Waves S1 uses

frank1985

Can Waves S1 be used for narrowing multiple stereo tracks to sit better in a mix, or is it intended to be used more as a widener on the master channel? I create ambient music, and my pedalboard is set up in stereo as the reverbs and delays sound better, but as you can imagine, having 3 or more tracks can get a little muddy. So instead of recording in mono, can i get the best of both worlds, with the flexibility of a narrower channel while perserving the benefits of stereo?

Winny_Pooh

With stereo tracks you can make them wider to fit better (the extra phase differences will make them smaller) or pan to mono. Generally its for mono elements and works well with keys and textural parts. Using it on the stereo bus is too extreme and results in an indistinct mix with worse phase coherence. 

Nerine

Can't you just use the pan controls on the stereo channel? That way it won't piss with your phase or anything like that.

octatonic

Nerine said:

Can't you just use the pan controls on the stereo channel? That way it won't piss with your phase or anything like that.

You can do things with S1 that are way more flexible than pan controls.

You do have to be careful with phase, but I rarely get into trouble with it.

octatonic

frank1985 said:

Can Waves S1 be used for narrowing multiple stereo tracks to sit better in a mix, or is it intended to be used more as a widener on the master channel? I create ambient music, and my pedalboard is set up in stereo as the reverbs and delays sound better, but as you can imagine, having 3 or more tracks can get a little muddy. So instead of recording in mono, can i get the best of both worlds, with the flexibility of a narrower channel while perserving the benefits of stereo?

It will widen or narrow, as you require.

You can do some interesting skewed mix positions as well, also it is great for taking things wider than conventional pan controls allow.

I use it all the time for narrowing stereo overheads, or keyboards.

I use it a lot- probably on every mix.

Nerine

octatonic;1094024" said:

Nerine said:

Can't you just use the pan controls on the stereo channel? That way it won't piss with your phase or anything like that.





You can do things with S1 that are way more flexible than pan controls.You do have to be careful with phase, but I rarely get into trouble with it.

Im aware of S1's capabilities. I have it too. But all I'm saying is it needs to be used with a bit of a deft touch, and with an understanding of what's actually happening when you use an imager.

If I had a stereo synth or something, I'd consider folding the low end down to mono with something like an imager, but as I very rarely mix or produce EDM, and basically produce, record and mix rock and metal daily, that only has synth and stuff as a textural/size element, I tend to filter the low crap and keep everything wide so it doesn't get in the way of my drums, bass and vocals.

As I say though, I never mix EDM so I guess widening and narrowing synth parts, when there's loads of them, is probably pretty useful.

As for overheads, I usually pan everything LCR. Lead bits and BV's etc are usually anywhere between depending on where I find the best balance without things sounding lopsided.

I think that width in a mix is just an illusion anyway. If you want a mix to sound wide, take all the centre elements down a dB or two and vice versa. My summing mixer has a stereo width control on it. I used to use it a bit until I discovered that it was messing with my low end and generally making things sound thinner than it should.

I tend to be fairly old school with my mixing. if I can't get the sound I want by only using panning, EQ, compression and level, then there's a fair chance the part is not recorded ideally or the wrong sound has been used. I don't like to wrestle with the raw tracks if I don't have to.

But anyway, I digress, and there's certainly more than one way to skin a cat, so, to the OP try whatever and see what works. Just be careful to check mono compatibility when using imagers or wideners. Less is probably more. Phase cancellation/problems will wreck a mix faster than pretty much anything else. And the kicker is, it may sound great in the mix room, but there's every chance that somewhere else, someone isn't hearing something as they should be because of (usually) an inferior playback system, or something that only produces mono or folds the stereo down to produce both the LR channels through one speaker.