Pub landlord to run against Farage.

randomhandclaps

OK, so I think Farage is a major bell-end, but to be fair to him he is a politician so he was already 80% of the way there on my 'possible bell-end' scale before he ever even opened he Cheshire cat-a-like mouth.

That said, other than the continued poor use of the term 'racist' to describe his views I also find the labelling of him as a bigot quite pathetic and ironic.  A bigot is someone who seeks to prevent others from holding different opinions.  So often those who shout 'BIGOT' at people for expressing what they view as a distasteful on unsatisfactorily different viewpoints are in fact the ones displaying bigoted behaviour - as demonstrated here.  What's worse and is undoubtedly largely responsible for the media time Farage gets and the success it has brought is that the three main party leaders are all treat us with enough contempt and ignorance to do the same with him. 

http://i1284.photobucket.com/albums/a579/imadray/CAMERONEPA_2179905b_zpsdf12ad02.jpg

Snap

Communism is despicable really, and has been proven as a load of impractical cods over the years   -  witness the huge success and popularity of communist regimes around the world. Clearly a ragin success and sterling example of human rights. Its something most people grow out of, once they understand how people and societies work. Orwell had it bang on.

Farage is a bit of a berk, yes, but he serves to at least highlight some important topics. We do have a problem with cultural and racial integration in this country, in certain places. There are legitimate questions to be asked of our terms of membership of the EU and our foreign trade policies. I don't see the value in denying these, but I'm not saying that Farage & Co have the right answers. But, the policies of UKIP are not the same as how they are caricatured by the press, at either side of the political spectrum.

Calling him a racist is just fatuous, and is actually ignoring the points he's trying to make, which aren't as extreme as that at all.

Lixarto

Oh, a graph off the internet; now I'm convinced.

Blea.

randomhandclaps

Snap said:

Calling him a racist is just fatuous, and is actually ignoring the points he's trying to make, which aren't as extreme as that at all.

"But.....but......but......He said British something or other so he must be an uber-mega-racist."

You are spot on though.

Drew_TNBD

Snap said:

Communism is despicable really, and has been proven as a load of impractical cods over the years   -  witness the huge success and popularity of communist regimes around the world. Clearly a ragin success and sterling example of human rights. Its something most people grow out of, once they understand how people and societies work. Orwell had it bang on.

Farage is a bit of a berk, yes, but he serves to at least highlight some important topics. We do have a problem with cultural and racial integration in this country, in certain places. There are legitimate questions to be asked of our terms of membership of the EU and our foreign trade policies. I don't see the value in denying these, but I'm not saying that Farage & Co have the right answers. But, the policies of UKIP are not the same as how they are caricatured by the press, at either side of the political spectrum.

Calling him a racist is just fatuous, and is actually ignoring the points he's trying to make, which aren't as extreme as that at all.

I was on a train with our drummer at some point last year. We were talking about Bioshock Infinite, and he hadn't played any of the Bioshock games. So I was giving him a run down of the background of the game series; the whole objectivism gone wrong, versus communism gone wrong type of deal.

Anyway, we were having a good old chin wag between ourselves. Got off the train, and a moment later I felt a tap on my shoulder. This odious looking man wearing horn-rimmed glasses, cleared his throat, and just went forth (from my memory):

Um... actually, I think you'll find that there never has been a proper implementation of Communism. So to judge it harshly like that is totally missing the point.

Then he walked off. Smug as fuck. Grinning from ear to ear, like he'd schooled someone. Fucking spazz.

Snap

what a twat.

See, that div is missing the whole point about communism, which is this: human beings are generally bastards and don't buy into the whole equality thing so you always end up with some overlord who is more equal than others, and shites on the rest of us.

I'm going to Moscow on Monday, really. Been working there for a while. There's some good things about communism, of course, but it's an ideology, not a practical method, and as such it can't work, and it never has. Ever.

imalone

China remains communist and is doing quite well. Apart from the corruption and total lack of human rights. They're even starting to care about the environment, though that's mainly because of just how bad it is. Mao's cultural revolution I don't know enough about to make absolute statements, but it seems to have killed people more by dint of seriously bad ideas than by intent, compared to Stalin who used production planning to create starvation in certain areas, or the Khmer Rouge who were seriously deranged.
Though presenting anything short of a complete capitalist free market free for all with optional national protectionism as communism is a mistake, one that seems to seriously unbalance US politics.
Farage does not seem to be particularly a racist, though his party seems to attract them as representatives. He realised he could make a successful MEP career by campaigning to get out of Europe. The lack of UKIP policies for years (including the retracted manifesto a while ago) stems from that, there's not a plan, they've just kept on tagging on things they think will appeal to their demographic. Which would be fine, except the consequences haven't been considered.
Al Murray audiences I think are in on the satire, from the stuff I've seen on TV at least (haven't been to a show). Though it does cut very close to the bone, bizarre watching him get this audience of people who've turned up to see an ironic act to chant stuff they are clearly uncomfortable with.

chillidoggy

Snap said:

what a twat.

