Axe_FX II Rigs, or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love Digital Modelling.

AndyJP

@paulmapp8306 That's an awesome looking cab.  Pretty heavy tho with those speakers yeah?

Temped to look at matrix pa and cab tbh.   

guitarfishbay

I go for power amp/cab.  Matrix GT1000FX and Mesa 2x12s (x2).

I play rock verging on metal for the heavier bits.

Here's a clip from last year when we were writing a bunch of stuff.  Since then I've switched out the pickups for EMGs which have helped me out a lot given I tune so low but use most of the range of the instrument.  These are stock pickups (#7s, PAFish) and the room is absolutely huge, it'd sound much tighter in a smaller room.

AndyJP

@guitarfishbay like it   sounds tight.

Anyone else got any matrix gt vid clips?many of tube vids aren't that great.

paulmapp8306

I'll shoot some video for you over the weekend

AndyJP

Paul, much appreciated mate !

paulmapp8306

Video 1.  This isnt sound clips as such - its self indulgent ....

I have just got a RAC12, so thought Id give a quick overview (camera times out after 15 minutes - which is why I suddenly stop.  There was only 30 seconds or so left so I didnt bother to re-record).  Along with my rather compact and full rack.

Please excuse the camera wobble.  If your sick its not my fault...

Ill get some sound clips don tomorrow, once I get some peace from the kids.

AndyJP

Nice rack mrs.

Good vid that. You explained the unit really well, nice job.

Neat gadget. Guess it needs a bit of forward thinking for the mapping. A more amp like interface be great for dialling in on the fly.

paulmapp8306

AndyJP said:

Guess it needs a bit of forward thinking for the mapping.

Not that much really.  The editor is childs play, and it takes seconds to change the assignments.  Ive changed a few already.  Things I thought Id have on push and hold are now on double push - and things Id thought Id have on those are on single push. Its really intuative.

For fiddling with basic amp tones and EQ, Im actually finding it easier than Axe-Edit or front panel.  For more advanced stuff, FX and stuff I still prefer front panel, or Axe-Edit if I have it booted up.  for rehearsal and live though its well worth it.  

Its much easier to grab a real knob than either AE or front panel, so playing as you would a real amp is just so nice.  More tactile I guess.

Handsome_Chris

paulmapp8306;768064" said:

Its much easier to grab a real knob...

Wahey :-O

AndyJP

Are these things expensive Paul?

paulmapp8306

Depends on your definition of expensive.

They are in the fact it's not adding anything you can't do front panel, but then neither does the Mfc. It depends how much you want that live control.

They come from France so It depends on the exchange rate. For merit worked out at appplrx £360 including a midi cable and postage.

Given the MFC is twice that  to switch patches/FX with a foot.  Given an expression pedal is £100+, Given a wireless system is £140 for the basic, and £450 for the Rack (£230 for the midrange metal TX) - and they were a fair bit more until recently.  Given the AFX itself is circa £2k then I dont think its that expensive.

It depends on how much you want to spend for convenience/control v  actual function.  Its not a "must have" (which you could argue an MFC or some midi foot controller is, for live use)  - it is a nice to have added extra for live use.  

paulmapp8306

OK - Some Clips.

Zilla is in 3/4 back - so like an oversized 2x12. Not as deep/thumpy or scooped as a 4x12 - not as cutting and sharp as a 1x12.  If anything the cab is a little too mid focused - which is the speaker choices I guess.  Problems, as explained on the first video.  

Ill post one "in context" of some sort in a mo.

paulmapp8306

OK, not quite in context.  I tried to balance the amp to a backing track - as explained on the vid - which gives changes to the 3 above.  Listening back however, the guitar is still way too loud.  I ran out of time, so havent re-done it.  I can do so -or anything else (even changes patches will more/less B/M/T/P if needed) later this weekend,

You can however hear the camera mic isnt compressing as much, so the clip does have some validity I guess

Anything else needed - just let me know.

AndyJP

Paul, thanks a lot for the vids. They helped a fair bit. Appreciate you taking the time to put these together. Nice tones and a playing

Think the strat that tones were my fav. That deluxe sounds pretty big. A strat is what i'm using for the band.

Gonna defo give a matrix pa a shot. Need to shift some gear first tho.

Got a question for ya. I get what you said about your output 2 and using the global eq for home playing. You said you use output 1 for live I think. Do you put an eq block in the chain? If so where do you put it and what type of eq?

AndyJP

Also I'm guessing the choice of speaker is really important in the cab? Picking the right speaker for your style and all that... I'm asuming that the cab speaker has the biggest effect on the tone with this setup?

