Non-musicians understand and feel music in a lot more detail and complexity than we realise...

TTBZ

thecolourbox said:

Sassafras said:

I like to play stuff that people will actually listen to enthusiastically.

I on the other hand am a totally self absorbed narcissist, as I no longer care if people like my music as long as I like it

Me too to a point. It's also why I hate playing covers and pandering to the typical pub-goers shit taste in the same set list that every other fucker plays. Hate the "but it always goes down well!" argument to me trying to drop shit like Dakota and Summer Of 69 in favour of more interesting songs  

ToneControl

jaymenon said:

The interesting thing is that while I have not heard any of those pieces of music for the past 40 years, if I pick up a guitar now I am able to play them quite faithfully to the original pieces of music including added notes, inversions etc.  This is based on a musical memory from the time when I was between the ages of five and eight, long before I ever learnt to play a musical instrument.

It therefore sort of follows logically that we perhaps understand and feel a lot of the music that we listen to, even down to its reasonably complex structure, even when we are at a stage in life when we do not understand the theoretical basis behind it, let alone know how to play it on a musical instrument.

An alternative hypothesis would be that some people have brains that can easily deal with musical complexity, can remember complicated tunes, and that some of these later successfully become competent musicians.

Whereas those who cannot easily deal with musical complexity, or remember complicated tunes, fail to successfully become musicians if they try later on in life, hence all the mates we have who own a guitar but can't play it

Of course there is a large element of effort required to learn an instrument that can stop people learning, but my suspicion is that some people also lack the underlying capabilities

Sassafras

I'm a sadist so I like to torture my audience with discordant, unrythmic, tuneless, pretentious and extremely self indulgent cacophony.
That soon shuts the whinging bastards up.

p90fool

thegummy said:

p90fool said:

When I've nearly completed a song in my studio I have a couple of non-musician friends I run it by to see what they think. They're both mid-20s and keen and knowledgeable about music but have no technical knowledge about how it's made. 

Their input is always far more useful than any from my musician friends. 

That's an excellent point.

I think some musicians have a tendency to think things that are harder to play or more complex are better than things that are easy to play or simple.

But in reality the easier thing might be better and often is. The non musicians won't even know how difficult a part is to play, they only know if it sounds good.

Maybe one of the reasons I value the input of non-musicians more than most is because I like pop music.  

If I was into prog or poodle rock I might be more interested in what other musicians had to say. 

kentuckyklira

How do you explain c RAP "music" then?

Freebird

thegummy said:

gordiji said:

The hard part is expressing what you hear in your head through your fingers.

I'm actually far better at that than any technical guitar playing skill and I must say I'm glad about it.

It's because I already played a different instrument for a long time before moving to guitar but I'd say to anyone learning guitar who also wants to write their own music that this is far more important than any technical skill.

The ability to do it can be improved through ear training and transcribing songs.

A piano comes in handy for this, and it's my No. 1 tool for sketching out new ideas.

Rocker

TTBZ said:

thecolourbox said:

Sassafras said:

I like to play stuff that people will actually listen to enthusiastically.

I on the other hand am a totally self absorbed narcissist, as I no longer care if people like my music as long as I like it

Me too to a point. It's also why I hate playing covers and pandering to the typical pub-goers shit taste in the same set list that every other fucker plays. Hate the "but it always goes down well!" argument to me trying to drop shit like Dakota and Summer Of 69 in favour of more interesting songs  

If you are being paid to play and entertain customers (in a bar for example), you play what they want to hear.  It is of no consequence whether you like that stuff or not.  That, my friend, is what is called reality, actually is.

TheOtherDennis

Sassafras said:

I'm a sadist so I like to torture my audience with discordant, unrythmic, tuneless, pretentious and extremely self indulgent cacophony.
That soon shuts the whinging bastards up.

I do that too.

The difference is I don't mean it, I'm just shit. :-S

HCDavies

ToneControl said:

Of course there is a large element of effort required to learn an instrument that can stop people learning, but my suspicion is that some people also lack the underlying capabilities

There are also many that lack the desire to learn. A family with 6 kids I know has 1 who is a better guitarist than me, he's 30 years younger than I. His brother plays bass about as well as I do, the youngest (who's still a horrible teenager) plays cello. The other 3 are just not interested, 1 obsessed by rugby, the oldest by photography and painting refuses to even try to sing and the last is just self obsessed.

I'm no Clapton, but I can play well enough to entertain people, I don't and never will get paid to perform, but some do like to hear me play, and that's good enough for me.