Info about Lupe hand built amps

surfguy13 · April 23

Just been looking at hand built clones of 50s Fender amps and stumbled across Lupe amps on Ebay of all places. I got in touch with Andy, the guy that builds the amps (I assume?), who is based in Rochester, Kent.

He does 2 or 3 50s clones including the Princeton and 5E3 Deluxe. Have to say they look extremely well made with great attention to detail. It was the Princeton I was enquiring about and having has three 50s Princetons over the years they really do look like the originals. Mind you, at £1500 they're not cheap.

Wondered if anyone has had a Lupe amp or knows anything about them?

RiftAmps · April 24

If it's this guy, his amplifiers don't appear to be particularly well-built, nor (in my opinion) meet the minimum safety requirements for a mains-powered appliance sold on the UK market.

As I've always said, if the amplifiers don't meet the regs then the builder either doesn't know what they are, or has deliberately chosen to ignore them. Both options scare me.

I would argue that these should not be sold on a commercial basis. Stay away.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/176098593212?itmmeta=01HW7XBHK4VFES83XSNWN8724H&hash=item29004b49bc:g:PJQAAOSwKABleJpv

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/176112912080?itmmeta=01HW7XPXWZHNPZ9JN39TRZ6JEP&hash=item290125c6d0:g:aI8AAOSwyullgH1o

surfguy13 · April 24

Many thanks @RiftAmps. ; It is indeed the guy I had contacted about his listings on Ebay.

I really appreciate the nod as I was definitely considering the possibility of buying one once a couple of things I have for sale are sold. It scares me too, because we all know just how dangerous amps can be.

I will indeed stay away and I should have really known given the fact that he's selling on Ebay. He didn't seem keen to speak on the phone either which I think most serious amp builders would be happy to do, certainly given the price point.

Thanks again!

Alex2678 · April 24

At that price point there’s no need to settle for a lesser build

LilBa2tard · April 24

Hi all

I build these amps

I have spoken to Chris from RiftAmps today, questioned his statement, which I found somewhat bizarre as he has only seen a couple of photos, and has never seen, played or handled any of my amps..

(funny he sells amps too , think what you will of this

Image: /plugins/EmojiExtender/emoji/fb/3.gif

Let me put the record straight , My amps are recreations of amps from a time gone, my aim is/was to keep as close to the original as possible, obviously without the sacrifice of safety, (no death caps, or two prong plugs lol ) my amps are built from choice components, and they sound amazing ... I'm happy to put my work on show, or if you wish, come and try one..

Original 50's fender amps are becoming harder to find, with a price tag to boot, and for most have all been re-capped / serviced/ new components , brought up to modern safety specs, with not much more than the original cab and chassis left... ... mine are the next best thing, and cheaper ...

Im happy take things a little further with re-stuffed Astron Minimite's caps, original 50's old stock power tubes, dummy/fake death cap fitted for looks , aged fixings , lightly relic'd tweed, I also make hand made marine canvas covers keeping to the original feel of the 50's.. .. but comes in a bit more expensive

Im happy to chat on the phone my number is <ADMIN: removed, PM if you want it> , if anyone would like to talk amps, or even guitars im more than happy ...

RockOn ...

nero1701 · April 25

LilBa2tard said:

Hi all

I build these amps

I have spoken to Chris from RiftAmps today, questioned his statement, which I found somewhat bizarre as he has only seen a couple of photos, and has never seen, played or handled any of my amps.. (funny he sells amps too , think what you will of this

Let me put the record straight , My amps are recreations of amps from a time gone, my aim is/was to keep as close to the original as possible, obviously without the sacrifice of safety, (no death caps, or two prong plugs lol ) my amps are built from choice components, and they sound amazing ... I'm happy to put my work on show, or if you wish, come and try one..

Original 50's fender amps are becoming harder to find, with a price tag to boot, and for most have all been re-capped / serviced/ new components , brought up to modern safety specs, with not much more than the original cab and chassis left... ... mine are the next best thing, and cheaper ...

