What 2x12

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dariusdarius Frets: 42
Ive got a Mesa black shadow 1x12 which sounds great and I have no need to change BUT my bandmate has had a 4x12 setup for a while now. Unmic'd gigs (most of them) have started to feel a bit unbalanced. 
So what 2x12 should I be looking at when I don't really want one. And def don't any a 4x12! And I know absolutely nothing about speakers other than they have magnets in em. 
Amp is EVH5150iii 50w. 

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  • markblagdonmarkblagdon Frets: 841
    Can I get the Mesa cab back then?  =)
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  • Phil_aka_PipPhil_aka_Pip Frets: 9321
    Thomann do an own-brand (Harley-Benton) 2x12 with Celestions in. I bought one and liked it but haven't used it a lot, however it does have a good reputation.
    "Working" software has only unobserved bugs. (Parroty Error: Pieces of Nine! Pieces of Nine!)
    Seriously: If you value it, take/fetch it yourself
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  • ICBMICBM Frets: 33962
    Probably the matching EVH 2x12" - it's designed to go with the head. A friend of mine had that set-up, and it wasn't too unmanageable - but you will need to raise the cabinet up, or at the very least tilt it back on its legs... it sits very low to the ground and doesn't project well otherwise.
    "Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone."
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  • StevepageStevepage Frets: 911
    Definitely the one I have for sale in the classifieds  ;)

    oversized 2 x 12 with Celestion V30s for less than a Harley Benton cab with V30s
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  • dariusdarius Frets: 42
    Can I get the Mesa cab back then?  =)
    No! Its too nice.
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  • robertyroberty Frets: 666
    I had a great experience with Zilla a few weeks ago, held my hand through the whole process. And the cabinet sounds fantastic

    Very responsive via email if you have questions or need help making a decision 
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  • StuartMac290StuartMac290 Frets: 655
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  • digitalscreamdigitalscream Frets: 12569
    edited October 8
    Matrix NL212 - sounds fantastic and huge for high-gain stuff, and it doesn't weigh much at all.

    If mine was nicked, there's no way I'd consider getting anything other cab to replace it.
    "Mains is ouchy if you get it up you" - Sporky
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  • Matrix NL212 - sounds fantastic and huge for high-gain stuff, and it doesn't weigh much at all.

    If mine was nicked, there's no way I'd consider getting anything other cab to replace it.
    Do you still raise/tilt this??
    My trading feedback

    is it crazy how saying sentences backwards creates backwards sentences saying how crazy it is?

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  • digitalscreamdigitalscream Frets: 12569
    Matrix NL212 - sounds fantastic and huge for high-gain stuff, and it doesn't weigh much at all.

    If mine was nicked, there's no way I'd consider getting anything other cab to replace it.
    Do you still raise/tilt this??
    Nah - if I can't put it sufficiently far behind me that my ears are in the cone, I just stand it on its side and use it vertically.
    "Mains is ouchy if you get it up you" - Sporky
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  • Matrix NL212 - sounds fantastic and huge for high-gain stuff, and it doesn't weigh much at all.

    If mine was nicked, there's no way I'd consider getting anything other cab to replace it.
    Do you still raise/tilt this??
    Nah - if I can't put it sufficiently far behind me that my ears are in the cone, I just stand it on its side and use it vertically.
    Doesnt that affect the porting feature??
    My trading feedback

    is it crazy how saying sentences backwards creates backwards sentences saying how crazy it is?

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  • digitalscreamdigitalscream Frets: 12569
    Matrix NL212 - sounds fantastic and huge for high-gain stuff, and it doesn't weigh much at all.

    If mine was nicked, there's no way I'd consider getting anything other cab to replace it.
    Do you still raise/tilt this??
    Nah - if I can't put it sufficiently far behind me that my ears are in the cone, I just stand it on its side and use it vertically.
    Doesnt that affect the porting feature??
    Not that I've noticed, no.
    "Mains is ouchy if you get it up you" - Sporky
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  • Matrix NL212 - sounds fantastic and huge for high-gain stuff, and it doesn't weigh much at all.

    If mine was nicked, there's no way I'd consider getting anything other cab to replace it.
    Do you still raise/tilt this??
    Nah - if I can't put it sufficiently far behind me that my ears are in the cone, I just stand it on its side and use it vertically.
    Doesnt that affect the porting feature??
    Not that I've noticed, no.
    Ok Cheers
    My trading feedback

    is it crazy how saying sentences backwards creates backwards sentences saying how crazy it is?

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  • octatonicoctatonic Frets: 19334
    Zilla.
    I am the juice of four limes.
    Trading Feedback

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  • StuartMac290StuartMac290 Frets: 655
    edited October 8
    Actually, if you'll consider a custom built cab you won't get better than a Hoffnine. His cabs are absolutely outstanding.

    I'm having one of these built with a pair of Alnico Creambacks as we speak:


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  • ICBMICBM Frets: 33962
    If you're going custom I would definitely get a vertical angled cab - since it's not a wide head it will sit nicely on top.

    Vertical gives better projection and dispersion and takes up less stage space. I think the only reason it's not more widely used is because it doesn't look 'traditional'.
    "Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone."
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  • DodgeDodge Frets: 337
    ICBM said:
    If you're going custom I would definitely get a vertical angled cab - since it's not a wide head it will sit nicely on top.

    Vertical gives better projection and dispersion and takes up less stage space. I think the only reason it's not more widely used is because it doesn't look 'traditional'.
    Thomann do one of those with the V30's in now.

    https://www.thomann.de/gb/harley_benton_g212_vintage_vertical.htm
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  • ash96ash96 Frets: 59
    I was gonna give another shout for a Vertical 2x12. After having the victory vertical 2x12, the normal ones seem nearly pointless now. so much more dispersion and project like ICBM says, still sounds big, and the sound it more directed at where you want to hear it rather than along the floor so perfect for your 'un mic'd' problems youre facing at the moment.

