Does practice work like compound interest ? If you get my drift

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hollywoodroxhollywoodrox Frets: 1562
edited July 20 in Technique
So I’ve been learning some of the harder Slash licks in the November rain outro solo , paradise city , etc.  It has taken me quite a while to get them up to speed in the  mid 90s 100%  But I can now see that it is within my grasp .

what I am wondering is   the more of this stuff I work on  will it seem quicker to get up to speed the more I do it. The past 3 or 4 months have been working on 6 or 7 pieces of stuff ,eg hardest bits for me are usually speedy parts . I am thinking  say after getting a few  solos under your belt ,especially from someone with a pretty regular style of soloing , one would hope that say after 6 or 8 complete solos are achieved the next 6 will be slightly quicker to fall under ones fingers ,and the 6 after that ,slightly quicker again and so on . 

  It’s a lot more interesting working on actual solo’s for technique with the bonus of adding to ones repertoire .  

It would be cool to be able to get more songs in ones repertoire and solos and their speed are one of the main stumbling points for me .

im currently on day 110 of consecutive focused practice ,usually 2 hours a day  or more , plus some transcribing( well writing down in a way I understand , what I’m hearing )  And I’m getting up to speed and playing faster than I ever believed I could so , am hoping that once I get a good number under my belt  they will eventually not take me so long to get up to speed .

am hoping to build up a good repertoire Of Guns n roses songs and skills in the next 5 years .

I start off tackling stuff so slowwwwwwww it’s not even worth playing the track, just sorting out all the articulations , once I can get it under my fingers I will start playing along to a demo piece or the actual guitar on the track  trying to match it . I find at first I’m glad to start  at the same time and finish at the same time and if the middle is not exactly synchronous to the track it’s not an immediate worry , I then get to the stage where I can try and match note for note til I get it perfect , then push up the speed .

of course ,the longer I’m playing these pieces the fussier I get ( I saw a name for this in a book recently ,something like selective bias)  where before I would be happy to hit a certain speed , I must now play it cleaner, more defined etc lol. 


Anyway so back to the original question, do you think practice works like compound interest
  it’s a bad analogy , but you get my drift 
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Comments

  • vizviz Frets: 7994
    yes, that Slash stuff will become totally easy after a bit, then anything he does will fall naturally under your fingertips. There's a learning curve, then it gets easier and easier.
    Anything that isn’t pentatonic is pretentious wank -  LastMantra
    more on the strength of my ability to own a PA than to play a guitar” - ICBM
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  • CarpeDiemCarpeDiem Frets: 210
    I think it depends on the variety, quality, and focus of your practice. If you achieve the goal of successfully playing something new, and vary what you are learning, that your playing develops. Conversely, if you only play the same things, your playing is more likely to plateau. 
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  • vizviz Frets: 7994
    CarpeDiem said:
    I think it depends on the variety, quality, and focus of your practice. If you achieve the goal of successfully playing something new, and vary what you are learning, that your playing develops. Conversely, if you only play the same things, your playing is more likely to plateau. 
    Actually that's a brilliant comment.
    Anything that isn’t pentatonic is pretentious wank -  LastMantra
    more on the strength of my ability to own a PA than to play a guitar” - ICBM
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  • hollywoodroxhollywoodrox Frets: 1562
    I see what you are saying , I was varying what I played the last 2 years like adding 80s pop stuff etc  but it wasn’t addressing my passion which is to play guns n roses stuff , but since I decided to follow my passion it has kept me practicing regularly and progressing .

     I was experimenting today playing the blues scale but with the minor 2nd Dorian interval ,  but not the 6th and it sounded good ,  also adding in  b6th in places for a natural minor sound , or b6 and 7th for harmonic minor  when I could get away with it sounding good , like over a V chord .

    also been working on picked arpeggios like paradise city intro ,sweet child verse etc and planning to add others like don’t cry /civil war 
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  • vizviz Frets: 7994
    I see what you are saying , I was varying what I played the last 2 years like adding 80s pop stuff etc  but it wasn’t addressing my passion which is to play guns n roses stuff , but since I decided to follow my passion it has kept me practicing regularly and progressing .