Like the idea of picking up a couple of cabs for different styles...

paulmapp8306

EQ wise, I use the global output EQs.  OP 1 is set flat and at 0db and feeds input A of the Matrix - I then use that EQ to compensate for various rooms/volumes I play live at.  OP 2 is set with a EQ curve for low volume at home playing, and the gain is set to -12db.  This feeds Input B of the Matrix which is also set lower than IP A.   If Im playing at home I plug my speaker in to the Matrix OP B, if Im live I plug in to OP B.

Cab/Speaker wise - It makes a difference yet.  My cab is Jack of all trades, master of non really.  Its like that because I play so many different types of tones at home.  The cab would suit Vox/Twin sounds IF it had the correct speakers, but the G12 and V30 are more Marshal/Rock orientated.  Ditto for smaller Fender 1x12 type tones with the added issue of the wrong sized cab.  For Marshal/Rock tones the speaker choice is good - but the cab doesnt have the bottom end umph (even with the port) of a 4x12.  It also doesnt have the top end sizzle, or upper mid range scoop that 4x12s have - so its more barky than thumpy.

If I was playing a single type of tone, id have the cab/speaker to suit.  So an open 1x12 with a Jensen, a 2x12 with Alnico Blues, or a 4x12 with either V30s or greenbacks.

The "imprint" of the cab CAN be mitigated quite a lot by EQ changes (both in the amp block and outside), but never quite compensates.  The benefit is there is a them to live sounds.  With FRFR (which Ive been tempted to try again) you get the correct cab to correct amp - but live it sounds disjointed if you use lots of different tones.  A lot of live FRFR player use the same cab block for every preset - so IMO why settle for a mic'd sound, just pick the cab.  Of course in large fully mic'd bands thats not an issue so much.

The other thing Ive contemplated is trying a Matrix cab.  Not an FRFR one, one of their lightweight traditional cabs (1x12 or 2x12).  They use neodyne speakers (for the weight) which are by nature quite neutral sounding.  Its possibly a better choice if using a lot of tones as I do - BUT I ve not been able to get to try one yet, so havent taken the plunge.  One day maybe.

I have a Fender Machete - which is a 1x12 - albeit oversized and closed back (with some vents) and it is loaded with a V30 - so not really typically fender (and similar I guess to my Zilla cab speakers).  Despite this, you can hear the difference even that makes.  When through the Zilla compared to the Machete speaker, the Zilla has a rounder, bigger bottom end, with more low mids (500 hz to around 1.5k) and less upper mids (1.5k to 3-4k).  The Zilla is more thumpy/round v the Fender being tighter/clunky in the bottom.  The zilla is smoother and barkier in the mids/top v the Fender being more cutting and harsher (which suits fender drive tones).  The Zilla is noticeably larger sounding (physical cab size).

Ill get a short clip of the same patch through the two cabs a little later.  

 

paulmapp8306

OK - Cab comparison  as promised.

Despite my comments about in room sound (and preferences)  - actually listening back on the vid I have almost the opposite impression .....  That is from the Vid I prefer the Fender for clean and the Zilla for drive.  In the room i preferred the Zilla for clean and Fender for drive.

Possibly the direction of cabs to the mic - possibly the sound levels not being matched.  However, it does shown the differences.  Add to that these cabs arnt as far apart as some.  That is the Fender is a V30 - the Zilla has a V30 in it, though mixed with the G1275.  The Fender is oversized as well - so If you were comparing say a Jensen in a fender 1x12 combo to a 4x12 loaded with greenbacks, the difference would be a lot more.

AndyJP

Interesting to hear the differences in cabs. Is the camera mic clipping for the drive sounds?

paulmapp8306

Dot think so - it wasnt loud enough for that I dont think.  Possibly compressing a little.

One thing - after doing the clips I started tuning a couple of presets, using the RAC12.  What a breath of fresh air.  Although the RAC12 shows values, its not quite like the AFX.  Its just numbers - so for things like EQ particularly your not tuning by eyes - but by ears, and because (on the EQ page) the RAC12 doesnt show frequency - just EQ1-EQ8 - and the AFX doesnt go to the EQ page.  I could tune out that bark in the higher gain sounds and put in the fizz easily.  When I looked at the values of the EQ - it was more drastic than Id normally do - and the freqs Id cut were those Id normally boost if anything (the mids - 500hz, 1k mostly) and boost some Id cut (4k).

Sometimes it just pays to use ears to tune not values.

guitarfishbay

Guys trying quantum - What is the preamp hardness set to on your patches?

I've discovered the default for firmware is preamp hardness 9, preamp type authentic (double tap bypass).

For whatever reason my preamp hardnesses haven't changed to 9, they're ranging between 7.5-8, a few 8.5.  I guess this is what they were previously, since I don't think I've messed with them much if ever.

I seem to prefer the value of 9, will do some more messing about with it another day.