    I'm about to get a cab made by Zilla and they've been great throughout so far!
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  • ICBMICBM Frets: 33962
    Dodge said:

    Thomann do one of those with the V30's in now.
    It looks like it's 13mm narrower than the head - 495mm vs 508mm - but it should still fit OK.
    "Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone."
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  • DodgeDodge Frets: 337
    ICBM said:
    Dodge said:

    Thomann do one of those with the V30's in now.
    It looks like it's 13mm narrower than the head - 495mm vs 508mm - but it should still fit OK.
    It might sound ok too with the V30's elsewhere.  ;-)
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  • Rowby1Rowby1 Frets: 371
    Or a diagonal 2x12. I have an MJW one with Creamback 65s in and it works really well. The diagonal arrangement means it looks right (square front like a 4x12) and dispersion is very good too. If I were you I’d get Zilla to build you one. Zilla are great to deal with, I have a 1x12 of theirs too.
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  • dariusdarius Frets: 42

    Is there a simple cheatsheet in existence for how all the speaker variants compare and how to choose.

    Greenbacks, Creambacks, V30, G12M, Vintage, Heritage blah blah.

    What's the 'normal' one for 'normal' people?

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  • ICBMICBM Frets: 33962
    If it’s a 2x12” you can’t go wrong with one each of the Creamback G12M-65 and G12H-75. It’s just a fantastic-sounding combination and also has enough power handling for almost any amp. In a vertical cab put the 65 at the top.

    Basically the Creambacks are higher-rated versions of the classic G12M-25 Greenback and G12H-30, but they’re also slightly tighter with less tendency to flap out on low frequencies, and slightly darker which makes them more suitable for heavier modern sounds as well as more blues/classic rock.

    I think they’re the best-sounding all-round speakers Celestion have ever made even individually, but the combination of the two is simply outstanding.

    Despite the name the Vintage 30 is more of a dedicated hard rock speaker. It also pairs well with a Classic Lead 80 or a G12T-75 for modern rock/metal.

    Other opinions are available...
    "Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone."
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  • TTBZTTBZ Frets: 670
    edited October 8
    Depends what kinda tone you're after! V30s generally sit well in a mix and mic up well especially for heavier styles. Can sound a bit mid focused in isolation but that makes them work well too. Greenbacks sit similarly well in my experience with more of a vintage/old school rock tone, looser thinner bass and a nice "bark" - they're my go to for anything old and Marshally as they're synonymous with that tone.

    G12T75s are ok imo despite all the bad rep they get online. They're just a bit bland for me. I like Creambacks as a general all round rock speaker, with V30 probably 2nd favourite.
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  • StuartMac290StuartMac290 Frets: 655
    ICBM said:
    If it’s a 2x12” you can’t go wrong with one each of the Creamback G12M-65 and G12H-75. It’s just a fantastic-sounding combination and also has enough power handling for almost any amp. In a vertical cab put the 65 at the top.

    Basically the Creambacks are higher-rated versions of the classic G12M-25 Greenback and G12H-30, but they’re also slightly tighter with less tendency to flap out on low frequencies, and slightly darker which makes them more suitable for heavier modern sounds as well as more blues/classic rock.

    I think they’re the best-sounding all-round speakers Celestion have ever made even individually, but the combination of the two is simply outstanding.

    Despite the name the Vintage 30 is more of a dedicated hard rock speaker. It also pairs well with a Classic Lead 80 or a G12T-75 for modern rock/metal.

    Other opinions are available..

    How about a combination of one of the above and one Alnico Creamback?
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  • ICBMICBM Frets: 33962
    StuartMac290 said:

    How about a combination of one of the above and one Alnico Creamback?
    I don’t know, I’ve never tried an Alnico Creamback. From experience with the Blue and the Gold I would expect the G12H-75 to be a good match, but you can’t always tell until you try - sometimes the results can surprising.
    "Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone."
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  • clarkefanclarkefan Frets: 474
    darius said:

    Is there a simple cheatsheet in existence for how all the speaker variants compare and how to choose.

    Greenbacks, Creambacks, V30, G12M, Vintage, Heritage blah blah.

    What's the 'normal' one for 'normal' people?

    The only advice I can offer is try as much as you can.  One guy's perfect is another guy's garbage.  

    Eg, I like old G12T-75s, other people find them thin.  And I in my turn find some of the classics too fat for want of a better word.  

    Some people love V30s, I detest them, etc.

    It's all about your ears and what you want to do with the speakers.

    Good luck!
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  • markblagdonmarkblagdon Frets: 841
    edited October 8
    Surely 2x12 with EVM -12Ls is what you need, same as your 1x12 but twice as louderer

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  • dariusdarius Frets: 42
    Surely 2x12 with EVM -12Ls is what you need, same as your 1x12 but twice as louderer

    Well, yes, thats what i thought. But it seems they are a rare beast and its all Celestion greencreamV30back...
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  • StuartMac290StuartMac290 Frets: 655
    ICBM said:
    StuartMac290 said:

    How about a combination of one of the above and one Alnico Creamback?
    I don’t know, I’ve never tried an Alnico Creamback. From experience with the Blue and the Gold I would expect the G12H-75 to be a good match, but you can’t always tell until you try - sometimes the results can surprising.
    I think I'm going to go with one Alnico Creamback and the G12H-75 - Tom at Hoffnine rates the Alnico as the best of the lot. My original plan was a pair of them but I fancy a wee variation in there for recording.
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