Go Fund Me. Anyone want to buy this lad a 1962 Strat?

professorben

richardhomer said:

professorben said:

richardhomer said:

His house doesn't exactly look 'small', does it? Judging by this latest instalment, the next 'life-changing' thing we'll be asked to pay for is its redecoration - and possibly - a hair transplant.

Good to see that as he's been unable to manipulate enough punters to pay for his guitar, he has managed to gets its owner to accept half the money and the promise of the rest on monthly instalments....

Jealous much??

Hes hardly 'manipulated' people 
he asked for money, people gave him money, he's spent it on the thing he said he was going to.....

Bitchy comments about his hairline ain't gonna change anything dude. 

Er no - not jealous in the least. What I'm pointing out, is that someone who's so hard up that he needs strangers to buy his gear is unlikely to be living in a decent looking house.... So the point about manipulation, is my guess is that he's far from skint - but still got others to give him money. 

I'm not suggesting anything will change that 'dude' - I'm suggesting that those who gave him money may well have been had. 

I'm happy if you wish to view this as cynicism - but if you think I'm jealous of him or anyone else - you're just plain wrong....

And the comment about his hairline you happened to skate over?

richardhomer

That 'Prof' was a 'joke' - others in the thread have suggested he and soap look unfamiliar with each other - they were also jokes I would imagine.

I don't know what moral authority you think you have - but whether you accept my account of my intentions is entirely up to you. We disagree with each other about the bloke - so what?

Bidley

Great posts @guitarfishbay ;

There's absolutely an emotional/personal moral frenzy going on here with the older gents. Nothing wrong with that, but jokes about his hair and hygiene are a bit sad.

DefaultM

It just doesn't seem a very good way to get new fans. He could be the nicest guy in the world, but I don't know him so this is my first impression and its kind of like "hmm what a weird thing to do". 

Not to put someone else's playing down, but he's not exactly the most incredible player in the world. I'm therefore assuming that he's really knowledgeable and helpful, which is why people have given him money. 
The final outcome though seems like he's got the same fans as before (maybe less if some didn't like this), a strat, and loads of people that think he's a bell end.

beed84

guitarfishbay said:

beed84 said:

In his initial video, it was a rather abject and cringeworthy appeal for other peoples money in order to buy something, albeit, relatively speaking, very expensive and completely needless. Even by his own admission he hated to ask and felt bad for what he was doing, which he mentioned various times.

To make an attempt to compensate this unfair request, he put his good ol' squier on the plate to the person who 'donated' the most money. A quick calculation shows that there's roughly a 3400% increase between the squier and the '62 strat. 3400%! Okay, it's not one person donating all the money; however, from Dave's perspective it ain't a bad turn around at all. 

Yes, he provides videos on YouTube, but so do a lot of people. It's a voluntary pastime that should be done because you enjoy what you do, not to take advantage of your fanbase and exhort money from them in a roundabout way. If on the other hand you do become a successful YouTube hero and consequently make money from it, then great stuff, genuinely. Despite the love/hate of Chappers, at least he's grafted for his lot.

In the second video we see that Dave has got his strat, how he's gushing over it, how he claims it's "life-changing", how he can't thank his fans enough, and how it couldn't have happened without them. The truth is it could've happened without them, obvious methods raised in previous posts.

If he'd just mentioned on his videos "if you like what I do and you'd like make a donation, then go to this link here" and maybe with "I'm saving for a '62 strat", it would have been received far better. But no; a full-on, unprincipled, no messing about, give-me-your-money video, which, might I add was just plain awful to watch.

Finally, call me a cynic but to my mind there's no evidence that what he has is even a '62 strat. For all we know, his fans have been paying off his debts and the strat we saw on the videos was a souped up Encore he got down from the loft.  Regardless, he got what he wanted, he's happy, his fans are happy, and if it the real deal, he's got himself a sound investment, an investment that will see him laughing to the bank one day and his fans feeling like they've had their pants down. 

That's why I think it's BS.

Right, see that still doesn't convince me. 

The guy isn't a natural salesman so of course any kind of request for money won't be smooth. Offering the cheap guitar is a typical thing with fundraising sites - donations get recognised with rewards... there's been at least one member here who ran crowd funding for an album and they offered a range of rewards. The point isn't like for like donation and reward but I'm sure you know that.

Just because a platform is free to view doesn't mean the content has no value. It's for the consumers of that content to decide. Much of the free to use content on the internet is generating some money for someone - so a direct link between creator and consumer is surely the ideal scenario.

His language and reactions are all part and parcel of the social media age. If you watch enough YT channels you'll hear the same stock lines about stuff not being possible without the fans etc... it's not just Dave. See pretty much any gamer on YT and Twitch. Large fan base gamers can make enough from YT but smaller channels often do Twitch streams and take donations, even reacting in real time to them.