Im happy take things a little further with re-stuffed Astron Minimite's caps, original 50's old stock power tubes, dummy/fake death cap fitted for looks , aged fixings , lightly relic'd tweed, I also make hand made marine canvas covers keeping to the original feel of the 50's.. .. but comes in a bit more expensive

Im happy to chat on the phone my number is <ADMIN: removed, PM if you want it> , if anyone would like to talk amps, or even guitars im more than happy ...

RockOn ...

I think you have skirted around the main points Chris has made.

Are you confirming that these amps are built to the following standard.

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2016/1101/contents

LilBa2tard · April 25

I haven't skirted around anything .. firstly yes any amp that I build adheres to the necessary conformity for electrical appliance here in the uk ..

additionally to this, I'm not a company or manufacture of amps, Im simply someone who likes to build the odd amp or two, sell a few on in-order to fund another build .. Im not pretending to be someone or something I'm not, this isn't my business neither is it my job, just a hobby, I dont have a website, or a company name, nor do I advertise ..

( if you know regulation you know) ..

Im not out to make a business out of building amp, nor looking for huge profits, just happy to cover my cost to move on to the next one..

Anyone is able to buy the same style amp albeit in a kit, you could buy one on the internet, and build it yourself, once done, you can sell it on, legally I might add .. have a look on reverb there is always a kit or two being sold on there .. Now could people build it to the same standard as me, does everyone know how,... this is the question ?..

Has Chris phoned / contacted every amp kit supplier in-order to check they are meeting all the necessary regulations ? has he searched the pages of reverb and shouted regulation at them , as there is always one or two kit built amps on there..

What has happened is this ...

This guy Chris from RiftAmps has seen a couple of amps that I have built, which look amazing to add, they are cheaper than anything he sells, and if he knows amps can see that they are loaded with premium components, Jensen custom speakers , Sozo caps , carbon comp resistors , everything at a premium, coupled together in a solid pine cab tweed lacquered, fitted with premium switchcraft jacks, CTS potentiometers, genuine fender fuse holders & switches, real leather handle, slightly relic'd , aged components + more..... all made on the dinning room table and cheaper than anything he makes and he has thought to himself Fu2k ..

Ive not heard/played any amps from RiftAmps , but what I can say is I have played with many expensive amps, Milkman, Fender, Marshall , Supro , Tone King .. . and my amps give them all a run for their money ..

Dodge · April 25

LilBa2tard said:

You could consider me as the Ian Elson of amps

FTFY.

digitalscream · April 25

LilBa2tard said:

Has Chris phoned / contacted every amp kit supplier in-order to check they are meeting all the necessary regulations ? has he searched the pages of reverb and shouted regulation at them , as there is always one or two kit built amps on there..

And yet, somehow, you still haven't answered the question. @RiftAmps is a respected builder on here, and has a long history of good knowledge, quality construction and good service; as such, he's built up a decent level of trust that he knows what he's talking about.

Will you confirm that these amps are built to all of the relevant UK safety standards, and if so, which ones?

Also, I've removed your phone number from your posts. We don't allow personal phone numbers in public posts here; if anyone wants to get in touch with you, they can send you a PM.

euan · April 25

Tbf a vague accusation should be replied with a vague confirmation.

PAL · April 25

I'd buy a Rift Dexter amp.

DrCornelius · April 25

To be fair to Mr Bastard (very Young Ones that), he is robustly defending what he does as a side hustle in response to a post from Chris. We all know Chris as a lovely bloke who not only knows his stuff but gives the knowledge on here freely - he is definitely one of the good guys.

