Religion in School

Rocker

As I wrote earlier in this thread, it is parents who are responsible for bringing up their children. Parents too set the agenda about manners, customs, beliefs etc. Schools too have agendas. It makes no sense to send a child to a faith school and then complain that the child is being taught religion. It is not right either to expect the faith school to remove the child from the classroom when religion is being taught/practiced/discussed. It is up to the parents to decide what school to send their children to before they enroll. It is easier to become a parent than it is to become a parent who helps their child get a fair and balanced view of the world. This includes their choice of whether to believe in God or not. But to help them make that choice, they need to know both sides of the argument. Which usually means learning about religion in school.

Drew_TNBD

Religion is bollocks.

littlegreenman

Rocker said:

As I wrote earlier in this thread, it is parents who are responsible for bringing up their children. Parents too set the agenda about manners, customs, beliefs etc. Schools too have agendas. It makes no sense to send a child to a faith school and then complain that the child is being taught religion. It is not right either to expect the faith school to remove the child from the classroom when religion is being taught/practiced/discussed. It is up to the parents to decide what school to send their children to before they enroll. It is easier to become a parent than it is to become a parent who helps their child get a fair and balanced view of the world. This includes their choice of whether to believe in God or not. But to help them make that choice, they need to know both sides of the argument. Which usually means learning about religion in school.

Yes, but as per the OP who has sent their child to a non religious school, if you send your child to a secular school and they are then coming home with notions of a religious bias it would be natural to question where they are coming from surely? Other pupils or the school staff?

Either way I'd be asking questions if my kid came home from school with religious ideas whether it was "God made everything", "Om" or "Alluha Akbar".

Rocker said:

I believe that children should be taught the principles of the strongest religion in their country. Christianity in the case of UK residents.

Which version of Christianity are you advocating, I'd assume CofE in the UK? What about UK residents that are of other faiths? I would say that there is no place in the education system for religion at all, other than from an analytical perspective. And that should take place as part of studies at a much later stage than at 5 years old.

SteveRobinson

I bet that more people in UK attend mosques than attend church

Sambostar

p90fool

OP, stop worrying, he's only five. It could be a chance remark, a playground thing, or an out-of-context quote about what some people believe.

Even if it is an attempt at indoctrination by a rogue teacher it won't do any lasting damage. I'm sure by the time I was seven I'd figured out for myself that some teachers were just nutters, kids don't believe absolutely everything they're told by every adult.

p90fool

english_bob said:

 Smarter people than you have conceded that you can't win this argument.

Smart people know you can't win any argument with someone who's actions and opinions are guided by their invisible friend.

In fact I'd hesitate to call it an argument at all, it's more a carer/patient scenario.

BigLicks67

As far as I'm aware the brainwashing of children by various sects is a bad thing, so from that point of view there should be no religious 'education' in school. Teachers should stick to what they know, not what they think they know.

fretmeister

Rocker said:

As I wrote earlier in this thread, it is parents who are responsible for bringing up their children. Parents too set the agenda about manners, customs, beliefs etc. Schools too have agendas. It makes no sense to send a child to a faith school and then complain that the child is being taught religion. It is not right either to expect the faith school to remove the child from the classroom when religion is being taught/practiced/discussed. It is up to the parents to decide what school to send their children to before they enroll. It is easier to become a parent than it is to become a parent who helps their child get a fair and balanced view of the world. This includes their choice of whether to believe in God or not. But to help them make that choice, they need to know both sides of the argument. Which usually means learning about religion in school.

Unfortunately the way the catchment system works there is often no choice in regard to the school attended.

With our glorious leader announcing that she want's to allow more religious segregation and more faith based admissions / selection by schools it will only get worse. In some areas there simply won't be a secular choice.