See, that div is missing the whole point about communism, which is this: human beings are generally bastards and don't buy into the whole equality thing so you always end up with some overlord who is more equal than others, and shites on the rest of us.

I'm going to Moscow on Monday, really. Been working there for a while. There's some good things about communism, of course, but it's an ideology, not a practical method, and as such it can't work, and it never has. Ever.

Pretty much sums it up for me.

When I was at college, the electrics lecturer (a personal friend of Blair Peach for those old enough to remember the name), was a big supporter of communism. Our lectures regularly descended into political debates, which did at least serve to prevent me from actually having to learn anything. Anyway, I asked the guy where in the world a communist state actually functioned as intended. He admitted that it didn't and probably never would for the self-same reasons Snap stated above.

I liked the lecturer, he was a knowledgable, genuine guy, who spoke well in our debates. And, recognising the amount of time we'd all wasted during the term, at the end of the course he gave us all the exam questions.

Evilmags

Communism is the ideology of murder. It is far worse than even Nazisim, althoughthe two are ideological bedfellows. Nevertheless it is highly dubious using public money to employ Marxist academics. The marxists at the Sorbonne in Paid were the teachers of t he Kymer Rouge FFS...

randomhandclaps

People who tell you that communism will ever work given the chance are the same as those psychics that tell you that the reason your dead auntie Jean couldn't remember your middle name was because YOU didn't believe enough.

VimFuego

but I didn't believe enough.

randomhandclaps

You made auntie Jean sad.

VimFuego

yeah well, she shouldn't have got me that bunty annual for xmas. I mean, I was 25 FFS.

holnrew

Communism does work though, in small communities (the clue is in the name). As a system of government though it's highly flawed. China is hardly communist these days.

The problem I have with all the political parties at the moment is authoritarianism and shitting on the poor. They've managed to get it so that everybody blames the people on the rung below, and those right at the bottom are killing themselves. And under UKIP that kind of thing will only get worse.

Heartfeltdawn

Drew_fx said:

Anyway, we were having a good old chin wag between ourselves. Got off the train, and a moment later I felt a tap on my shoulder. This odious looking man wearing horn-rimmed glasses, cleared his throat, and just went forth (from my memory):

Um... actually, I think you'll find that there never has been a proper implementation of Communism. So to judge it harshly like that is totally missing the point.

Then he walked off. Smug as fuck. Grinning from ear to ear, like he'd schooled someone. Fucking spazz.

'A proper implementation'... ha. 

Drew, here's an ad hominem attack on that man: he's a fucking tool. 

Lixarto

Schnozzalee said:

Drew_fx said:

Oh pipe down you fat Commie.

+2 Empty vessels make the most noise.

You see, I thought that of him.

He should go on "Big Brother", he'd fit right in.

Drew_TNBD

Lixarto;481187" said:

Schnozzalee said:








Drew_fx said:

Oh pipe down you fat Commie.





+2 Empty vessels make the most noise.





You see, I thought that of him.



He should go on "Big Brother", he'd fit right in.

:O)

Drew_TNBD

Snap said:

what a twat.

See, that div 

Kudos on the word div btw. 

Axe_meister

Evilmags said:

Communism is the ideology of murder. It is far worse than even Nazisim, althoughthe two are ideological bedfellows. Nevertheless it is highly dubious using public money to employ Marxist academics. The marxists at the Sorbonne in Paid were the teachers of t he Kymer Rouge FFS...

I'd say Marxism as a theory is quite the opposite. In fact Star Trek the next generation is based on communism that works, where human greed is either not in the equation or everybody is satisfied. It is the execution that has and probably will always fail. I like to think of politics as a full circle. Where right and left eventually meet. However the middle ground is the lesser of all evils. However nobody is completly satisfied. If any one party is satisfied then there will always be losers.

Drew_TNBD

Axe_meister said:

Evilmags said:

Communism is the ideology of murder. It is far worse than even Nazisim, althoughthe two are ideological bedfellows. Nevertheless it is highly dubious using public money to employ Marxist academics. The marxists at the Sorbonne in Paid were the teachers of t he Kymer Rouge FFS...

I'd say Marxism as a theory is quite the opposite. In fact Star Trek the next generation is based on communism that works, where human greed is either not in the equation or everybody is satisfied. It is the execution that has and probably will always fail. I like to think of politics as a full circle. Where right and left eventually meet. However the middle ground is the lesser of all evils. However nobody is completly satisfied. If any one party is satisfied then there will always be losers.

Star Trek is FICTION...