Fender Custom Shop v American Reissue

GazlarLosthobbit

I'm sure this has been asked umpteen times but I'm gonna add to it in the hopes of getting something I haven't read/seen already. 

Custom shop or off the shelf American Reissue. 

I'm specifically looking at a Jaguar where the price difference is like £2000 which is a huge amount of cash. Problem is I've only played a custom shop strat and I mean it was nice but not sure if it is 2k nice you know?

And when there's a good secondhand market for US Jags the price gap gets even wider. 

Just curious what your thoughts/experiences are. I know I've seen a few with CS guitars . What was it that made you take that hefty plunge? 

terada

People love them. Personally I'm yet to play a custom shop fender that is better than my 62 AVRI strat. As good as? Yep plenty of times, but not better.

Each to their own, and I'd not shy away from a custom shop if it felt right, but at the end of the day fenders are bolt on guitars with pretty functional and easy to swap components. 

RaymondLin

Ooooh huge can of worm lol

well, I totally understand, in 1 way, Leo’s thinking is that the Strat is the most efficient way to make an affordable guitar and in truth there is nothing technically different design and construction wise between all the Strats bar quality of material and electronics.  So that’s where 1 aspect comes, a CS will have (or it bloody should) have better wood, lighter wood, 1 piece instead of multiple piece, better electronics and this is the last part which cost the most, attention to detail which is labour cost the most, as Masterbuilt for example is like someone made it out of love, or at least the PR suggests.

 It also has that X Factor of something costing more, it must be better, it is a well documented psychological fact that people associates more expensive = better so that also plays a part.  Also when someone owns something, there is also a level of confirmation bias, people are often unwilling to say they made a mistake and bought something bad, a £2000 mistake so to speak.

I bought myself my first Strat this week, it’s 6 lb 15oz! A Mexican one to boot, so light weight guitar is not exclusive to Custom Shop.  If you look on Wildwood most of their CS sits between 7-7.5lbs, whereas any other model have a much wider range of weigh so you need to look harder.

that said, lighter does not equal more resonance, it doesn’t mean it plays louder unplugged, my Palir telecaster at 7 1/2lbs plays noticeable louder unplugged, it may be because it’s Ash vs Alder in the Strat but the tele is clearly louder and sustains longer. There is no guarantee light = resonates.  

You can find a Strat that you like more than a CS, it’s out there, it’s only a 2 pieces of wood which is interchangeable, you can even make it yourself with parts, or you can pay more to increase your chances.  Of course paying more doesn’t automatically means it will be better but the odds that it is, is higher (in theory).

Funkfingers

It's the law of diminishing returns. More attention to fine detail appears to have been lavished on the CS examples than their nearest equivalent stock AVRI or American Original models. This difference is not directly proportional to the additional outlay. 

Usually, for what I require, I am entirely content with a lightly modified AVRI. (Cap changes, Duncan Antiquity pickups, Mastery vibrato parts.)

GazlarLosthobbit said:

What was it that made you take that hefty plunge? 

Not so hefty because I bought pre-owned. The model I desired was unavailable in any other Fender series. (C.S. or F.O!) 

Jackobean

Mid sixties Jaguars are still relatively affordable.
 If you absolutely have to spend that kind of money, that would be my choice

Otherwise the final iteration of the AVRI series are some of the finest production guitars Fender have made.
Alternatively, the Marr signature is pretty spiffy unless you're dead set on vintage spec.

Whitecat

I think the best part of the Custom Shop is the ability to get something custom. 

If you are otherwise buying an off-the-peg example there may be little to no advantage in quality or tone. 

The advantage of going off-the-peg on the other hand is that there are no surprises. A custom build could turn out to be a dog, and then what?

CS guitars tend to be great - and they tend to be lighter, but no guarantees, even if you pay for the “sort for lightweight” upcharge. I bet if you pulled 10 MIA examples and 10 CS examples of roughly the same model guitar the CS average weight would be lower, but of course specific examples vary. 