     I was experimenting today playing the blues scale but with the minor 2nd Phrygian interval ,  but not the 6th and it sounded good ,  also adding in  b6th in places for a natural minor sound , or b6 and 7th for harmonic minor  when I could get away with it sounding good , like over a V chord .

    also been working on picked arpeggios like paradise city intro ,sweet child verse etc and planning to add others like don’t cry /civil war 

    corrected
    Anything that isn’t pentatonic is pretentious wank -  LastMantra
    more on the strength of my ability to own a PA than to play a guitar” - ICBM
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  • hollywoodroxhollywoodrox Frets: 1562
    I think I meant 2nd not minor second , so it was more like a Dorian , but  the Phrygian minor 2nd would be great too over the right chords ,sort of Middle Eastern . I was experimenting with

    1 2 b3 4 b5 5 b7  and was really liking it  for improvising , if I was writing a solo I would look to see what notes were in the chords and where I could add flavour ,like Phrygian,harmonic minor etc , 
    these are sometimes things I can sometimes do in the late afternoon.  Early morning is the serious learning my solos ,licks etc .
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  • vizviz Frets: 7994
    edited July 20
    I think I meant 2nd not minor second , so it was more like a Dorian , but  the Phrygian minor 2nd would be great too over the right chords ,sort of Middle Eastern . I was experimenting with

    1 2 b3 4 b5 5 b7  and was really liking it  for improvising , if I was writing a solo I would look to see what notes were in the chords and where I could add flavour ,like Phrygian,harmonic minor etc , 
    these are sometimes things I can sometimes do in the late afternoon.  Early morning is the serious learning my solos ,licks etc .
    Ah yes, the minor blues dominant scale very nice.

    https://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/comment/78328/#Comment_78328

    Anything that isn’t pentatonic is pretentious wank -  LastMantra
    more on the strength of my ability to own a PA than to play a guitar” - ICBM
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  • hollywoodroxhollywoodrox Frets: 1562
    viz said:
    I think I meant 2nd not minor second , so it was more like a Dorian , but  the Phrygian minor 2nd would be great too over the right chords ,sort of Middle Eastern . I was experimenting with

    1 2 b3 4 b5 5 b7  and was really liking it  for improvising , if I was writing a solo I would look to see what notes were in the chords and where I could add flavour ,like Phrygian,harmonic minor etc , 
    these are sometimes things I can sometimes do in the late afternoon.  Early morning is the serious learning my solos ,licks etc .
    Ah yes, the minor blues dominant scale very nice.

    https://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/comment/78328/#Comment_78328

    Thank you :)  , you really know your onions on this stuff 
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  • vizviz Frets: 7994
    edited July 20
    LOTS of hours spent in airports and on planes in my younger days :) (plus having a dad who's professor of music at Oxford lol)
    Anything that isn’t pentatonic is pretentious wank -  LastMantra
    more on the strength of my ability to own a PA than to play a guitar” - ICBM
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  • hollywoodroxhollywoodrox Frets: 1562
    viz said:
    LOTS of hours spent in airports and on planes in my younger days :) (plus having a dad who's professor of music at Oxford lol)
    Wow that’s awesome ,it sounds so glamorous ,the jet set , Oxford wow that’s a pretty big deal 
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  • vizviz Frets: 7994
    viz said:
    LOTS of hours spent in airports and on planes in my younger days :) (plus having a dad who's professor of music at Oxford lol)
    Wow that’s awesome ,it sounds so glamorous ,the jet set  
    It's 100% not, I promise you that!
    Anything that isn’t pentatonic is pretentious wank -  LastMantra
    more on the strength of my ability to own a PA than to play a guitar” - ICBM
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  • wizbit81wizbit81 Frets: 268
    It's not compound as that implies it adds on top and cumulatively does so on a steep trajectory. Sometimes you can practice and seem to actively get worse, sometimes you plateau then make a huge breakthrough. Don't try to work out things like that just see it as a lifetime journey to enjoy. If you try to conquer it, then it will conquer you as you will always find harder and harder things you want to achieve.
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  • hollywoodroxhollywoodrox Frets: 1562
    wizbit81 said:
    It's not compound as that implies it adds on top and cumulatively does so on a steep trajectory. Sometimes you can practice and seem to actively get worse, sometimes you plateau then make a huge breakthrough. Don't try to work out things like that just see it as a lifetime journey to enjoy. If you try to conquer it, then it will conquer you as you will always find harder and harder things you want to achieve.
    Thank you  that’s very wise advice ,appreciate it 
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  • fretmeisterfretmeister Frets: 15511
    Definitely.

