Transcription Help Please

bingefeller

Hopefully someone can help me here (maybe @Grunfeld..)

I'm working on the Winger song Your Great Escape.  I think the song is tuned down a whole step (or could be dropped D), but I put the mp3 into Transcribe an bring the pitch up two semitones to make it into standard tuning.  

I have worked out the verse riff and it's basically a D5 sliding up to E5 power chord riff with palm mutes on the low E.  It then does to a G5 sliding up to A5 with palm mutes on the A string.  The G5 shape is played at the 5th fret D string / 7th fret G string and 8th fret B string and you move this shape up two frets for the A5 shape.  

So it's the chorus.  There is what I have tabbed out for the first part:

After this I am stuck and would like some help from someone more experienced..  My timing on the tablature probably isn't 100% accurate but when I play along with the song I can get it by feel.  The tempo is wrong too (I made this tab quickly just).  

Here is the mp3 clip of the chorus.

If you put this into transcribe and turn on the "out of phase" it completely removes the vocals (most of the songs on this album are mixed like this so it makes transcribing the guitar a bit easier so it does).

Here's the tab file.

Grunfeld

Dude.... Winger.... like.... I'm just saying..... Winger......  okay don't tell no one I listened to it.....

Absolutely no transcriber btw.... not when people like Ade Clark can transcribe the proverbial car crash and, for the record, I lost a bet to my 9 year old son at the time who said a bit of The Ramones "Rockaway Beach" was in 5/4 and I went "pshaww it's the Ramones, duh... 4/4 all the way."   And Ade said, "5/4 actually".

Okay.  I don't get the need to drop it a tone.  I was trying to get a clue from the harmonics but nothing convinced me.  [I could be wrong] but I think standard tuning works.  If I were playing this I'd go for standard.

I'm hearing a chorus progression like this:

Fm  Ab  Bbm  Db  Eb   [the minor chords aren't played, they're done as power chords, but the lick over them follows that minor sound in those spots]

The lick seems to follow down an Fm chord played at the 8th.  Mostly on the B and G strings. 
8 & 9 on the B
8 & 10 on the G
8& 10 on the D

that's the "box"

The ending of the lick is D and G strings, 8 and 10th fret [i.e. bar 4 of the chorus]

The chorus has a lot of pushes in it, that's probably what's throwing your timing.  It's just Winger being clever.  They'd probably been listening to Thin Lizzy that day.  The kick drum and the timing come in early, before the "1".

I've no idea if that helps but I can play the lick and it sounds very similar played like that.

bingefeller

Cheers @Grunfeld.  I don't have my guitar but I will try it out tomorrow.   

I watched a vid of Winger playing live and I moved the pre-chorus bit up to the 12th fret as that's where Reb Beach seems to play it.  Same notes, just different position.  Seems to blend in with the recording a bit better.  

Adrian's transcriptions are ridiculously good.  I've asked him to do some pretty tricky stuff, like Chris Poland solos, and he's nailed it.  Wish I had his skills.   

Grunfeld

bingefeller said:

I watched a vid of Winger playing live...

Good call, the chorus lick seems to be played higher up the neck.  Crappy vid that I watched though and on just the one viewing, and the multiple cuts.... labour of love. 

btw I think i got the last chord of the chorus wrong?  after seeing the vid it doesn't look right.

thomasross20

Where did you get that cool tab paper? Assume you had to put the rhythms/beats in yourself

bingefeller

thomasross20 said:

Where did you get that cool tab paper? Assume you had to put the rhythms/beats in yourself

I just tabbed the notes out on Guitar Pro Lite - the tab staff is part of the program.

http://www.guitar-pro.com/en/index.php?pg=lite-bundle-licence-generator&distributor=iguitar

DLM

I'll always Wow! for Winger, I love that band... But I had to LOL Oli's post! I don't know that album very well 'cause it was the last one I got, and I certainly can't play any of it.

Sambostar

Fills

E---

B-------10-(17H)------12(H)...............10-8

G-----9-(17H)------12(H).......................------9

D--10-(17H)----12(H)...............................-------10

A

E

Chorus:

To play the riff barre the 10th fret but experiment with two tone doublestop chords and pull offs like 15th fret(D+G) to 15D-14G etc. and up pick to make things sound better, like Nothing but a Good time by Poison etc. Generally D and G strings sound juiciest.

E---------Up-Up-------Up-----------------------Up--Up-------Up-----------------------------Wide Vib and drop the barre position---

B--------11-11-p-10-----------------------------11-11-p-10

G--10--10-10---(10)-12-10-12-14-10------10-10---(10)-12-10--12-10-10-10------OR---12-10--9-10

D--10-------------------10-10-10-10-10-----------------------10-10--10-10-14-10------OR---10--10-10-10

A---Barre

E

His voice interferes with the frequency of the second minor bit, but here goes

E---

B--

G--13-13-12-(12)-12-(12)------------------------Barre 13th fret

D--15-15-(13)-(13)-13-(13)-13-(13)-15-------15-15-p-13--------13-(13)--8-8-10-/10

A-----------------15--------15--15--15--16--------16-16-p-13--13--13--13---10---12-/-8

E

Sounds a bit waffly, probably all the second minor part is played in the 8th position.

E--

B--Barre 8th fret------------------------------------------------

G--10-10-p-8-8-8-----------------------------------------------10-10--8------------8

D--11-11-p-8-8-8-8--8--8--10-----/8--10-------------------11-11-(11)-11-10---11-10-8

A------------------------10------12-----/6--8---------------------------------------------------11-10-6...that all do you'll have to figure it

E

That is from memory, I play it in my head then find the double stops that sound right and do it that way so it is probably very wrong. But if you hear the chord sounds maybe you can figure it more accurately.  It'll do for down the pub though eh.