The prices though are getting stratospherically silly, which is my biggest bugbear. For a bolt-on relic they are charging a lot for decals, essentially. 

GazlarLosthobbit

Thanks for the replies guys. I would tend to agree with you all that it is a lot to spend on a bolt on guitar. I think there's that part of me that wants to own a CS but then I'd really rather own a preCBS anyway. Which is achievable for the kind of money that's being asked. 

I think I just wanted to see if there was anyone who was like 'yeah it costs more but you get more' which doesn't seem to be the mentality. I tend to be a bit of a tweaker anyway when it comes to my guitars so I'd probably get more enjoyment upgrading a second hand AVRI. 

jeztone2

Jackobean said:

Mid sixties Jaguars are still relatively affordable.
 If you absolutely have to spend that kind of money, that would be my choice

Otherwise the final iteration of the AVRI series are some of the finest production guitars Fender have made.
Alternatively, the Marr signature is pretty spiffy unless you're dead set on vintage spec.

This!!!

A mate of mines got a Marr, it’s really nice. 

monquixote

I'm having this thought at the moment. 

I quite fancy a Tele, but considering I'm not interested in a relic I'm not sure that paying double the price for a CS really gets me anything over the American Original 50's model.

danny_777

I'm a big fan of Fender CS, at the right price - they're genuinely brilliant guitars. You'll get one for under £2k with some effort and a bit of patience, and if bought right it'll hold its value.

That said one of my favourite Teles after going through a LOT of them is a MIJ '62 Reissue. Just a brilliant guitar.

They're all bits of wood - play enough and you'll find one. It's just a bit more consistent with the CS stuff!

danny_777

RaymondLin said:

Ooooh huge can of worm lol

well, I totally understand, in 1 way, Leo’s thinking is that the Strat is the most efficient way to make an affordable guitar and in truth there is nothing technically different design and construction wise between all the Strats bar quality of material and electronics.  So that’s where 1 aspect comes, a CS will have (or it bloody should) have better wood, lighter wood, 1 piece instead of multiple piece, better electronics and this is the last part which cost the most, attention to detail which is labour cost the most, as Masterbuilt for example is like someone made it out of love, or at least the PR suggests.

 It also has that X Factor of something costing more, it must be better, it is a well documented psychological fact that people associates more expensive = better so that also plays a part.  Also when someone owns something, there is also a level of confirmation bias, people are often unwilling to say they made a mistake and bought something bad, a £2000 mistake so to speak.

I bought myself my first Strat this week, it’s 6 lb 15oz! A Mexican one to boot, so light weight guitar is not exclusive to Custom Shop.  If you look on Wildwood most of their CS sits between 7-7.5lbs, whereas any other model have a much wider range of weigh so you need to look harder.

that said, lighter does not equal more resonance, it doesn’t mean it plays louder unplugged, my Palir telecaster at 7 1/2lbs plays noticeable louder unplugged, it may be because it’s Ash vs Alder in the Strat but the tele is clearly louder and sustains longer. There is no guarantee light = resonates.  

You can find a Strat that you like more than a CS, it’s out there, it’s only a 2 pieces of wood which is interchangeable, you can even make it yourself with parts, or you can pay more to increase your chances.  Of course paying more doesn’t automatically means it will be better but the odds that it is, is higher (in theory).

Excellent post. I've always said Tele's are just planks of wood with a neck on - they were designed to be production-line guitars. So it's a bit bizarre to spend £3-4k for someone to put a neck on a plank and screw the parts on...

Panama_Jack666

I have owned various of each and it comes down to the specific instrument for me. I've played AVRI's that have blown CS's out of the water and visa versa.

