Noel Gallagher on Jazz

PolarityMan

Sorry guys I think I got all turned around on this jazz thing. I discovered something that really opened my mind and I think you guys should give it a chance too:

Veganic

Reverend said:

Fretwired said:

The great British jazz guitarist Derek Bailey .. I expect lots of lols, wows and wiz's if you don't like this .... ;-)

Spot the difference 

I really like the Derek Bailey one. Very rhythmic. Some dissonance but most of it seems to be played in some scale just not the minor pentatonic. Interesting arpeggios. 

It works like alot of "experimental" stuff works as it helps you question what music is. Not something you want to listen to everyday but if you give it serious attention it might make your favourite stuff sound different without changing it at all.  It may be different for others.  It is impossible to hear with someone else's ears and mine are very forgiving (ie not very good).

The other one lacked rhythm, obvious repetition and movement, and harmony.
Not 'nice.'

But the best thing about jazz is you can do it without a vocalist and stupid lyrics.  

siraxeman

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4P5raW49kQM

this is what we all admired of Derek back in the Music Radar days...and you can hear his influence everywhere - go to any music store on a Saturday morning..

oh and that Yngwie shreds vid - spot on! This clip ^^ is so much sweeter than the one posted earlier in the thread. Those lush harmonics and the emotional content in his melodies...its goosebump city all the way here. Oh and what about the tasteful use of monster licks and sweep picking @ 4:45 ?

siraxeman

do you ever wonder if underneath his straight face he's not hiding hysterical laughter underneath ? Or wonder perhaps if the audience are thinking he's on drugs ?

UnclePsychosis

I'd rather listen to a whole Derek Bailey gig than a single Dave Gilmour snoozefest solo. 

I quite like Noel Gallagher - more than I probably should - but it's pretty clear he doesn't know very much about jazz. Which is fair enough, rock stars are allowed to mouth off a bit, it keeps it entertaining (for the most part). 

siraxeman

I think Noel is tongue in cheek, half serious only. But I think that 90% of the population would agree with him. After all rock = 3 chords played to a million people and jazz is a million chords played to 3 people...

Col_Decker

Veganic said:

Reverend said:

Fretwired said:

The great British jazz guitarist Derek Bailey .. I expect lots of lols, wows and wiz's if you don't like this .... ;-)

Spot the difference 

I really like the Derek Bailey one. Very rhythmic. Some dissonance but most of it seems to be played in some scale just not the minor pentatonic. Interesting arpeggios. 

Pareidolia of the ears 


I hate music snobbery, if you like a tune - you like it. But this sucks. But then on the other hand he's made more money playing guitar than I have.

Emp_Fab

Megii said:

Why do people have to put down music they don't like? Noel Gallagher is doing it in the clip the OP posted, (humorously or otherwise) and plenty of others are waying in as well. It's not enough to say "it's not for me" or "just not my thing" - the offending music genre or artist must be put down and labelled as crap and not what music is supposed to be. Bollocks to that really.

Basically the same response I had to the 'Michael Macintyre, what a c**t' thread.

Some music I like, other music I don't.  I don't care what labels is has attached to it, I'm not interested in what people call it, the composer / artist is irrelevant to my enjoyment or otherwise and I don't judge them personally based on my enjoyment or otherwise of their work.

Veganic

Col_Decker said:

Veganic said:

Reverend said:

Fretwired said:

The great British jazz guitarist Derek Bailey .. I expect lots

I really like the Derek Bailey one. Very rhythmic. Some dissonance but most of it seems to be played in some scale just not the minor pentatonic. Interesting arpeggios. 

Pareidolia of the ears 


I hate music snobbery, if you like a tune - you like it. But this sucks. But then on the other hand he's made more money playing guitar than I have.

I think I am finding the patterns put there by Derek, they are definitely there. Maybe some of the enjoyment is that it makes your brain work harder to understand the patterns.  If I examine my emotional response it is a bit fight or flighty so not a comfortable listen, a bit like a trip to the dentist.

I don't think the comment of mine quoted stands alone. I enjoyed it as it enhanced the next thing I listened to.  

I can see how it "sucks" I just enjoyed its "suckiness" but couldn't do it for long.

BigLicks67

Jazz is a bit like when you first taste beer, it's horrible to start with and then you gradually learn to 'appreciate' it.

Blue in Green by Miles Davis/Bill Evans - Nice - if you don't appreciate this then you must be deaf.



I saw Oasis at Knebworth they were shit.

bingefeller

I wonder how Noel would feel about this:

TheOtherDennis

Megii said:

Fair play, and cheers for the reply - I wasn't particularly responding to you, it just happened that your previous post was in front of mine. And yes, I accept that NG is being deliberately inflammatory, as you point out (I quite like a bit of Oasis from time to time as it happens). For some reason I do like Derek Bailey's music, weird though that may seem to some. Not that I'd want to listen to it constantly, and I haven't seen the clip of him being snotty about other music forms, and I have to be a bit disappointed in him about that. I don't know about the other comments, but I'm happy to not take them too seriously, and I did say "bollocks" with a smile on my face.

