Rickenbacker and the 5th Knob Mystery

rpr

Well I'm on my third 330 and I pretty much gave up on it's use after about an hour of owning my first one. I asked other owners and they also confessed complete bafflement.

 If you try Goggling it, the answers range from similar confusion to the 'experts' whose answers , when analysed,are just gobbledygook....speaking of which the Ricky manual is equal convoluted.Jim Hall has actually said its pretty redundant and would like to phase it out, if it wasn't from the purists out cries.

Personally I think that it would be better off being a master volume, but I'm not doing any mods.

So what does it do and why and what practical use does it serve??

Be warned we might just break the internet if we get this sussed.

Voxman

IIRC it's a 'blend knob' that let's you 'mix' how much of each pup is coming through.  Just gives finer tonal control than merely switching a pup fully on/off.

ICBM

Much misunderstood and possibly deliberately misdescribed by Rickenbacker! It's not a blend control, in the sense of adjusting the balance of both pickups.

It's an extra volume control - wired as a variable series resistor, rather than a conventional volume - for the neck pickup, which operates before the main one and has a range of from full (when 'down') to half (when 'up'), ie it works backwards. Nothing more, nothing less.

The purpose seems to be that in the old days, the bridge pickup had a small cap in series with it to give a brighter sound, but this also makes it a bit weak compared to the neck pickup and especially in the middle position, where you really only hear the neck pickup. So the 5th knob is there to tune the neck pickup down to the level of the bridge.

The modern guitars don't have the cap so technically don't need it, but since the neck pickup is still a bit louder than the bridge - just due to being further towards the middle of the strings, although in the late 80s/early 90s the neck pickup was deliberately made hotter too - it's still useful to fine-tune the relative volume of the neck pickup.

I find it even more useful if you put a treble-pass cap across it as well, which stops it muddying the neck pickup as it has a tendency to do. The best value seems to be in the .001uF-.0022uF range. (.0018 seems a particularly perfect value on mine.)

If you don't want to go to any of that trouble and just want to use your Rick like a typical 2-vol/2-tone guitar, turn the 5th knob all the way down.

Voxman

I know I'm probably being thick here but isn't that what I said?

GavRichList

It's so you can blend between "disappointing" and a "lack of versatility"

Bogwhoppit

Voxman said:

I know I'm probably being thick here but isn't that what I said?

No, you said it was for controlling the fret distance from the fingerboard.

ICBM

Voxman said:

I know I'm probably being thick here but isn't that what I said?

Not really… since it's not a blend and it does not mix . It simply fine-tunes the level of the neck pickup.

If you're using a Rick with the stereo outputs it's much easier to work it out - there is no setting which blends either pickup into the other one, it just controls the relative level of the neck pickup side to the bridge, which remains fixed.

GavHaus said:

It's so you can blend between "disappointing" and a "lack of versatility"

lol

But not remotely true . My 381 is one of the best and most versatile guitars I've ever owned.

GavRichList

The two Rics I had were distinctly meh. Not awful, but not worth a grand a piece either. Had a 330 and a 610. Like the way they look, wanted to love them, but both distinctly beigeglo.

ICBM

I must admit I'm not a huge fan of either of those - partly because I do like the stereo wiring, and actually find it useful, unlike most people! And (with apologies to other Rick enthusiasts) I find they can feel a bit bland as well. The 360, 620, 660 and 381 don't though - I'm not really sure why since they're not far off the same guitars but just a bit more fancy. It's not the shapes because I like the 360WB which is basically the same as a 330.

TonyR

GavHaus said:

It's so you can blend between "disappointing" and a "lack of versatility"

ICBM said:

I must admit I'm not a huge fan of either of those - partly because I do like the stereo wiring, and actually find it useful, unlike most people! And (with apologies to other Rick enthusiasts) I find they can feel a bit bland as well. The 360, 620, 660 and 381 don't though - I'm not really sure why since they're not far off the same guitars but just a bit more fancy. It's not the shapes because I like the 360WB which is basically the same as a 330.

My main guitar of choice until a few years ago (when I bought a Strat) was a Rickenbacker. Out of the four Rickies I own (1998PT, 330, 381/12 and a 620/12) I find the 620 the worst and the 381 by far the nicest to play, the 1998PT is also lovely to play but the 381 just beats it. I used to love the 330 and it's still a cracking guitar, these days I don't find it as comfortable to play as I used to. 

I'd say that Rickies are maybe not as versatile perhaps as a Strat, Tele or SG as they have a particular "Rickenbacker" sound but I wouldn't describe them as "bland"

As for the original question about the fifth knob, I can say in over 25 years of owning Rickenbackers it's a feature I have made very little used of!

ICBM said:

My 381 is one of the best and most versatile guitars I've ever owned.

And my 381 is by far the heaviest!

pmg

My main guitar is a Ric 330 Mapleglo. It's my go to guitar and I find it to be extremely versatile. I use the 5th knob too.

UnclePsychosis

GavRichList said:

It's so you can blend between "disappointing" and a "lack of versatility"

Hey @GavRichList its funny what you find on the internet :-D

JerkMoans

UnclePsychosis said:

GavRichList said:

It's so you can blend between "disappointing" and a "lack of versatility"

Hey @GavRichList its funny what you find on the internet :-D

 

Funkfingers

Pwned!

GavRichList

HAHAHAHA! Well, 25 years have passed since I owned the other two. I was never massively enamoured with them, but now I am! What can I say eh?

skay

I have always used it to add fullness and warmth (by blending in/turning up the neck pickup) or adding bite and chime (by blending out/turning down the neck pickup) when the pickup selector is in the middle position, by turning this little 5th knob counterclockwise  or clockwise respectively on my 330.

At least that's what I thought I had been doing for the past 25 years of playing it....

JerkMoans

Rick newbie here: am loving the 5th knob. Best TOANZ I’ve found thus far are from the middle position with both pickups on, then using the ‘blend’ control to roll back on the neck a bit.

GavRichList

JerkMoans said:

Rick newbie here: am loving the 5th knob. Best TOANZ I’ve found thus far are from the middle position with both pickups on, then using the ‘blend’ control to roll back on the neck a bit.

Yep, that’s where I sit too. That, or on the bridge 

DarnWeight

JerkMoans said:

Rick newbie here: am loving the 5th knob. Best TOANZ I’ve found thus far are from the middle position with both pickups on, then using the ‘blend’ control to roll back on the neck a bit.

Yeah, rolling the "blend" back about a quarter of a turn seems to be the sweet spot for me.

prowla

It's just a 1-channel balance knob.

rze99

Long time Ric user here. 6 and 12. 

I use both pickups with everything up full for the most part. It just sounds Ric right to me. Also the bridge position and the volume of the neck Entirely off so that I can use the selector switch to make those rapid kill switch staccatos a al Townshend / Weller Great fun especially with feedback.  

To me the Ric only sounds right with a bunch of compression and a slight top boost. 

I recently did track with mostly my Ric 330 pretty much all both pickups all knobs up full.  

https://youtu.be/gOUXBQ2XjFY