Drummers anonymous.

andy1839

I just bought a (v.v.v cheap) set of drums from gumtree last week, always wanted to have a go, after my last drummer related band disappointment I decided I'd actually have a go. Had my first lesson too, seemed to be going along alright, YouTube has a load of starter stuff but any pointers are gratefully appreciated as to how to progress.

I can see the gas branching into drums too! eeek!

blobb

Don't underestimate how important it is to hold the sticks properly!

You are trying to make the whole process easy, not hard work. Relax into it. Don't worry too much about fundamentals, Bossa Novas and Clavs at the start.

Keep a good simple groove and learn to move accents ONE-2-3-4, 2-TWO-3-4, 3-2-THREE-4, 4-2-3-FOUR. Do this with L stick on snare; R stick on snare; R foot on bass; L foot on HH. Then sequence L/R/Bass/H but still moving the accent - you get the idea. This builds technique and muscle memory before you get lost on complex patterns.

My missus took some lessons and to be honest, she spent so much time trying to perfect the pattern she had been given that she lost sight of playing the damn things. "oh no I need to stop, I got it wrong". I got her to hold the sticks properly, sit properly and move accents and there was no stopping her.

....... practice as much as you can.

octatonic

andy1839 said:

I just bought a (v.v.v cheap) set of drums from gumtree last week, always wanted to have a go, after my last drummer related band disappointment I decided I'd actually have a go. Had my first lesson too, seemed to be going along alright, YouTube has a load of starter stuff but any pointers are gratefully appreciated as to how to progress.

I can see the gas branching into drums too! eeek!

You are going to love it.

Finding a good great drum teacher has made all the difference to my drumming.

I've improved tenfold in the last 2 months- part of it is how/how much I practice but a significant portion of it being told the next crucial, critical steps to take.

I would have spent years trying to do this by myself.

As to buying gear- yeah it is like crack.

Snare collection is growing- cymbals are like guitar pedals.

PolarityMan

blobb said:

Don't underestimate how important it is to hold the sticks properly!

You are trying to make the whole process easy, not hard work. Relax into it. Don't worry too much about fundamentals, Bossa Novas and Clavs at the start.

Keep a good simple groove and learn to move accents ONE-2-3-4, 2-TWO-3-4, 3-2-THREE-4, 4-2-3-FOUR. Do this with L stick on snare; R stick on snare; R foot on bass; L foot on HH. Then sequence L/R/Bass/H but still moving the accent - you get the idea. This builds technique and muscle memory before you get lost on complex patterns.

My missus took some lessons and to be honest, she spent so much time trying to perfect the pattern she had been given that she lost sight of playing the damn things. "oh no I need to stop, I got it wrong". I got her to hold the sticks properly, sit properly and move accents and there was no stopping her.

....... practice as much as you can.

Oh yeah grip is definitely important, I used to cane through about 3 sticks a practice until I sorted that out and of course had terrible blisters.

andy1839

Couldn't help myself. Drum gas has started.

Just came home with a Roland TD-25K & all the accessories (headphones, throne, bass pedal, hi hat stand etc) as well as a new set of Remo Pinstripe heads and extra cymbal boom stand, five pairs of sticks & moon gel for my acoustic kit.

I went in for the Yamaha DTX582 but ended up with the better kit and a much better deal.

No affiliation but I have to say I was dealt with brilliantly by Gear4Music in York. It was like going into a real music store, not an Internet box shifter. Great service, loving the kit.

blobb

Vex it , then Superior. Once you get to Superior you will be amazed. (Other sample libraries are available ;-) )

andy1839

blobb said:

Vex it , then Superior. Once you get to Superior you will be amazed. (Other sample libraries are available ;-) )

Thems is just wordz that makes no senses!

Is that where you connect the kit to a laptop and use that rather than the module?

octatonic

blobb said:

Vex it , then Superior. Once you get to Superior you will be amazed. (Other sample libraries are available ;-) )

I don't get on with using a midi drum library for live playing.

I have Superior/BFD and various other drum libraries but the combination of midi latency and audio card latency means you get around 6-10ms. 

I monitor my playing with the TD30 internal sounds, they are great.

I use Superior and BFD for the next stages when recording though.

octatonic

andy1839 said:

blobb said:

Vex it , then Superior. Once you get to Superior you will be amazed. (Other sample libraries are available ;-) )

Thems is just wordz that makes no senses!

Is that where you connect the kit to a laptop and use that rather than the module?

That is what he means, yes.

'Vex' means the V expression expansions here: http://www.vexpressionsltd.com

andy1839

octatonic said:

andy1839 said:

blobb said:

Vex it , then Superior. Once you get to Superior you will be amazed. (Other sample libraries are available ;-) )

Thems is just wordz that makes no senses!

Is that where you connect the kit to a laptop and use that rather than the module?

That is what he means, yes.

'Vex' means the V expression expansions here: http://www.vexpressionsltd.com

Ah, cheers. It would appear I need to actually read the manual on this one then!

andy1839

octatonic said:

andy1839 said:

blobb said:

Vex it , then Superior. Once you get to Superior you will be amazed. (Other sample libraries are available ;-) )

Thems is just wordz that makes no senses!