I know you weren't having a go at me at all, so no worries there, I was simply responding to your general point, and several others have made it since.

As for Bailey, someone posted a vid on here once of him playing in front of a little circle of admiring students. He'd improvise for a bit, then chat, then improvise again, then chat, etc. In one of the chatty bits, he says something snarky and dismissive about gypsy jazz, and then proceeds to play (very badly) an impression of it, clearly showing his contempt for it and its fans.

In another chat part, he tells of when he was recording something, and in a down moment, he and his collaborator went for a wander of the studios. The owner had all sorts of iconic guitars on the walls, with descriptions of who'd played them in which sessions, which irked Bailey - he thought this was idolatry, so he and his pal took all the guitars off the walls and dumped them in a pile by the bins. He thought this was a glorious prank, but to me it's just vandalism. I don't care what you think of guitars or music or anything, you have no right to trash someone else's stuff just because he gives it a value you don't.

Any potential respect I had for him vanished right there.

TheOtherDennis

BigLicks67 said:

Jazz is a bit like when you first taste beer, it's horrible to start with and then you gradually learn to 'appreciate' it.

Blue in Green by Miles Davis/Bill Evans - Nice - if you don't appreciate this then you must be deaf.

I saw Oasis at Knebworth they were shit.

1) Nope. I have tried and tried and tried to like jazz over the course of the last 40 years and I still don't.

2) I must be deaf then.

3) That's just your opinion.

No, I'm not a fan of Oasis and I didn't see them at Knebworth, but those second two comments really aren't helping (unless my sarcasm detector is playing up).

BigLicks67

TheOtherDennis said:

BigLicks67 said:

Jazz is a bit like when you first taste beer, it's horrible to start with and then you gradually learn to 'appreciate' it.

Blue in Green by Miles Davis/Bill Evans - Nice - if you don't appreciate this then you must be deaf.

I saw Oasis at Knebworth they were shit.

1) Nope. I have tried and tried and tried to like jazz over the course of the last 40 years and I still don't.

2) I must be deaf then.

3) That's just your opinion.

No, I'm not a fan of Oasis and I didn't see them at Knebworth, but those second two comments really aren't helping (unless my sarcasm detector is playing up).

You are right about (3) it is just my opinion but I thought that was the whole point of a forum?

boogieman

siraxeman said:

do you ever wonder if underneath his straight face he's not hiding hysterical laughter underneath ? Or wonder perhaps if the audience are thinking he's on drugs ?

Nope, I reckon he's entirely serious about his art. Same as Tracey Emin or any other avant garde artist out there.  The fact that most people think it's nonsense is neither here nor there to them. And obviously there's enough people around who enjoy it to encourage them to keep them producing the stuff. 

Fwiw I can't stand Derek Bailey. To me his music is indulgent, meandering crap. I don't know if that makes me a musical philistine, but frankly I don't give a toss. I like jazz but that is just....shite.  

TheOtherDennis

BigLicks67 said:

TheOtherDennis said:

BigLicks67 said:

Jazz is a bit like when you first taste beer, it's horrible to start with and then you gradually learn to 'appreciate' it.

Blue in Green by Miles Davis/Bill Evans - Nice - if you don't appreciate this then you must be deaf.

I saw Oasis at Knebworth they were shit.

1) Nope. I have tried and tried and tried to like jazz over the course of the last 40 years and I still don't.

2) I must be deaf then.

3) That's just your opinion.

No, I'm not a fan of Oasis and I didn't see them at Knebworth, but those second two comments really aren't helping (unless my sarcasm detector is playing up).

You are right about (3) it is just my opinion but I thought that was the whole point of a forum?

It was more the way you expressed it than the opinion itself. It came across as "Fuck you if you disagree" which isn't really in the spirit.

Megii

Derek Bailey is no longer with us by the way - died in 2005. His ability to annoy people lingers on it would seem.  

TheOtherDennis

Reverend said:

Fretwired said:

The great British jazz guitarist Derek Bailey .. I expect lots of lols, wows and wiz's if you don't like this .... ;-)

Spot the difference 

It may be just me, but that Malmsteen vid sounds very much as if someone has dubbed over it to take the piss out him. There's something not adding up about the way the sound and visuals go together, and there's something I can't quite put my finger on about the mix. To me that's either dubbed or I'm having another "Whooosh!" moment.

Rave

TheOtherDennis said:

Reverend said:

Fretwired said:

The great British jazz guitarist Derek Bailey .. I expect lots of lols, wows and wiz's if you don't like this .... ;-)

Spot the difference 

It may be just me, but that Malmsteen vid sounds very much as if someone has dubbed over it to take the piss out him. There's something not adding up about the way the sound and visuals go together, and there's something I can't quite put my finger on about the mix. To me that's either dubbed or I'm having another "Whooosh!" moment.

REALLY!?

AliGorie

there's an awful lot of tins of ‘baked beens’ disappears from supermarket shelves every day in the uk, they would seem to be a big part of the national diet.