Faith schools follow the concept of the jesuit mantra "give me the boy for 7 years and I'll give you the man" meaning that if there is strong inculcation for the first 7 years then that teaching is likely to stay forever even if demonstrably false.

english_bob

BigLicks67 said:

As far as I'm aware the brainwashing of children by various sects is a bad thing, so from that point of view there should be no religious 'education' in school. Teachers should stick to what they know, not what they think they know.

Calling anything teachers do "brainwashing" is insulting, and frankly fucking ridiculous. It's just an inflammatory way of saying "teaching things I don't agree with".

fields5069

english_bob said:

BigLicks67 said:

As far as I'm aware the brainwashing of children by various sects is a bad thing, so from that point of view there should be no religious 'education' in school. Teachers should stick to what they know, not what they think they know.

Calling anything teachers do "brainwashing" is insulting, and frankly fucking ridiculous. It's just an inflammatory way of saying "teaching things I don't agree with".

I wouldn't say that, I would say "teaching things which as far as we know aren't true".

I agree religion should be studied, after all we study fascism.

fields5069

I'm saying all this from the distressing position of agreeing to send my daughter to the local Catholic high school.

english_bob

p90fool said:

english_bob said:

 Smarter people than you have conceded that you can't win this argument.

Smart people know you can't win any argument with someone who's actions and opinions are guided by their invisible friend.

In fact I'd hesitate to call it an argument at all, it's more a carer/patient scenario.

Talking like this about people of faith is one of the few remaining acceptable forms of bigotry. Direct the sort of equally hateful and ignorant statements people have made in this thread about religious believers at any other group and the PC brigade would be calling for stonings in the street. 

Cue more name calling.

Sambostar

I went to a CofE primary school. The God stuff probably comes the traditional songs and hymns, after all, shock horror, we are a Christian country.  To be fair I didn't really believe it when I was 5 anyway and was too busy playing to really care, didn't go to church and wasn't christened so I wouldn't worry about it.  Was she Christened?  I wonder how many of you were, because that would be ironic

p90fool

english_bob said:

 calling for stonings in the street. 

Er, isn't that more your thing?

fretmeister

Sambostar said:

I went to a CofE primary school. The God stuff probably comes the traditional songs and hymns, after all, shock horror, we are a Christian country.  To be fair I didn't really believe it when I was 5 anyway and was too busy playing to really care, didn't go to church and wasn't christened so I wouldn't worry about it.  Was she Christened?  I wonder how many of you were, because that would be ironic

Why would it be ironic if someone was christened?

It's not like the child had a choice in the matter.

english_bob

p90fool said:

english_bob said:

 calling for stonings in the street. 

Er, isn't that more your thing?

Clearly you know as much about irony as you do about philosophy of religion

Sporky

english_bob said:

Talking like this about people of faith is one of the few remaining acceptable forms of bigotry. Direct the sort of equally hateful and ignorant statements people have made in this thread about religious believers at any other group and the PC brigade would be calling for stonings in the street. 

Is it OK to pick on "the PC brigade"? You're accusing them of incitement to violence

Traditionally, stoning to death is more of a religious thing after all.

fields5069

english_bob said:

p90fool said:

english_bob said:

 Smarter people than you have conceded that you can't win this argument.

Smart people know you can't win any argument with someone who's actions and opinions are guided by their invisible friend.

In fact I'd hesitate to call it an argument at all, it's more a carer/patient scenario.

Talking like this about people of faith is one of the few remaining acceptable forms of bigotry. Direct the sort of equally hateful and ignorant statements people have made in this thread about religious believers at any other group and the PC brigade would be calling for stonings in the street. 

Cue more name calling.

Hateful and arrogant statements are directed at non-believers, by believers. For instance, we are assured that we are going to hell. I can't think of anything MORE hateful.

english_bob

Sambostar said:

we are a Christian country.

I never understood what this was supposed to mean, and I think this thread amply demonstrates that we aren't.

Personally, I think the Church lost the right to any special influence on legislation, or on the nation's moral character a long time ago. Christians are a minority in this country, and should be considered alongside every other special interest group.