The only answer is to try then both out. My main gigging instrument for years was a battered AVRI. I loved it. I was convinced there wasn't much better but then I found the right CS which is on another level! 

dannyboy82

No agenda here but every cs fender I have owned (2x strats and 2 x teles) has left me wanting. I don’t know if it’s the expectation level given the price of them but hand on my heart, the best Fenders I have owned have been American Vintage reissues 2012-2017. Somehow truer to the ethos of the brand. Fender was never boutique!

hotpickups

My Vintera 60s strat resonates so well. Almost as well as my Martyn booth guitar which is substantially more money  

dc77

Panama_Jack666 said:

I have owned various of each and it comes down to the specific instrument for me. I've played AVRI's that have blown CS's out of the water and visa versa.

The only answer is to try then both out. My main gigging instrument for years was a battered AVRI. I loved it. I was convinced there wasn't much better but then I found the right CS which is on another level! 

Absolutely agree. 
I've had my 62 AVRI from new since 2012. Fair few guitars have come and gone, including some CS strats that I just didn't bond with for whatever reason over my AVRI. I'm lucky enough to Peach guitars 45 mins away. Coda about an hour. Regularly I'll go and see what's on offer. Plenty are equal to mine. But only twice have I known in an instant that I was playing something special. You can't even quantify it as it's totally individual to the player. But when you know. You know.
Unfortunately on both occasions I weren't in a position to purchase. 
My nearest PMT has a good selection of CS stuff. They have 4 particular strats of identical spec but different clours. One of them is heads and shoulders a nicer player than the other 3. A friend of mine has also played all 4. My favourite was to him the runt or the litter.
For me. AVRI and the now re named American Original series are up there with CS outside of going master built. 

Caffeine_Vampire

Been through many Custom Shop Fenders. Wouldn’t swap my AVHR for any of them.

chris78

I’ve owned Christ knows how many fenders at most price points.
The idea that somehow because the necks bolt on that the wood makes no difference is utterly ridiculous. As you go up the line, you’re paying generally for better wood, more hand finishing and better components. 

The exception to that was the last line of American Vintage Guitars. The av64 tele and 65 strats were some of the finest guitars ever made by Fender. They were so good that you’d only go custom shop to get 9.5 radius, bigger frets, reliced finishes and that played in feel you get from cs guitars. The new ones had some extra fight about them. The pickups in both are also exceptional. Most of the last AVs as well were super light. The Am Originals I’ve tried don’t feel as good for some reason and some, not all, are quite heavy. You get the 9.5 radius now, but when I’ve played side my side, I can feel the difference with a cs guitar.

Generally when someone asks the question, they want a cs guitar at factory prices and they think they’ll save money and get a product that’s as good. If you’re thinking that, get a cs. You’ll always wonder otherwise and you’ll never be happy.

RaymondLin

chris78 said:

I’ve owned Christ knows how many fenders at most price points.
The idea that somehow because the necks bolt on that the wood makes no difference is utterly ridiculous. As you go up the line, you’re paying generally for better wood, more hand finishing and better components. 

The exception to that was the last line of American Vintage Guitars. The av64 tele and 65 strats were some of the finest guitars ever made by Fender. They were so good that you’d only go custom shop to get 9.5 radius, bigger frets, reliced finishes and that played in feel you get from cs guitars. The new ones had some extra fight about them. The pickups in both are also exceptional. Most of the last AVs as well were super light. The Am Originals I’ve tried don’t feel as good for some reason and some, not all, are quite heavy. You get the 9.5 radius now, but when I’ve played side my side, I can feel the difference with a cs guitar.

Generally when someone asks the question, they want a cs guitar at factory prices and they think they’ll save money and get a product that’s as good. If you’re thinking that, get a cs. You’ll always wonder otherwise and you’ll never be happy.

I think you should do a blindfold challenge, 12 Fenders, Mexican, Japanese, USA and CS. 3 each, all the same gloss necks, may be same radius and perhaps try find them all around 7.5lbs and all set up by a tech and then see how you rank them.

monquixote

I think Andertons did something like that.

RaymondLin

monquixote said:

I think Andertons did something like that.

Rabea chose one with some walnut neck or something which sounds intrinsically different rather than all maple or rosewood.  

timmypix

So to add another variable to the mess, are the American Originals up to the standard or the AVRIs?