In saying that, does there have to be a bad guy ? Maybe Andy (?) does meet the regs and is a very talented hobbyist who may also end up being a real asset to the Forum. We need to make him feel welcome enough to engage and give us more info

I guess what I'm saying is lets take the heat out of it, have a sensible conversation and not turn it into a black and white 'Forum good guys v outsider bad guy' thing

idiotwindow · April 25

I think it would be helpful if Chris @RiftAmps had stated what particular aspects of these amps did not meet minimum UK safety standards. He also stated that they do not "appear to be particularly well-built" which was also a pretty damning assessment of these amps. It would have been more informative if he explained why that was so because, looking at the photos on the eBay listing, the amps look quite neat and tidy (at least to my totally inexpert eye) and my assumption would therefore be that they were well built (at least built to Fender factory standards, if not Bartel levels of perfection).

digitalscream · April 25

DrCornelius said:

To be fair to Mr Bastard (very Young Ones that), he is robustly defending what he does as a side hustle in response to a post from Chris. We all know Chris as a lovely bloke who not only knows his stuff but gives the knowledge on here freely - he is definitely one of the good guys.

In saying that, does there have to be a bad guy ? Maybe Andy (?) does meet the regs and is a very talented hobbyist who may also end up being a real asset to the Forum. We need to make him feel welcome enough to engage and give us more info

I guess what I'm saying is lets take the heat out of it, have a sensible conversation and not turn it into a black and white 'Forum good guys v outsider bad guy' thing

That's fair - however, we're in a situation where somebody's building amps for profit and selling them for fairly large amounts of money (without warranty, by the looks of it). In buying such an amp, you'd expect it to meet the usual safety standards (not least because it's probably going to be gigged, and if the venue requires test certificates then it could prove a bit costly if it's not deemed safe).

For someone qualified and experienced enough to build these things, that should be an easy question - vague or not - to answer, surely?

idiotwindow · April 25

digitalscream said:

For someone qualified and experienced enough to build these things, that should be an easy question - vague or not - to answer, surely?

I thought he did answer the question. "I haven't skirted around anything .. firstly yes any amp that I build adheres to the necessary conformity for electrical appliance here in the uk .."

For those of us who are not experts, what aspects of these amps are thought to not meet UK safety regs? Is it that the original circuits being cloned, even with the death cap removed, are suspect in some way? If so, it really would be helpful to know what the problem might be.

idiotwindow · April 25

DrCornelius said:

We all know Chris as a lovely bloke who not only knows his stuff but gives the knowledge on here freely - he is definitely one of the good guys.

I don't think anyone doubts Chris's knowledge about amps and his willingness to share it but he has been evasive when asked a question about the liquidation of Rift Amplification Ltd. As you say, we need to be careful about taking sides and labelling people good guys and bad guys.

Boromedic · April 25

Lol, gotta love people.....

Especially at the above ^^ why should Chris have to share personal details about his business with anyone? He puts out what he is legally required to in the public domain, the rest is private as it is for every other UK Ltd Company. It's none of anybody's business outside of that.

Secondly, man builds high spec amps to a high level at the current UK regs and is highly regarded. Some of the regs incur costs, but he has to meet them to run his business. Folk can sell things that don't meet those regs and undercut others doing so, plus potentially put you at risk as a buyer. I know where my money would go. Why should Chris state in the public domain what the flaws are so the dubious folk can carry on, but without an understanding of the current regs they are still potentially just as dangerous.

The fact Chris is an active member here and offers free tech advice also shows the quality of the guy, conversely someone jumping into a forum/thread without any prior history here, and running off like a bull in a china shop shows me that my value judgement is correct, and I would just as sooner poop in my hands and clap than buy something from them.

Someone of class, would've quietly worked out what they're doing incorrectly and then sorted it out without fuss or fanfare.

Glad I'm sorted for amps, and my choice of tech

digitalscream · April 25

idiotwindow said:

digitalscream said:

For someone qualified and experienced enough to build these things, that should be an easy question - vague or not - to answer, surely?

I thought he did answer the question. "I haven't skirted around anything .. firstly yes any amp that I build adheres to the necessary conformity for electrical appliance here in the uk .."

For those of us who are not experts, what aspects of these amps are thought to not meet UK safety regs? Is it that the original circuits being cloned, even with the death cap removed, are suspect in some way? If so, it really would be helpful to know what the problem might be.