Objectively, if it is ok for him to run a donations page then I don't see the difference between that and this, he's just stated what he wants to buy. It seems people want some kind of fantasy disconnect between money and what people want to buy. Objectively all he's done is fill in the blank. "If you like my channel please donate [because I'd like blank]"

In the comment about the busker below - they don't tell you what they're saving for... if they did would that change your mind? There was a story in the press recently that good buskers can make £50/hr in a city centre, if they tell you they're saving for a BMW would you decide to not donate?

See this is where it absolutely is a jealousy based argument. If it's cool he can ask for donations based on his content, but not if he buys something deemed expensive with that money, then the game changer is what he intends to buy and the judgement of it. If he'd said nothing about his intentions all then bought the guitar there's literally no change in anything except the story told. 

I admit the idea of it not being a genuine guitar also crossed my mind. But I don't have the knowledge to prove that anyway. If it is intentionally so then that's fraud, but there's no reason to believe that's the case currently.

No he's not a salesman. He's an average guitarist posting YouTube videos for free. He isn't selling anything. To justify his ungainly delivery because he's an unpracticed salesman is questionable. I think it boils more down to shame.

As for the squier being a 'reward' is an outright insult. As I alluded to in my previous post, it appears to be more of an act redemption, i.e. "Okay, I look bad for doing this but here's a reason to make me look good and for you to like me again".

Yes, I understand various YouTube people and artists alike say similar things for a variety of reasons. However, this scenario seems to be a one-off. What he's asked for is a luxury. And not just a luxury. An investment. Will this make him any better at what he does? Unlikely. Will his YouTube fans profit from his weighty and outrageous gain. Not in the least. That's unless you want to count his ongoing videos and his gratitude. To quote a wise friend, however, "you can't spend thank yous".  Dave can cash in on his prized '62 strat whenever he likes and I suspect his fans won't see a penny. In fact, by then they may be long forgotten.

With regard to buskers, my ex girlfriend is one and she is very good at what she does. On a good day I use to see her bring home £2-300. That money, topped up with gigs paid for rent, food and a other necessities. Not only that, she worked very hard for it. It wasn't handed on a plate to her. Moreover, she didn't - as imagine is the same for all buskers - ask for the publics' money to pay for lavish gear or whatever else she might fancy. She just set up with her modest set-up and sung her heart out. If people decided to throw money in case, they did. If they didn't, she still continued to sing. Dave on the other hand saw an opportunistic shortcut via the wonders of social media and pounced. And it worked. His fans fell prey to his underhand appeal.

I'm not sure how you've concluded it's an absolute jealously based argument; however, I can assure you it's not. It's more to do with levels of appropriateness; losing face and positive social image; profiting from his fans in an unscrupulous and unashamed way, and finally, although there are more probably many more reasons, savoir faire and the lacking thereof.  To me, the totality of the wrongdoing lies in actually asking his fans for money, what the money was for, and how he went about doing it. We all get judged for what we say and do; there's no wonder why we're told to think before we speak at an early age. As a tutor once said, "You can't unsay what you've said. Once it's out there, that's it. So be careful".  

I'd never heard of Dave until these videos; and unfortunately for him, I'll always remember him by asking for cash.  Shame.

guitarfishbay

To me there's no difference between a YouTuber asking for donations and a busker with an open guitar case.

Both provide free to consume entertainment that nobody has to pay for if they don't want to.  

A busker can put out an open guitar case and people get that's how they can donate... online that isn't possible so a PayPal/other way to receive donations is required.  But ultimately it's free entertainment people can choose to donate to if they please.

And that's the most concise argument I can make on that point.  They're basically the same thing but one happens physically the other digitally.

Regarding can he be judged for saying he wants to buy an expensive item - of course.  But again my point is if he'd said nothing then nobody could have judged him if he'd bought that guitar with his donations.  If anyone makes any money and spends it on unnecessary stuff that is their own business, they have the right to do so, as people have the right to their opinion of it.

To me the entire mistake he made was the social faux pas of saying he wanted to buy something pretty unobtainable to most, and yes that might impact his audience going forward.  However, there'd likely be no thread at all if he just took donations without saying what he'll do with the money.

Lewy

guitarfishbay said:

To me the entire mistake he made was the social faux pas of saying he wanted to buy something pretty unobtainable to most, and yes that might impact his audience going forward.

Ironically, it's not unobtainable to most. The vast majority of people could access those funds if they made it a priority - the variable would be the amount of sacrifice and the amount of time it would take, but nearly anyone could do it if they considered it - and I quote - "life changing". I mean, even he's had to come up with two thirds of the cost himself so with a bit more time he wouldn't have needed to do this at all either...and yet, go back to the first vid. "I've never even SEEN that much money before ... I would never dream of owning a guitar like the etc etc etc". He got himself nearly all the way there by selling some gear and arranging some credit.

So for me, the busker comparison isn't quite right...his gofundme campaign was more like an X Factor contestant crying "but singing is my whole liiiiife" despite having not really done anything to try and forge a career as a singer outside of the show.

