I'd like to learn legato, properly(ish).

GuyBoden

Update: At last I seem to be making some small amount of progress with the "All Hammer" ascending and descending technique, but it's early days yet.......................

Branshen

Hi @GuyBoden! since we're both diving into this legato technique, I just wanted to mention something that might be useful to you. 

I noticed that I was doing all downstrokes when doing legato picking. this would be fine when ascending because it basically becomes a sweep, but it becomes more inefficient when descending because the right hand has to do one additional movement with each string change to reset itself. However, I think @viz does this too (based on his video on page 1) and it doesn't seem to stop him blazing through lines effortlessly. @viz would appreciate your thoughts on your technique!

@johncordy 's technique is I believe economy picking? which is a hybrid between alternate picking and sweep picking, depending on which one is more efficient for the line being played. When descending a scale, I see him sweeping. Please correct me if I'm wrong!

I'm trying to learn to sweep while descending a scale now, as I think there would be benefits in efficiency!

JohnCordy

@Branshen I don't know how I arrived at doing what I do, but yes I pick in the direction the line is moving - i.e. if it's descending through the strings, I'm downstroke, if it's ascending I'm upstroking. This is unconscious though

viz

Branshen said:

Hi @GuyBoden! since we're both diving into this legato technique, I just wanted to mention something that might be useful to you. 

I noticed that I was doing all downstrokes when doing legato picking. this would be fine when ascending because it basically becomes a sweep, but it becomes more inefficient when descending because the right hand has to do one additional movement with each string change to reset itself. However, I think @viz does this too (based on his video on page 1) and it doesn't seem to stop him blazing through lines effortlessly. @viz would appreciate your thoughts on your technique!

Hate watching myself play. That was a really unthinking noodle with no overall shape played very scrappily - I just had to record something and upload it for an online course - it was a one-take ‘wander’

As for technique I don’t really have any properly learned technique. My technique is that my brain is about 2 seconds in front of the song and I try and get my fingers to get ready to play what’s on my head in time. My left hand is reasonably fast, much faster than my right, and I never alternate-pick. 

With regards to my right hand I’ve never examined or worked on it. I think the one good thing is that it’s quite loose - I learned that from classical piano and violin and it’s totally instinctive, I never clam up. Looking back at that clip I think I rely 99% on hammer ons/offs and use the plectrum just to articulate notes I want to stand out. I can almost hear that better with my eyes shut than see it on the screen.

GuyBoden

Branshen said:

Hi @GuyBoden! since we're both diving into this legato technique, I just wanted to mention something that might be useful to you. 

I noticed that I was doing all downstrokes when doing legato picking. this would be fine when ascending because it basically becomes a sweep, but it becomes more inefficient when descending because the right hand has to do one additional movement with each string change to reset itself. However, I think @viz does this too (based on his video on page 1) and it doesn't seem to stop him blazing through lines effortlessly. @viz would appreciate your thoughts on your technique!

@Branshen ; I'm playing with 5 fingers for right hand picking, so I don't have any problem picking descending or ascending. It's getting the descending Hammer on notes to sound good is my problem, but I've made some progress. I've decided that the hammer on only technique, like Holdsworth, is too difficult and needs way too much gain/volume for my preferred guitar tone, so I'm doing Pull-offs.

@JohnCordy is superb at playing this style and guitar playing in general.

Branshen

@GuyBoden haha, I've also given up on the "all hammer ons" technique and am also using pull offs. I know it sounds different but I don't dislike the sound so I don't mind it. 

GuyBoden

I think my legato has slightly improved, so I'm pleased. Lots of patient practice, concentrating on the fine details, whilst playing slowly has helped most........

GuyBoden

Practicing daily with a metronome/drum beat and hitting every beat exactly has improved things a lot, especially descending. I start slowly at 40bmp.

Here's few new Tom Quayle videos.

Lazy first finger. (fretting hand)

Muting (picking hand)

Adji

I worked on all hammer-ons for the longest time. today, my legato technique is a mix of both all-hammers and hammer/pull.

Tom Quayle is definitely one of the sickest legato players at the moment.

DLM

I think there's also a lot to love about the aggressive snap of combining picking with pull-offs. All about contrast, innit?

GuyBoden

DLM said:

I think there's also a lot to love about the aggressive snap of combining picking with pull-offs. All about contrast, innit?

Depends on your preferences, there are really no rights and wrongs, I prefer Tim Miller's type of legato, you might not. Variety, choices, it's all good, makes an interesting world.

Branshen

Haven't been practicing legato for the past few months but just got back into it. This new vid by Jon is really good! 

Branshen

Half way through this but just had to share immediately! Really great lesson.  

Edit: just seen that @GuyBoden has already posted this. Doh! moving on to the next muting video by Tom..

Branshen

GuyBoden said:

Practicing daily with a metronome/drum beat and hitting every beat exactly has improved things a lot, especially descending. I start slowly at 40bmp.

Here's few new Tom Quayle videos.

Lazy first finger. (fretting hand)

Muting (picking hand)

WOWOW THAT PALM MUTING TECHNIQUE! I've heard it loads on Guthrie's Erotic Cakes, which I love, but never got my head around it.