Selling Your Used Gear To Music Shops - A Big No-No?

AlexC · September 2017

Something that crops up a helluva lot on TFB is people complaining - rightly so - about selling stuff to assorted twats who either don't pay, muck them about, make stupid demands or just waste the seller's time.
So I'm thinking - what have people got against trading stuff in or selling outright to a music shop? I know that you'll certainly get less than a private sale, but with all the aggro of Gumtree, eBay rules and their percentage etc isn't this a viable option? Genuine question. Do music shops really offer way under value?

stimpsonslostson · September 2017

Yes.

CHRISB50 · September 2017

I've found in the past Coda do fair deals for px.

Any other shops I've asked take the rise.

Strangefan · September 2017

They always give pittance in my experience,

private really and unfortunately is the way to go

guitarfishbay · September 2017

Depends how you value your time vs the potential difference in price.

Its usually worth trying to sell anything that has a decent demand privately. If you want it gone quick sell for slightly less than the going rate and you'll probably still beat the shop's offer.

But if you're willing to take a hit and in a rush for whatever reason you just have to accept that lesser price a shop offers as a convenience charge. The shops need to make a worthwhile profit so they have to buy it off you for less than the going price.

Trade ins can be better value, Coda seem to be quite fair with their valuations. Worth asking around and seeing what places offer, it can vary drastically according to item and how much they think they can sell it for.

goldtop · September 2017

Bad idea, IME. You pay close to RRP on what you're buying and get perhaps two-thirds of the market price on what you're selling. PMT offered 1/3rd of RRP as trade-in value on some still-current gear a year ago. I sold privately, no hassle.

I've had better luck with commission sales, but you've got to be very sure of the dealer before doing it. Even the nice ones will test your patience.

(Timely thread; I will be trying Richard Henry's services in a couple of weeks.)

ICBM · September 2017

You'll generally be lucky if a shop can pay much more than about half what they expect to sell it for, and this is not them 'ripping you off', it's simple economics - since they have to not only cover their overheads and make a profit, they also need to cost any remedial work - even if it's just a restring - and offer a guarantee.

Trade-ins will usually get you a better price because the shop is benefitting from a sale at the same time, but you'll still probably only get about 2/3 to 3/4 of what they then sell it for.

Commission sales are an option with many shops and this will get you pretty close to the private sale price, given that a cash buyer will usually expect a lower price, and an Ebay/Paypal sale has fees to come off - but obviously there's no guarantee of a quick sale.

When someone asks if the shop I work for will buy in things, we always tell them that they will get a better price selling privately, offer the commission sale option, and if they still really want to sell we will give them the best offer - but for anything other than cheap pedals and things that too much hassle to sell privately it's rare the customer will accept, which is completely understandable.

Running a music shop is not a way to get rich...

xpia98jf · September 2017

Guitar dealers are up there with Estate agents and bankers.

Fretwired · September 2017

You may think your guitar or amp is worth £XX, but shops also have to charge VAT so you're 20 per cent down before you start negotiating. They will then want a margin and will also be wary as it hits cash flow, especially if it sits in the store unsold for months. I can't see why people moan. They are businesses not a local charity shop.

Dominic · September 2017

Coda are fair ...others are too harsh
BUT ...they are not paying rent and rates ,staff and insurance for fun
why would anybody sell secondhand to make a small profit having paid for the goods when they could have more profit selling new something that they dont have to pay the distributor for 3 months
Anything other is simply bad business

guitars4you · September 2017

pia98jf said:

Guitar dealers are up there with Estate agents and bankers.

thanks - I did not realise I'd gone that low

No hard fast rule at my end regarding buying used guitars - it will depend on what it is, how easy it is to sell, how desirable it is, does it fit in with the rest of my profile, does it need much attention regarding set-up +fret dress etc - But if it was worth to sell say £1000, I'd be interested in buying it if the seller offered it to me at £600/650ish on the basis that I need and want it - Yes we'd make a profit but certainly not part of a master plan to get rich quick

So if a dealers selling price is £1000, then shall we go with the top end price of a private sale at £900 - If you achieve that on e-bay and if is a big word, then you'd be under £800 after fees anyway - so yes you might get more on a private sale

As an overview I'm offered more guitars than I need and in many instances if you name a potential price for me to buy and that price is to high then I simply walk away from that option - I'm not there to beat you down in price as I believe that guitar has a value to you and to me but they are just different opinions and values - Hit me with a price I like then I can but, or if in the same ballpark, then negotiation is possible

guitars4you · September 2017

Dominic said:

Coda are fair ...others are too harsh
BUT ...they are not paying rent and rates ,staff and insurance for fun
why would anybody sell secondhand to make a small profit having paid for the goods when they could have more profit selling new something that they dont have to pay the distributor for 3 months
Anything other is simply bad business

to maximise the dealers buying price most dealers will pay in 7-10 days to obtain a settlement discount - very few will take 90 days now and if you do in most instances the supplier will suspend your account until paid - not a good way to run a supplier/dealership relationship IMO

guitars4you · September 2017

Fretwired said:

You may think your guitar or amp is worth £XX, but shops also have to charge VAT so you're 20 per cent down before you start negotiating. They will then want a margin and will also be wary as it hits cash flow, especially if it sits in the store unsold for months. I can't see why people moan. They are businesses not a local charity shop.

vat on used guitars is only payable on the profit - buy for say £600 and sell for £1000 - £400 profit so the dealer will pay £66.66 to Mrs May's establishment - It is not a case on used stock of adding 20% on top of the selling ie £1000 + 20% in this instance

AlexC · September 2017

I'm not familiar with with Coda. Looking them up now.

xpia98jf · September 2017

guitars4you said:

pia98jf said:

Guitar dealers are up there with Estate agents and bankers.

thanks - I did not realise I'd gone that low

Actually I take it back then. Guitar dealers are the salt of the earth. I've never heard of a single example of them doing anything unscrupulous ever.

On a more serious note, it's not so much dealer prices that wind me up but more the mind games and tricks they play. I'm saying this based on a lot of experience of different dealers. There are some exceptions of course.

No no doubt someone will say "that's business". Well, there are different ways of doing business and that's why estate agents have the reputation they have. Because of the way they "do business".

cj73 · September 2017

Fretwired said:

You may think your guitar or amp is worth £XX, but shops also have to charge VAT so you're 20 per cent down before you start negotiating. They will then want a margin and will also be wary as it hits cash flow, especially if it sits in the store unsold for months. I can't see why people moan. They are businesses not a local charity shop.

I thought Vat on 2nd hand goods was 5%?

richardhomer · September 2017

Commission sales have worked well for me - Mark @Guitars4you sold a PRS for me a little while back - I ended up with about what I would have got privately, with none of the hassle.

I’m using a small dealer nearer to me to off-load a couple of cheaper items.

I absolutely do not begrudge dealers making a profit - that’s what keeps them in business....

guitars4you · September 2017

cj73 said:

Fretwired said:

You may think your guitar or amp is worth £XX, but shops also have to charge VAT so you're 20 per cent down before you start negotiating. They will then want a margin and will also be wary as it hits cash flow, especially if it sits in the store unsold for months. I can't see why people moan. They are businesses not a local charity shop.

I thought Vat on 2nd hand goods was 5%?

no 20% of the dealers profit - make say £400 pay £66.66 vat so dealer then makes £333.34

Lodious · September 2017

I've always found Coda to offer decent px values.

viz · September 2017

I guess the 2nd hand amp or whatever is also competing against the new stuff for the customer's money, so if (s)he buys the 2nd hand one, the dealer has effectively had the potential commission on a new one cannibalised.

If a new amp were, say, 1000 retail, and the wholesale price were 700, the dealer would have made 300, and therefore also needs to make 300 on the 2nd hand amp. So if the 2nd amp is going to sell for 500 in the shop, then the dealer can really only pay 200 for it.

ICBM · September 2017

viz said:

I guess the 2nd hand amp or whatever is also competing against the new stuff for the customer's money, so if (s)he buys the 2nd hand one, the dealer has effectively had the potential commission on a new one cannibalised.

If a new amp were, say, 1000 retail, and the wholesale price were 700, the dealer would have made 300, and therefore also needs to make 300 on the 2nd hand amp. So if the 2nd amp is going to sell for 500 in the shop, then the dealer can really only pay 200 for it.

Also this - although in reality it's more likely to be competing against the sale of a new £500 amp. However, that £500 amp will have only cost the dealer £350 assuming the same mark-up, so why would they want to pay as much as £350 for a second hand one which will possibly need servicing, and for which the shop will have to give a warranty for themselves rather than bouncing it back to the manufacturer? So - this ties in with all the other ways of calculating it - you're likely to get about £250 to £300 at best for it. It just isn't good business for the shop to pay more.

Howdy, Stranger!

Categories

In this Discussion

Become a Subscriber!

Selling Your Used Gear To Music Shops - A Big No-No?

Comments