the R8/R9 - pardon my ignorance but...

TheOtherDennis

...what are they, exactly, and how do they differ from a regular Lester (if such a thing exists)?

Genuinely ignorant on this - I did a search and couldn't get a straight answer, so if one of you could be so kind as to elucidate, I'd be dead grateful, ta.

koss59

They are meant to be as close as Gibson can get to a real 58 or 59 Les Paul. On average they are loads better than a Les Paul standard but not always the case. There are lots of differences to the build both in construction and quality. You better get doing some reading!

newi123

The thing I can never work out is why the 59s are so much more than the 58s - is there a build difference, or just marketing? 

Gassage

58 necks are bigger. Snd they save the better tops for r9's

Personally, I prefer the feel of R0's but they all look awful due to the old clownburst

crunchman

As Gassage said, the R8 neck is bigger than the R9.  R9s get the fancy flame maple tops.  If you want a small neck the the R0 is an option.

I think there are two main differences with the regular factory guitars.

The first is that they are not weight relieved.  Getting lightweight mahogany that makes a body as thick as a Les Paul's a bearable weight is not easy.  They save the good stuff for the Custom Shop guitars, and make holes in the body on the factory ones to make them lighter.  If you want a genuinely solid body LP that doesn't weigh a tonne then you need to go Custom Shop.

The other difference is the neck tenon.  The Custom Shop guitars have historically had a longer neck tenon like the original 50's guitars had.  The factory guitars have a shorter neck tenon.  Opinion differs wildly as to how much difference this makes.  Some will say that the long tenon guitars sound a lot better, others argue that it is snake oil and it doesn't make any difference.

Apart from those two, I think the main differences are cosmetic.  They may have different pickups, but you can swap those if you need to.

p90fool

Les Paul Traditionals are no longer weight-relieved either, it's a myth that you have to buy an Historic to avoid weight relief.

Gassage

crunchman said:

As Gassage said, the R8 neck is bigger than the R9.  R9s get the fancy flame maple tops.  If you want a small neck the the R0 is an option.

I think there are two main differences with the regular factory guitars.

The first is that they are not weight relieved.  Getting lightweight mahogany that makes a body as thick as a Les Paul's a bearable weight is not easy.  They save the good stuff for the Custom Shop guitars, and make holes in the body on the factory ones to make them lighter.  If you want a genuinely solid body LP that doesn't weigh a tonne then you need to go Custom Shop.

The other difference is the neck tenon.  The Custom Shop guitars have historically had a longer neck tenon like the original 50's guitars had.  The factory guitars have a shorter neck tenon.  Opinion differs wildly as to how much difference this makes.  Some will say that the long tenon guitars sound a lot better, others argue that it is snake oil and it doesn't make any difference.

Apart from those two, I think the main differences are cosmetic.  They may have different pickups, but you can swap those if you need to.

I am so happy as I got the best R9 ever off @cbellanga - it's 8lb 4oz, braz board and sings.

rsvmark

Pups are unique to historics, and in 2013 they made a few changes to finishes and truss rod but pure cork sniffery imho.

I tried a R8 expecting to hate it due to neck size and it's not as big as I expected. My other guitars are a Charvel, American std and a Yamaha acoustic so I am very used to slimmer necks.

In my browsing I think R8's are most common, followed by R9's then R7's and I've not seen an R0 new or second hand yet. There are a few reissue customs around too that look mighty fine but it's a personal choice. There are a few chambered ones around (serial numbers start with RC iirc) but I have no idea how they sound. There may be R6's with P90's but I am no expert. Someone will be along shortly who knows a shed load more than me, but search this forum and there are quite a few threads where you can pick up knowledge.

General consensus appears to be that you should try before you buy but everyone I have heard or played sounds wonderful.,... And I am still saving hard.

TheOtherDennis

So the actual answer is that the R stands for reissue and the 8 or 9 is the year - so an R8 is just shorthand for Reissue 1958, and R9 means Reissue 59?

See, that's why I was confused. I'd searched for a Gibson R8 and R9 and could only find stuff from people who knew what they were talking about, talking to other people who knew what they were talking about.

However, when I search for 58, bingo, answers came there by the bucketload.