Generally with hair metal, if it sounds bright and static, it's doublestops on the D and G strings up the neck from a barre played with an up pick.  If it sounds sleazer with vibrato you change to a three finger bluesy technique to play them ones.  Experiment with loads of doublestops, minor, major etc. going up and down the neck on the D and G strings and see how they sound.  Bare in mind it is probably overlaid with a second guitar playing a wide vib three finger technique or single notes like GN'R riffs were done.

I think that is the bare bones of it, experiment till you get it right.  Hope that ain't the bit you transcribed.

That song reminds me of...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z8f2mW1GFSI

)

Sambostar

And FFS. If you are going to listen to hairmetal, listen to some good stuff.

Sambostar

There are a few pedal tones in there on the chorus as you see, you can start out really loose JImi chord/riff style and then tighten it up, in fact probably best to do it that way, start loose and get the rhythm and pedal tone, than reading the tab note for note, that way you can bring some other chord notes and mutes into it.

Sambostar

@bingefeller, did you try that TAB, or did it not work out for you?  Just the hijacking egotist in me wanting to know if I still have it, or have become completely tone deaf.  Even of the TAB attempt is completely wrong, you know it took me two days to get that fooking song out of my head.  It is completely shit.

I plugged in the guitar and actually it sounds pretty crap, but it's great unplugged, if that's any help.

But can't you be learning Ratt or Dokken something? 

bingefeller

Sambostar said:

@bingefeller, did you try that TAB, or did it not work out for you?  Just the hijacking egotist in me wanting to know if I still have it, or have become completely tone deaf.  Even of the TAB attempt is completely wrong, you know it took me two days to get that fooking song out of my head.  It is completely shit.

I plugged in the guitar and actually it sounds pretty crap, but it's great unplugged, if that's any help.

But can't you be learning Ratt or Dokken something? 

Hi there, 

Sorry it took so long to get back to you.  The first bit sounds spot on but not sure about the second bit.  There are two guitars playing and it's hard to try and arrange something that covers all bases.  

Speaking of Ratt I do have a Ratt tune I'm working on:

The lyrics are some of the worst I've heard for a song that came out in the last 5 years but it has some cool guitar playing.  

I don't have anything tabbed out yet though.  I've got the into down - the tab here is decent.

http://tabs.ultimate-guitar.com/r/ratt/best_of_me_intro_tab.htm

I'm working on the verse right now...

PS.  What about some Reb Beach era Dokken...

Sambostar

Arr, but have you got the fast run to 'I'm insane' dialled in yet?

Warren Demartini is ace ain't he, so is Lynch.  Don't listen to Dokken after Lynch left, it just gets samey, not to dis Reb Beach.  But Lynch is a Wildman, always reaching for tones and notes that he can barely nail.  Demartini is king of the honky semi tone bends and funny sequences too.  Reb Beach is just another professional guitar player to me, although I'm fairly biased, sometimes the musician worldliness just tames it down too much.

Lynch is like a coiled spring with his downpicks and I love the amps.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0FYB__MCKkI

Sambostar

Sorry, I was trying to lure you into a conversation about hair metal.

bingefeller

@Sambostar I haven't tried playing that fast run in I'm Insane yet but it looks and sounds pretty difficult.  It would make a good picking exercise.  

I think one of Warren's best solos is on this track:

Sambostar

OK..single notes then...

E

B

G-slide-12-12--------12------------------------slide-10-10-8---8-------8-10

D-slide-15-----15-----------13----13-15------slide-11-------8---8-----8-10

A---------------------15-----------15----16------------------------------10-10-8

E

I am the King of the interweb....

Sambostar

I'm insane solo is easy, it's the same muscle memory lick moved up the board, but what is really difficult in the first place is learning that muscle memory lick as it took me an age to remember or train myself to leave the hammer on..on, as you naturally want to put an extra note in there with a pull off which sounds OK fast, until the extra notes accumulate and you run out of bars.  That is the genius of Demartini.  He does odd stuff, because he likes challenging himself.  Mind, we are only talking hair metal genres here.

Sambostar

I'm insane run BTW, more or less.

E---------5-7)-8-5-7---5-7--11-8-10---8-10--13-10-12----10-12--15-12-14----12-14--17-14-15----14-15--19-16-18----16-18--20-17-19---

B-(5-7-8--------------8-----------------12--------------------14-----------------------16----------------------17-----------------------20-----------------------

E-----17-19--20-17

B--20-----------------17

G--------------------------17

OK, I'II stop stalking you now.

I am the King of virtual internet guitar hero'ing as no one knows I am really crap!

bingefeller

Cheers, @Sambostar.  

I have some tabs for that I'm insane run:

^That's from a Japanese book.

^That's from a very old Hal Leonard book.    Both transcriptions are quite different but I would probably mash them together and come up with my own simplifiedish arrangement.

We should start a hair metal thread......

Sambostar

Cool.  I can get the right notes now.  Got any more Ratt?  You're in Trouble solo?

I always find I do a few semi tone bends and lynchy slides, reach a long way on the fretboard and bodge it with my vocabulary and it sounds Demartini-esque anyway.

Still I should learn things properly I guess, see if I learn more or get a bit better I suppose.

Sambostar

I'm totally lost on that tab, especially the second version...maybe for a rainy day.

I'm gonna look at some Ratt videos and see what the man does.