves at all - don't need to lug a spare amp IMHO. Something weeny if you're paranoid. 

It's nearly always a cable that lets you down in reality

ICBM

Jalapeno said:

No valves at all - don't need to lug a spare amp IMHO.

There are quite a lot of solid-state amps that doesn't apply to.

Worse, if they do die there is no way you can get them going again with a new valve or two and a fuse, so you can't even take those. A good half of all my repair work is solid-state amps. Part of the problem is poor build quality, because they're designed to be cheap.

Even of the valve amps, probably the majority are not valve faults, although this tends to diminish the more expensive the amp is.

One of the reasons I use the amp I do - without a backup really, other than an old PA head which would get me by - is that it has switchable rectifiers, four power valves (but can run on two), two channels, two speakers, and I've never come across a Mesa amp with a blown transformer that wasn't caused by misuse, so I reckon I can always get it going again with a replacement fuse. There are not many solid-state amps I would feel that confident about.

paulmapp8306

Come on, you know you want to spend more money lol. After the god knows how much on your prsi and suhr.

Matrix nl 2x12 at just under 14kg, or 1x12 at under 80kg for for your cab. An afx plus matrix gt1000 amp racked at under 10kg. Partner it with a floorboard and your sorted.

2 light carries, almost certainly better tones than your used to, and no worries with fx switching or boosts (including top quality fx).

It really is the perfecting for you given your background, and will do justice to your guitars. OK it's gonna cost - somewhere around £4k all in new . That's £2k or so for the afx (don't know what the currently price would be), £600 or so for the board (ditto) £600 ish for the amp and just under £500 for the cab.

thomasross20

*faints* lol.. Anybody played with the NL cabs live? Axe FX looks to be not too simple and I defo wanna keep things simple