I am now educated. No chance whatsoever of one finding itself in my hands (waaaay outside my budgets, and I'd have a 335 before I'd have a lester), but at least I know what one is now.

Thank you for that.

thomasross20

I tried an r8 and slash custom today in Hong Kong. They've definitely got their own sound but they're just not the guitars for me, playability-wise

Forge

R series benefit from the best woods, one piece backs, long tenon, thin neck binding and a whole lot more attention to details. They are made in a different workshop. Are they worth the extra? Not sure when you can get 95% of the same guitar with a Standard but like everything else it is those extra 5% that cost a lot more to achieve. These best deals in the lineup are the R6 and R7 models.

p90fool

Forge;643578" said:

R series benefit from the best woods.

I've never, in all of the Historic vs Standard arguments online, ever seen this quantified, justified or explained, other than "it's a grand more so it must be better wood innit".

There's obviously a selection process based on the cosmetic figuring of the maple cap but nowhere except in the minds of people who paid the extra grand is there any belief that the wood used on Historics somehow makes a better Les Paul than a Standard or Traditional.

Forge

p90fool;643613" said:

[quote="Forge;643578"]R series benefit from the best woods.

I've never, in all of the Historic vs Standard arguments online, ever seen this quantified, justified or explained, other than "it's a grand more so it must be better wood innit".

There's obviously a selection process based on the cosmetic figuring of the maple cap but nowhere except in the minds of people who paid the extra grand is there any belief that the wood used on Historics somehow makes a better Les Paul than a Standard or Traditional.

[/quote]

One piece backs, better figures and lighter too. I had a few Standards before switching to my R6.

CloudNine

p90fool said:

Forge;643578" said:

R series benefit from the best woods.

I've never, in all of the Historic vs Standard arguments online, ever seen this quantified, justified or explained, other than "it's a grand more so it must be better wood innit".

There's obviously a selection process based on the cosmetic figuring of the maple cap but nowhere except in the minds of people who paid the extra grand is there any belief that the wood used on Historics somehow makes a better Les Paul than a Standard or Traditional.

No idea whether the wood is better or not, but as mentioned it is definitely lighter on average. I recently got an R9 which is 8.2lbs. I don't like any guitars much over 8lbs really, so getting one at this weight is the only way I will own an LP. Reckon I would be hunting a long time to find a standard at that weight.

Evilmags

The Historic are better quality controlled, use better wood and have a long tenon neck join. The long tenon argument can be summed up as "There is a lot more wood to wood contact. The actual machining of the wood can fucking up a lot more work a long tenon and still not screw up the guitar". If you play Jazz on 13-56 strings a long tenon is probably a good idea...

Forge

Evilmags said:

If you play Jazz on 13-56 strings a long tenon is probably a good idea...

I don't think people are that evil on this forum...

Chalky

I thought an R8 was a Gibson Les Paul 1958 Reissue, as in this one...

http://www.ginoguitars.com/en/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=601&gclid=Cj0KEQjwyoCrBRCl-aa97pKX_t8BEiQAbrs_9NvOop3RwSAFlr-bY-y9X84l14ly3qFt-2gu_0OhgFwaAhUn8P8HAQ&zenid=0b8rbe27f6u3k3t5319l4nrrc3

Philly_Q

TheOtherDennis said:

So the actual answer is that the R stands for reissue and the 8 or 9 is the year - so an R8 is just shorthand for Reissue 1958, and R9 means Reissue 59?

Yes.  Gibson actually calls those models the 1958 Les Paul Standard Reissue and im1959 Les Paul Standard Reissue.

The important distinction is that when people talk about "R" series guitars they're always referring to the Historic range built by the Gibson Custom Shop.  As opposed to the cheaper production models - Les Paul Traditional, Les Paul Studio etc - built by Gibson USA.

 

Hootsmon

I researched this for YEARS.......I was curious about all that was said about the HISTORICS, by the fans I might add.

after a while I could not help myself any longer and bought one ,untried ,from the net.....

I have been a life long LP player and the moment I sat down with my new guitar I knew immediately that it was indeed a step up in class from the regular LP.....night and day TBH. can't go back.

my own feeling is it's the HISTORIC bridge to body design coupled with the long neck tenon /solid body/better woods....nothing to do with the dyes