I think this is a very worthwhile debate to have though....with these new platforms for providing services and getting paid, society needs to catch up in terms of etiquette, notions of value, communication etc. It doesn't  have to be personal about this one bloke.

guitarfishbay

The busker comparison is purely:

Busker = free entertainment = can be donated to.  

YouTuber = free entertainment = can be donated to.

To me it's basically the same 'service' with different delivery methods.  People generally have a different reaction to donating to them though.

professorben

richardhomer said:

That 'Prof' was a 'joke' - others in the thread have suggested he and soap look unfamiliar with each other - they were also jokes I would imagine.

I don't know what moral authority you think you have - but whether you accept my account of my intentions is entirely up to you. We disagree with each other about the bloke - so what?

Look the way it read to me was not particularly jovial, more bitter and resentful for some reason, but hey you know the spirit you wrote it in, I'm just putting forward that it could be taken in that light, and that's without having to resort to my celestial authority over the universe and its constituent parts. 

robgilmo

So what do you think buskers spend their donations on, id say a busker in londons tubes makes a lot more money than I do, even if they dont make lots of money nobody ever questions what they spend it on, could be drink, drugs, a three bedroomed semi, at least this guy told us which shouldnt really make a difference anyway, unless you might be a tad envious of his lovely new vintage strat?

petercnixon

Rob Chapman gets paid upwards of £1000 a month for going down to Andertons for a few days and playing guitars for their YouTube channel to help them flog more kit.  It's not exactly hard work and he clearly spends a lot of time playing guitars anyway so it's money for old rope. He's also boosting his media presence and promoting his own guitar brand at the same time.

Are you seriously telling me it's not right for Dave Simpson to ask fans of his channel if they would give something back for the hours of video's he's created to help people learn different styles on guitar, setup guitars, get tones out of amps etc etc.  Something he's been doing for free because he loves it and genuinely wants to help others? He comes over as a really nice genuine bloke who is passionate about his music.  There are so many fake people on YouTube and he's just down to earth honest and a little eccentric.  I love his channel.

Some of the people chipping into this topic should hang their head in shame.  Making very personal and nasty uncalled for comments and suggesting he doesn't deserve such a guitar because he's not good enough.  It's disgraceful behaviour. 

Donating is totally optional if you like what he does and want to help, if you don't want to then don't bother.  No need for nasty behaviour.

Wazmeister

octatonic said:

Now he will run a campaign to get a decent amp.

Love it

Bidley

http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/facebook/001/001/886/ff5.jpg

BigBearKris

petercnixon said:

Rob Chapman gets paid upwards of £1000 a month for going down to Andertons for a few days and playing guitars for their YouTube channel to help them flog more kit.  It's not exactly hard work and he clearly spends a lot of time playing guitars anyway so it's money for old rope. He's also boosting his media presence and promoting his own guitar brand at the same time.

Are you seriously telling me it's not right for Dave Simpson to ask fans of his channel if they would give something back for the hours of video's he's created to help people learn different styles on guitar, setup guitars, get tones out of amps etc etc.  Something he's been doing for free because he loves it and genuinely wants to help others? He comes over as a really nice genuine bloke who is passionate about his music.  There are so many fake people on YouTube and he's just down to earth honest and a little eccentric.  I love his channel.

Some of the people chipping into this topic should hang their head in shame.  Making very personal and nasty uncalled for comments and suggesting he doesn't deserve such a guitar because he's not good enough.  It's disgraceful behaviour. 

Donating is totally optional if you like what he does and want to help, if you don't want to then don't bother.  No need for nasty behaviour.

Emp! You're back!

nickb_boy

I did wonder if this other thread features the actual guitar Dave picked up from the go fund me:

http://thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/108756/1962-strat/p1

Barney

nickb_boy said:

I did wonder if this other thread features the actual guitar Dave picked up from the go fund me:

http://thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/108756/1962-strat/p1

We probably find out off he starts a go fund me for the setup..!

beed84

petercnixon said:

Rob Chapman gets paid upwards of £1000 a month for going down to Andertons for a few days and playing guitars for their YouTube channel to help them flog more kit.  It's not exactly hard work and he clearly spends a lot of time playing guitars anyway so it's money for old rope. He's also boosting his media presence and promoting his own guitar brand at the same time.

Are you seriously telling me it's not right for Dave Simpson to ask fans of his channel if they would give something back for the hours of video's he's created to help people learn different styles on guitar, setup guitars, get tones out of amps etc etc.  Something he's been doing for free because he loves it and genuinely wants to help others? He comes over as a really nice genuine bloke who is passionate about his music.  There are so many fake people on YouTube and he's just down to earth honest and a little eccentric.  I love his channel.

Some of the people chipping into this topic should hang their head in shame.  Making very personal and nasty uncalled for comments and suggesting he doesn't deserve such a guitar because he's not good enough.  It's disgraceful behaviour. 

Donating is totally optional if you like what he does and want to help, if you don't want to then don't bother.  No need for nasty behaviour.