Is that where you connect the kit to a laptop and use that rather than the module?

That is what he means, yes.

'Vex' means the V expression expansions here: http://www.vexpressionsltd.com

Ah, cheers. It would appear I need to actually read the manual on this one then!

octatonic

I dont know the TD25.

 I don't think I have ever read the TD30's manual- it is all pretty self explanatory.

blobb

Sorry, yes vexpressions. You know how you can tweak the kit parameters in the module? These guys know how to do it properly and sell their recreations of classic kits. First thing to do if you want to stay playing 'in the brain'. Benefit is you keep the excellent responsiveness of the ekit. MIDI sample libraries such as SD2 / BFD bypass the module sounds (they are still produced if you need them) and replace them with high quality samples of real kits, triggered on a computer. So you need to get latency down for the best effect. I run my kit through a midi interface and use SD through a pair of monitors at head height behind me. Although you lose a little responsiveness, the bleed through from having a real kit more than makes up for it. On stage, dunno. Not sure I would rely on a laptop in that situation. SD has a full mixer as well, so anything you record (as MIDI) you can remix afterwards. Just as if recorded in a real studio, in my case by an amateur drummer who should never be allowed in such a place!

snazza

just about to take my first Drum lesson tomorrow ...something I have wanted to do for ages ......but never got round too .......

I remember touring in the early 90s with a band called Confessor .......and watching behind this guys (Steve Shelton) kit every night  .....my jaw was on the floor  ....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_54BL0aOt5E

PC_Dave

@Octatonic, how loud are the mesh heads when you're banging away? Basically i'm moving house and my pre-requisite was a music room in a detached house, and of course we're moving into a terraced house with no spare room for music equipment. It does have a huge loft though, which is all boarded and lagged, so I was going to turn it into my Man Cave and get a TD25 or similar up there.

Just worried about the "acoustic" noise that would travel down/across.

Drew_TNBD

octatonic said:

blobb said:

Vex it , then Superior. Once you get to Superior you will be amazed. (Other sample libraries are available ;-) )

I don't get on with using a midi drum library for live playing.

I have Superior/BFD and various other drum libraries but the combination of midi latency and audio card latency means you get around 6-10ms. 

I monitor my playing with the TD30 internal sounds, they are great.

I use Superior and BFD for the next stages when recording though.

Brains that have midi via USB should be a bit faster than going through your audio-interface via regular midi cable.

If you run at a higher sample-rate and 32 buffer size, you should be able to get reasonable real-time performance. It's a bit of a delicate balancing act though, I grant you that.

What *tends* to work better is plugging your drum-pads directly into an interface and using something like Trigger or Addictive Trigger to turn the pulses into midi.

octatonic

PC_Dave said:

@Octatonic, how loud are the mesh heads when you're banging away? Basically i'm moving house and my pre-requisite was a music room in a detached house, and of course we're moving into a terraced house with no spare room for music equipment. It does have a huge loft though, which is all boarded and lagged, so I was going to turn it into my Man Cave and get a TD25 or similar up there.

Just worried about the "acoustic" noise that would travel down/across.

It travels.

The problem is the kick- it isn't as loud as a regular kick of sort but it is noticeable and up high it will travel through the floors.

When I am playing the electronic kit my wife can hear it on the bottom floor and in kitchen which is as far away as you get in the house.

Not enough to annoy (and she is pretty tolerant anyway) so I can play whenever.

In a terrace it will depend on the neighbours, I guess.

It is an old house without insulation though, so maybe you will have more luck.

bigjon

I played drums for a band at college, have done a few gigs since. I tend to sit in for a set on drums about 1 jam-night in 4 due to a shortage of specialist drummers. Last Sunday at the Jazz Jam I played drums about half the time. I thoroughly recommend the gig in Jazz Now on the BBC radio iPlayer with Julian Arguelles and the Frankfurt Radio Big Band, Steve Arguelles' drumming on the whole gig is amazing.

octatonic

Drew_fx said:

octatonic said:

blobb said:

Vex it , then Superior. Once you get to Superior you will be amazed. (Other sample libraries are available ;-) )

I don't get on with using a midi drum library for live playing.

I have Superior/BFD and various other drum libraries but the combination of midi latency and audio card latency means you get around 6-10ms. 

I monitor my playing with the TD30 internal sounds, they are great.

I use Superior and BFD for the next stages when recording though.

Brains that have midi via USB should be a bit faster than going through your audio-interface via regular midi cable.

If you run at a higher sample-rate and 32 buffer size, you should be able to get reasonable real-time performance. It's a bit of a delicate balancing act though, I grant you that.

What *tends* to work better is plugging your drum-pads directly into an interface and using something like Trigger or Addictive Trigger to turn the pulses into midi.

I just track with a 2 track mix into the drum brain and mute the Superior/BFD output.

I hear the mix with the near zero latency of the TD30 but it is recording as midi.

It works pretty good and I can always drag it about later.