Beginner build thread - Harley Benton TE kit

BluesLover

I've been looking at the Crimson Guitars YouTube channel, about colour staining and finishing oil, and thinking that might be an interesting way to go.

Roland

IIRC Harley Benton kits already have sealer on the body. You’d have to remove that before stain would take evenly. The wood looks a nice colour. It might be better to use a finish that brings out the wood grain. Tru-Oil is popular because it adds a tinge of amber.

BluesLover

This is the sort of look I'm thinking of, though not that actual colour. He had to sand the sealant off first.

WBT2079

I had the HB JA kit and went for a solid colour finish. Although it has sealer, I found when I sprayed the primer on, it really showed how finished / unfinished the body was that hadn’t really been visible to the eye previously. I found there were lots of pore holes that I ended up having to fill and smooth so I would get a nice flat finish.

RichAC

BluesLover said:

I've been looking at the Crimson Guitars YouTube channel, about colour staining and finishing oil, and thinking that might be an interesting way to go.

Roland said:

IIRC Harley Benton kits already have sealer on the body. You’d have to remove that before stain would take evenly. The wood looks a nice colour. It might be better to use a finish that brings out the wood grain. Tru-Oil is popular because it adds a tinge of amber.

The body does have sanding sealer, yes.

 I'm currently leaning towards a solid colour, but haven't totally decided yet. Something I'm thinking about is using chalk paint. Annie Sloan chalk paint seems like it would be less hassle than spraying and it's easy to take off if it all goes wrong! I actually found an old discussion on here about chalk paint on guitars.

Having played around with online configurators, I like this look:

Funkfingers

A headstock shaped using anything less than a router and template is likely to look rough. 

At least, with a T type, there will be some rounding over where the neck blends into the headstock edge.

You could use a straight edge as a guide to replicate the old Fender Swinger/Musiclander headstock,

Alternatively, there is the Ibanez pointy outline.

RichAC

Funkfingers said:

A headstock shaped using anything less than a router and template is likely to look rough. 

At least, with a T type, there will be some rounding over where the neck blends into the headstock edge.

You could use a straight edge as a guide to replicate the old Fender Swinger/Musiclander headstock,

Alternatively, there is the Ibanez pointy outline.

That's a fair point. I don't know anyone with a router, so I'm going to have to make do... if it ends up looking dreadful, then hey, the main point of the exercise is to learn. Worst case, I can upgrade it from a kit to a partscaster. 

I hadn't seen the Fender Swinger or its headstock before. Not a fan, sorry to say. The Ibby headstock... well it would be in good company next to the RG. 

paulnb57

Funkfingers said:

A headstock shaped using anything less than a router and template is likely to look rough. 

At least, with a T type, there will be some rounding over where the neck blends into the headstock edge.

You could use a straight edge as a guide to replicate the old Fender Swinger/Musiclander headstock,

Alternatively, there is the Ibanez pointy outline.

Disagree with the above, Ive done several headstock reshapes with basic tool, its very doable

WezV

you can do a perfectly acceptable job with a coping saw and some low grit sandpaper or files.  If you don't have files, stick some 80g sandpaper to pieces of wood to make some.  one flat piece and one dowel that fits in your tightest curve would do for this.

If you have not used a coping saw before, just remember to clamp the neck firmly with the face up. Make sure the saw is always vertical, and walk the saw on the spot for tight turns.  You don't need to force it, just let the saw do the work

RichAC

Thanks @WezV and @paulnb57 - that’s encouraging. I’m not sure when I’ll get a chance to work on the headstock - it might be next weekend now.

DartmoorHedgehog

As somebody who's never had a router, I definitely agree with the people saying you don't need one to make a decent-looking headstock.  It would be quicker with a router (assuming you already have the template and don't have to make that first) and need less finishing by hand (assuming it doesn't grab and rip bits out of the wood), but careful use of saws and files will do a perfectly good job. People made stuff out of wood before there were routers after all.

What I tend to do for curves is find a suitable jar, coin, plate, etc, to draw round, or one of those artist's "dinosaur" templates if you've got one, then cut almost up to the line before final shaping with a file.  And make sure you keep the saw blade perpendicular to the surface - it's easy to follow the visible line perfectly then find the back is all over the place.