    Think of it like reading english. When you are a kid you break the word down phonetically and you treat all words as a collection of smaller parts that you say separately but quick enough that all the sounds run together to make the word.

    After you have learned that word you don't do that anymore. The entire thing becomes a single sound pattern. You are not doing phonetics anymore, you now have pattern recognition.

    Now when that recognisable pattern appears within other new words you have a hybrid - maybe a bit of phonetics, then the recognised pattern, then maybe a bit more phonetics. You learning that new word is faster / easier because a bit of it is a pattern you already know.

    Same for music, especially when written. You see 4 notes when you start and you think and play them. After a while you don't think of the note names anymore, you recognise the pattern. That expands to take into account the key signature and note length until you have all these amazing little variations of the same basic note structure depending on tempo, key, note length.

    You don't do the individual note / phonetic bit anymore.



    And that's why 5-10 mins per day is always better than a single 2 hour session on the weekend. Repetition is the key. Just like when learning to speak for the first time.
    Humans will swim in the sea even though there are many corpses in it.  They will not swim in a pool with a corpse in it. 
    Therefore all humans have a water / corpse ratio that is acceptable to them.
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  • hollywoodroxhollywoodrox Frets: 1562
    Definitely.

    Think of it like reading english. When you are a kid you break the word down phonetically and you treat all words as a collection of smaller parts that you say separately but quick enough that all the sounds run together to make the word.

    After you have learned that word you don't do that anymore. The entire thing becomes a single sound pattern. You are not doing phonetics anymore, you now have pattern recognition.

    Now when that recognisable pattern appears within other new words you have a hybrid - maybe a bit of phonetics, then the recognised pattern, then maybe a bit more phonetics. You learning that new word is faster / easier because a bit of it is a pattern you already know.

    Same for music, especially when written. You see 4 notes when you start and you think and play them. After a while you don't think of the note names anymore, you recognise the pattern. That expands to take into account the key signature and note length until you have all these amazing little variations of the same basic note structure depending on tempo, key, note length.

    You don't do the individual note / phonetic bit anymore.



    And that's why 5-10 mins per day is always better than a single 2 hour session on the weekend. Repetition is the key. Just like when learning to speak for the first time.
    Thank you, very well put . 
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  • RockerRocker Frets: 4265
    Don't lose sight of the reason you play guitar - I play guitar to make music.  Playing music with family members and friends.  Your reason might be different but identify it and keep it in mind.

    I have always believed that some athletes leave their best performances on the training track.  And thus are unable to attain the heights in performance, on the race day, that they are capable of.  Overtraining can make you feel stale and uninspired when you want to perform.  Applies to guitar as well as athletics.
    Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. [Albert Einstein]

    Nil Satis Nisi Optimum

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  • hollywoodroxhollywoodrox Frets: 1562
    I love guns n roses and would like to play their music to the very best of my ability , especially with a band 
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  • vizviz Frets: 7994
    I love guns n roses and would like to play their music to the very best of my ability , especially with a band 
    Have you got a band? Do they want to play GnR?
    Anything that isn’t pentatonic is pretentious wank -  LastMantra
    more on the strength of my ability to own a PA than to play a guitar” - ICBM
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  • hollywoodroxhollywoodrox Frets: 1562
    viz said:
    I love guns n roses and would like to play their music to the very best of my ability , especially with a band 
    Have you got a band? Do they want to play GnR?
    No but once I can play it I’ll find them somehow , even if I have to play the vocal melody over backing tracks 
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  • vizviz Frets: 7994
    What I’ve always done is found good musicians and we’ve typically done a broad range of stuff. incl gnr. I’m sure you’ll find some like-minded individuals in time! Cheers Viz
    Anything that isn’t pentatonic is pretentious wank -  LastMantra
    more on the strength of my ability to own a PA than to play a guitar” - ICBM
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