Excellent points, but...the robust defence is a list of the regulations they meet. Which, as I said, anybody who knew their products met these standards would be able to rattle off without a moment's thought.

As for the whole "cheaper" thing - sure, it's easy to make things cheaper when you're not providing service or warranty past "trust me bro", you have no facilities to maintain beyond your kitchen table (or, for that matter, liability insurance), and have zero claimed legal obligations past the point of sale. We've seen this time and time again from amateur guitar builders trying to become a facsimile of a real business - and the follow-up service from them is exactly what you'd expect.

In reality, from the information provided, Lupe's pricing should be regarded as equivalent to used prices, in which case...far from saying they're cheaper, they're actually more expensive.

Alex2678 · April 25

LilBa2tard said:

What has happened is this ...

This guy Chris from RiftAmps has seen a couple of amps that I have built, which look amazing to add, they are cheaper than anything he sells, and if he knows amps can see that they are loaded with premium components, Jensen custom speakers , Sozo caps , carbon comp resistors , everything at a premium, coupled together in a solid pine cab tweed lacquered, fitted with premium switchcraft jacks, CTS potentiometers, genuine fender fuse holders & switches, real leather handle, slightly relic'd , aged components + more..... all made on the dinning room table and cheaper than anything he makes and he has thought to himself Fu2k ..

It’s not as if he’s spontaneously attacked you, someone asked what people know about them and he’s had a look at some photos and commented.

I don’t think you can argue that your wiring/soldering is as beautiful as could be, and not as well done as other builders within the same price bracket you’ve placed yourself in. If you’re going to say that you’re only doing this as a hobby and not looking to make a profit etc, fair enough, I wouldn’t normally look to criticise someone who’s just doing it for fun, but you’re asking a lot of money there.
The idea that your amps are so beautifully made that Chris is panicking is a bit silly

idiotwindow · April 25

Boromedic said:

Lol, gotta love people.....

Especially at the above ^^ why should Chris have to share personal details about his business with anyone? He puts out what he is legally required to in the public domain, the rest is private as it is for every other UK Ltd Company. It's none of anybody's business outside of that.

He wasn't asked any personal details, just to confirm or clarify the information that is publicly available.

RiftAmps · April 25

I'm just catching up on this...

Firstly, I had a great chat with Andrew yesterday, explaining why I thought the amplifiers listed on eBay were not compliant. I also pressed the point that there is a difference between an amplifier for all intents and purposes 'safe', and one compliant for sale on the UK market. We discussed a few things he could do to improve. We were all there at some point, and it can be a minefield to work out how to navigate the rules.

Secondly, I'll openly admit that my comment "his amplifiers don't appear to be particularly well-built" was both uncalled for, and unhelpful. I apologized to him personally for that which he kindly accepted and we agreed to move on. The UK has a great cottage industry of small builders that should be celebrated. I will endeavour to do that more.

Thirdly, he is right, I have not seen his amplifiers in person so my judgement was based solely on the eBay listings, which might not be indicative of the current build standard that he offers. Again, that was not right.

Fourthly, I see many, many poorly built, non-complaint, and downright dangerous amplifiers come through the workshop for service/repair. I spend a vast amount of time each week ensuring that my own products meet all of the regs, not only for the UK but for ANY market in which I sell. I also strive to meet/exceed International Standards, such as IEC 62368-1. This is very time-consuming but something of which I am very proud. When I see an amplifier that doesn't conform, it greatly annoys me because if I have to put the time in, why doesn't everyone else? Unfortunately for Andrew, I took that out on him, he was just in my line of fire, and it wasn't personal.

I will, however, always continue to point out to consumers when I think a certain amplifier is unsafe, as I do when they bring something into the shop. I won't let something dangerous go unnoticed.

I hope this settles the matter, and that we can all move on. FWIW I think the brand name 'Lupe' is pretty great, surprised no one else has snagged that before.

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