BluesLover

Dinosaur template = french curves, such as

https://www.amazon.co.uk/FRENCH-CURVES-TRANSPARENT-TEMPLATES-STENCILS/dp/B001ENH5X2/ref=asc_df_B001ENH5X2/?tag=googshopuk-21&linkCode=df0&hvadid=214458080830&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=10654271300621211191&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9045802&hvtargid=pla-423435126177&psc=1

jasonbone75

My six tuners were stamped: "R1", "R2", "R2", "R3", "R3", "R4".

Have you measured the heights? Unlikely at this price point but some 6 in line tuner sets have graduated heights.

BillDL

When cutting the headstock to shape cut outside your line and then file or sand it down to the line with a block.  It's very easy to go off the vertical with a saw even though you think you have it at 90 degrees.  It's easier to correct it to 90 degrees with a file or sanding block because you are then seeing the cut edges that you couldn't see while cutting it continuously with a jigsaw or coping saw.  I once had perfectly good results "nibbling" off the corners by doing multiple straight cuts using a fine flat bladed saw and a small metal machinist's square as a vertical guide, and then rounding off the leftover sharp corners  with a sanding block.  It depends entirely on the shape you want, because concave curves obviously couldn't be "nibbled" out that way.

I've just watched a video of a guy calling his YouTube channel "The Next Project" assembling a Harley Benton Tele kit.  He had issues with oversized pilot holes for the scratchplate screws, or else the wrong diameter screws were supplied.  It's probably a common issue with some kits.  He is a fast talker and talks in phrases at times, but in general it was quite a good video and worth watching.  I'm a bit wary that he uses an electric screwdriver for all of the screws, but at least he does the final wind or two with a hand-held screwdriver.

RichAC

jasonbone75 said:

My six tuners were stamped: "R1", "R2", "R2", "R3", "R3", "R4".

Have you measured the heights? Unlikely at this price point but some 6 in line tuner sets have graduated heights.

Yep, I thought of that at the time - they’re all the same. I wondered if they used the same tuners for Gibson-style 3-a-side headstocks and the R meant right… but presumably mine would be L if that were the case.

EDIT: depends on what side of the headstock you’re looking from, of course.

RichAC

BillDL said:

I've just watched a video of a guy calling his YouTube channel "The Next Project" assembling a Harley Benton Tele kit.  He had issues with oversized pilot holes for the scratchplate screws, or else the wrong diameter screws were supplied.  It's probably a common issue with some kits.  He is a fast talker and talks in phrases at times, but in general it was quite a good video and worth watching.  I'm a bit wary that he uses an electric screwdriver for all of the screws, but at least he does the final wind or two with a hand-held screwdriver.

Er… I have a confession to make. I used an electric screwdriver as well. Why’s that bad? 

jasonbone75

RichAC said:

jasonbone75 said:

My six tuners were stamped: "R1", "R2", "R2", "R3", "R3", "R4".

Have you measured the heights? Unlikely at this price point but some 6 in line tuner sets have graduated heights.

Yep, I thought of that at the time - they’re all the same. I wondered if they used the same tuners for Gibson-style 3-a-side headstocks and the R meant right… but presumably mine would be L if that were the case.

EDIT: depends on what side of the headstock you’re looking from, of course.

Yeah, I think the orientation is linked to right and left handed i.e. you fit left hand tuners on the bottom of a reverse headstock with the "tradition" being right handed - like that's new!

It would be more useful if they referred to top and bottom or bass and treble sides of headstock but tradition rarely works that way!

Roland

RichAC said:

… I have a confession to make. I used an electric screwdriver as well. Why’s that bad? 

An electric screwdriver has no clutch, making it more likely to damage the head of a screw. Even a slight deformation of the slot can produce a sharp edge which catches your finger when strumming. 

Electric screwdrivers are also liable to overtighten the screw, tearing out the wood, or starting a split.

BillDL

I wasn't saying that you can't or shouldn't use an electric screwdriver, but I get nervous when I see people using them for small short screws.  I'm pretty sure that electric screwdrivers are the cause of the frequently stripped out holes for scratchplate, control cavity covers and socket plates on budget guitars being put together on fast-paced assembly lines.  If you are working on several guitars a day and are really well practiced at using a fairly low torque electric screwdriver that is easy to control, it certainly saves you from getting a sore wrist, but in general it's just way too easy to overtighten and shear off the screw head, chew up the slots in the head, or strip out the wood.  I have done it several times and cursed myself as I had to extract a broken screw, fill an oversized hole, or try and file sharp rags off the screw heads.

RichAC

Thanks @Roland and @BillDL - duly noted.