Les Trem comedy problem...

MartinBush

I've just fit a Duesenberg Les Trem 2. It was easy enough with a bit of fiddling. But I seem to have hit a bit of a problem...

Can you guess what it is?
https://imgur.com/a/aBqR5p9

I cant shut the case without the trem being depressed by the lid. This doesn't seem good to me. Either I've fit it incorrectly, theres a setting I have missed or it's a design flaw? Which is it?

For various reasons my guitar lives in the case when not in use so unless I've mocked something up the trem has to come off.

Help!

ICBM

It's probably not an issue to close the case and depress the trem a bit, it just means that the guitar will probably be out of tune when you come to play it. Either that or get a deeper case, or a good gig bag.

This can also be an issue with a Bigsby and a Vibramate by the way - the Vibramate moves the end of the Bigsby back so far that it can sometimes make it difficult to get the guitar into the case.

MartinBush

Ive got it in the case now with only two clasps done up. Ordinarily it stands up in the case in a corner. I will see how I go. It's a sod though:)

That aside I'm made up with it. A bit fiddly to fit due, I think, to gibsons fit and finish being a touch off, but I will see how I go with it. 

I took the opportunity to fit a cheap roller bridge too.

sixwheeltyrrel

I wouldn't think that squeezing the guitar into the case with the trem arm depressed will do any long term damage but ideally not.

Presumably leaving it on a stand isn't an option? Perhaps a wall hanger would be the way to go?

Cracking guitar by the way. I've always had a soft spot for the elegance of a  black Les Paul.

chrisj1602

Is it not like a Bigsby where you can rotate the the arm towards the strap button?

Epsilon

It says in the instructions that it doesn't matter if the trem depresses when in a case.

Strangefan

I have one on my d'angelico, and I really love mine, I'm going to get one for my SG

merlin

I fitted mine really easily to my Collings 290. Goes into the case or gig bag and sure, the arms gets depressed....I just tune it up when it comes out of the bag/case and good to go.

MartinBush

It's not the arm that's the problem, it's the bit that the arm goes into (the name of which I don't know).

I suppose if its technically OK I will stick with it. I still have to work out the intonation as it's a new bridge and so on. Generally speaking I dont worry too much about being in tune...

Thanks @sixwheeltyrrel I like it too. I tend to read more about bursts and gold tops being the best looking, but I like mine. 

ICBM

You could always think of it as a clever design to automatically lower the string tension when the guitar is in the case and reduce the possibility of a headstock break if it falls over.

Headphones

My SG always lives on a stand, but came with the big padded case/bag thing, so the added height at the tailpeice didn't cause any issues for me...

MartinBush

Out of interest, how much would a decent gig bag type thing be?

Teflon

I've often wondered about this. I have 3 Burns guitars with tremelo arms that are designed to be left on the guitar. In a standard case, closing the lid would depress the arm, but the Burns specific cases all have a cut out in the lid to accommodate the arm.  All well and good, but I don't understand why it should really matter. After all, depressing the arm just puts a little more tension in the trem springs, but no more than they're designed to handle I would have thought.

Having said all that, it does seem wrong to have the trem arm depressed in the case, even though I doubt it does any harm. It'll be interesting to hear the forum views on this.

Cliff

ICBM

MartinBush said:

Out of interest, how much would a decent gig bag type thing be?

A *really* decent gig bag - good enough that you can carry around a guitar with a fragile headstock and not have to worry about it - isn't cheap, over £150. But if you're not doing that and it's just to cover and protect the guitar at home you could get away with something much cheaper.

There are also 'semi-hard' cases - shaped foam with a nylon outer covering - which arguably give the best of both worlds and aren't too expensive. They're probably flexible enough to allow for the height of the trem, although I haven't tried one on a Les Paul with one.

MartinBush

Thanks to all for the feedback on this one.

I guess I was so keen to get the thing on that I'd not considered something like this the bridge seems to work OK but was a slightly tight fit, as were the trem/ tailpiece bolts.

It's many years since I strung any sort of trem and I was fascinated to find that every time I tuned one string up the others would go slightly flat. This will subside won't it?

ICBM

MartinBush said:

It's many years since I strung any sort of trem and I was fascinated to find that every time I tuned one string up the others would go slightly flat. This will subside won't it?

No, that's normal with any kind of floating trem, although some are worse than others.

Headphones

That's the nature of floating vibratos, it's the physics.

The string tension is balanced against a spring (or several in parallel), if one string's tension changes it changes the pull on the spring, so the spring (and bridge it's attached to) moves too.

To tune, you therefore repeat the cycle until all strings are in.  This is normal for most Strat players (unless they've buggered the guitar by blocking the trem).

ewal

I really like the Les Trem on my Manta Ray - find it is where I need it to be unlike the Bigsby I once tried. I use a gig bag, so not encountered your case closure issue.

MartinBush

Yep @Headphones I understand the physics but it was just one of those amusing things that I'd not expected. In the past I've had trems removed due to me being so heavy handed but I've hopefully refined my technique somewhat  

I am made up with the trem despite the unexpected issue with the case - I had a quick go with it yesterday once fitted and it did exactly what I wanted. To anyone thinking of getting one I can say that the quality is excellent. I'd also say that this is only the second piece of hardware I've fit to a guitar - the first being a set of new tuners. Both were relatively quick to install and required minimal skill. I think the only hampering factor is the never-quite-exact Gibson fit and finish. 

skullfunkerry

Regarding gig bags, I've got one of these:

https://www.gak.co.uk/en/protection-racket-7050-classic-electric-guitar-bag/5443

It's excellent - the sides are rigid, and it's probably deep enough not to depress your trem... but even if it isn't, there's a bit of give in the front

MartinBush

Cheers @skullfunkerry that looks a good one. I think it might be a case of waiting till lockdown is over and trying a few with my guitar in-store.