Converting to baritone?

hobbio

Is it wise, or even possible, to convert a guitar to baritone without getting a conversion neck and increasing the scale length? I've got a couple of fender scale guitars I don't use much and I was thinking about setting one up with very heavy strings and tuning B-B, or even A-A.

Would I get anywhere near to the sound of a proper baritone with a 27" or so scale length if I did that to a 25.5" scale guitar?

guitarfishbay

Tuning B-B is fine on 25.5" guitars. You'll want a thick set of strings - daddario 12-60 would be a good start I think.

http://www.daddario.com/DADMobileProductDetail.Page?ActiveID=3757&productid=31

They won't feel as tight or sound as clear as a longer scale neck, but it should still intonate ok.

You will likely have to widen the nut slots for the thicker strings.

hobbio

I'm thinking about doing it to a Squier Strat I barely touch. I've got a bag of bone nuts and some fret files I've yet to use in anger, so all I need it strings.

guitarfishbay

For the low B on my strat I had to snip the intonation adjuster spring a little shorter, so I could get the saddle to go back further. After doing that the low B intonated fine.

FWIW I had to do the same to my bandmate's PRS SE with trem. Also intonates fine with a low B. He uses a .056, I use a .064.

hobbio

I've got spare springs too, so that should be fine. I'll give it a go once the strings get here and report back.

JookyChap

I've done it a few times and tuned A-A with no problems at all. The only real pain is making sure you can fit the low-e string into the tuner. Split Klusons are fine but no chance with Sperzels or a lot of others unless you want to remove some of the wrapping on the string

hobbio

Hmm, I'll double check that before I do anything else.

Sporky

I had my Ibanez RG tuned B-B on 13s about 20 years ago - it sounded lovely.

fretmeister

Or get a cheap one.

http://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/36643/for-sale-baritone-partscaster#latest

ICBM

I've done a couple of Telecasters, one B-B and the other A-A. They worked absolutely fine and sounded great. The B one I strung 13-65 and the A one 15-75, both using normal guitar strings for the top five and a cut-down double-ball-end bass string for the low string - the small ball (which goes at the head end on a bass) is the same size as a guitar one.

There is no significant difference in tension since five of the strings are more or less the same gauges and tunings as normal, just moved over one string position, so it will work even on a trem-equipped guitar - my A one was a Bigsby Tele.

As said the only slight problems are that the nut grooves will need to be widened and the low string may have to have the top winding layer unwound beyond the nut to fit into the tuner post.

hobbio

It is done. I've fitted a set of 12-60s and tuned B-B, and it sounds immense! Only trouble is that now I need to give the guitar that set up it's been waiting for seeing as how I'll be using it a lot. I haven't intonated it fully yet either as I'm waiting for the strings to bed in, but that shouldn't be much of an issue. I think the neck will need a shim though.

I had to ease the nut slots for the 3 thickest strings a little, but that was no bother. It does feel a bit looser than I'm used to (I play 10's on everything except my Shine which has 12's) so I'll have to learn to be a bit less heavy handed but that's no bad thing.

I love the sound on the neck pickup and on the 4th position particularly, it has real ringing quality in those positions that really floats my boat.

Thanks for the advice guys, with your help I've turned a guitar I never use into one I can't put down. Now I just need to get my head around the difference between the shapes and positions I'm playing and the actual notes and chords that are coming out of my amp.

ICBM

hobbio said:

It does feel a bit looser than I'm used to (I play 10's on everything except my Shine which has 12's) so I'll have to learn to be a bit less heavy handed but that's no bad thing.

Yes, it will be - 13s at B are equivalent to 10s at E... if you think about it the 13 is still the B . The 17 will be at F# rather than G, and the only other difference is the bottom string.

So you've essentially got a set of 9s, tension-wise. It's always puzzled me why the B in a set of 9s is usually an 11, when it should be a 12.

guitarfishbay

Most standard sets of 13s (with a plain 3rd) don't go thick enough for the lowest string IMO. But you can get singles online.

This site is useful for working out a gauge that will work for you - http://stringtensionpro.com

hobbio

Thanks for that. I'm struggling to get it set up properly now, the intonation and action height are just about there after shimming the neck and clipping the saddle spring but it's playing a bit sharp on the low B E and A when I fret notes. The relief feels ok and the nut doesn't look like it needs to come down but I suppose that's all that's left to look at. 

ICBM

guitarfishbay said:

Most standard sets of 13s (with a plain 3rd) don't go thick enough for the lowest string IMO. But you can get singles online.

All you really need to do is get a set of 10s, take out the top string (keep for your normal guitars) and put the bottom five on in the top five positions, and get a 60+ gauge string for the low B.

There's no difference in the tuning or tension - the E is still an E, the A still an A etc, apart from the G which is now an F# (a 17 is still fine).