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the thing that really matters is...
do not create music using theory unless there is a very specific reason to.. and even then, the ear must always have the final say..
However, the traditional theoretical language can be very clunky and there are often more shortcut ways of describing typical modern phrases. After all, modern music has carved deeper ruts in certain areas that classical didn't really explore (E7b10 anyone?) so there's bound to be new language popping up to help us familiarise ourselves with what's current.
I'm well aware that I'm one of the guiltiest in using western classical theory to describe pop and jazz! and I know it isn't ideal - but the problem is it's the only theory I know. I'm trying to broaden out because I know it's unhelpful to those who haven't followed the same path, and irritating to those who have managed to learn parallel paths, but it's difficult for me. Bear with me ...
Supportact said: [my style is] probably more an accumulation of limitations and bad habits than a 'style'.
I think it's okay to describe pop music in terms of classical music, that was the big twist in Richard Thompson's 1000 years of music ... Oops I did it again... was the same as a 13th century song he played earlier in the set - he segued straight into it and got a laugh.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V4WGsMplGxU
personally, I don't make a destinction between classical and contemporary theory.. there's simply no need
to me it's all just theory.. as music has evolved over the centuries, terminology etc has had to evolve and adapt to describe it.. so to me it's just one great big bundle of stuff.. and like all things academic there are some areas / topics that are highly specific, so it's not surprising that likewise there are elements in music that are highly specific to a period of time, musical genre or even a specific instrument.. but I don't think that there's one theory system for classical and another for pop / jazz.. to me theory is theory and it can describe it all.. it really makes no sense at to make 'us and them' type divisions.. it's all just music..
if someone is struggling to describe something they hear then either the theoritical 'thing' they're using to describe it is not appropriate, not fully understood... or the thing itself is simply a pain in the rear and open to ambiguous interpretations.. which absolutely does happen....
my big issue with the academic side of music is that folk take it far too seriously and far too absolutely.. music creation is an art not a science.. the theory behind it is not a religous doctrine.. it's simply a tool to aid us in understanding / describing what's going on..
I like to think of all theory as rhythm - there are no wrong notes only frequencies of use and preferred points in a bar to use them. At that point styles are the simply modalities and people can swap in an out of styles as they do bars - the cliché-ness, obscurity and authenticity of this is the balance of artistry, taste and familiarity.
One day in Teesside I woke up hearing what I thought was a Vietnamese person talking - I'd woken up mid-vowel and my frame was off. When the next person replied, I had a frame and recognised the pattern.
I really don't get the obsession with note selection - if I play Starwars with the wrong notes the chance is strong you'd get it... play the right notes in the wrong time I think it's less likely - I know it is I used to do just that in Sleep Walk by Johnny and Santo
and if you were a member of the orchestra playing the wrong notes with the right rhythmic patterns, the chance is that you'll get fired.. lol..
I am a veteran of playing wrong notes on occassion.. the principle issue though is that when playing them, in such a big place, to that many people, through such a big rig, cranked that high, mic'd into such a huge PA.. they seem to have so much more emphasis.. lmao
Point taken, but in an orchestra a big part is being orchestrated - a lot of the music is rather simple for an individual (in terms of written notation) for a (non-solo) instrument AND it's a relatively recent thing that the solos are not improvised.
I'm a massive Thelonious Monk fan and so much of his playing relies on wrong notes and jarring times, so I'm not best qualified to view some other forms of music. I like White Cliffs of Dover for it's dynamics, Flying In A Blue Dream for it's lyricism.
Someone once described instrumental rock to me as a middle-class adolescent thing - straight notes, straight time played as fast as possible, they simply never got moved by a piece of music. Originality and angularity was their thing.
I think it's a really hard thing to view such a personal thing, as music, as valid (let alone beautiful) in all it's forms - certainly for someone not exposed to all it's variety daily. I don't do that - I have the aural equivalent of comfort foods - I wish I could change that.
absolutely...
guys like Monk, King Crimson and Bartok are that "wrong" by design.. which means they can only be "right"
not sure I can agree with that thing someone once described to you though... seems a little narrow minded to me.. the thing is with instrumental rock, dance music, pop, total serialism, gamalan, country and so on.. is "whatever floats ya boat".. you just can't quantify taste.. one person may hear a piece of jazz as something beautiful, intelligent and skillfull, someone else may just hear a din and not understand it, another may just hear indulgant, smug bullshit, and another simply may not notice it at all.. the really funny thing though is that everyone's taste is more correct and more important than everyone else's.. lmao..
I agree about musical tastes - to of my inspirations are John Gregson and Adrian Clark - who both mix up their music incredibly.
I guess with that narrow view of music, I could see why they would think it.
I am only just beginning to understand metal, just starting to get the exuberance and expression