What to do? Real amp or modeler?

guitargeek62

@duotone, it was indeed - it built on their previous Spider Valve Mk1&2 collaborations with a digital preamp and valve poweramp. I believe Bogner designed the power amp, spec'd the cabs, etc., but the rest was Line 6 driven.

...which is probably further reason why we haven't seen a HX equivalent, as Line6 have probably taken those sales figures and feedback and determined that the business case is too risky to be viable. I'd also counter that with things like the Kemper powered head etc. as showing that there is a market out there for a pro-level modelling amp still, but it's very much a first-world problem so I shan't lose sleep over it!  

CHRISB50

So far the BluGuitar Amp1 sounds pretty epic from the demos I’ve heard. 

Is it a metal chassis? 

It’s 100W max with a half power switch. Do you have to push it with the volume to get decent tones out of it? 

It sounds really compressed which I quite like. But can’t work out if it’s the gate, or if it’s because it’s being pushed hard. 

DrCornelius

CHRISB50 said:

So far the BluGuitar Amp1 sounds pretty epic from the demos I’ve heard. 

Is it a metal chassis? 

It’s 100W max with a half power switch. Do you have to push it with the volume to get decent tones out of it? 

It sounds really compressed which I quite like. But can’t work out if it’s the gate, or if it’s because it’s being pushed hard. 

I sold mine as I came over all valvey but in my experience -

1 - Plastic I think from memory but very hard wearing
2 - No not at all
3 - I only used the gate at home when messing around with the ultra high gain stuff. I took it to a studio once and jammed with a full band on half power and it sounded fantastic on edge of breakup settings (clean channel with boost on and no gate needed)

Stevepage

I’d recommend an amp that can be loud but work well at low volumes. I use my Engl Powerball at home and it sounds pretty good at low volumes.

so I’d recommend Engl (Screamer, fireball, powerball or Ironball)

Orange Super Crush 100

Peavey JSX

CHRISB50

Cheers @DrCornelius ;

@Stevepage thanks. I’ve been looking at the list of amps in my original post, and I think the Fireball (with gate and power soak) + reverb / delay pedal would cover what I need. I’ve never taken much notice of Engl before but they sound really good from the demos I’ve listened to. 

HT986M2

CHRISB50 said:

Cheers @DrCornelius ;

@Stevepage thanks. I’ve been looking at the list of amps in my original post, and I think the Fireball (with gate and power soak) + reverb / delay pedal would cover what I need. I’ve never taken much notice of Engl before but they sound really good from the demos I’ve listened to. 

I'm just curious if you went ahead with the Fireball 25?  If so, how are you finding it?  While I do have a Helix and FRFR solution myself, I'm looking for a simpler solution to minimise faffing and encourage more playing.

CHRISB50

I haven’t done anything yet. It’s never a quick process with me! 

If I do, I will let you know. 

If you do pull the trigger, let me know what you think. 

Stevepage

HT986M2 said:

CHRISB50 said:

Cheers @DrCornelius ;;

@Stevepage thanks. I’ve been looking at the list of amps in my original post, and I think the Fireball (with gate and power soak) + reverb / delay pedal would cover what I need. I’ve never taken much notice of Engl before but they sound really good from the demos I’ve listened to. 

I'm just curious if you went ahead with the Fireball 25?  If so, how are you finding it?  While I do have a Helix and FRFR solution myself, I'm looking for a simpler solution to minimise faffing and encourage more playing.

No mate I went with the full blown Powerball, which until I get back into a band is used every so often in my spare room at home at low levels. Most of the time I practice using Neural DSP plugins. Haven’t tried using the Powerball into a DAW just yet

monquixote

I have a GT-1000 but I use the DSL40 pretty much all the time.

It sounds great at low volumes.

CHRISB50

I'm now decided. I'll be going down the digital route.

So, Helix or Kemper?

I'm not and never have been a massive user of effects. Only really use delay and reverb.

I've been doing a bit of research and the general consensus seems to be that Helix has better effects, Kemper better amp sounds. Also Kemper does hi gain better.

Any experiences?

I've had a listen to some patches online and I am tending to agree with the above. Hi gain amp tones sound better through a Kemper.

grappagreen

CHRISB50 said:

I'm now decided. I'll be going down the digital route.

So, Helix or Kemper?

I'm not and never have been a massive user of effects. Only really use delay and reverb.

I've been doing a bit of research and the general consensus seems to be that Helix has better effects, Kemper better amp sounds. Also Kemper does hi gain better.

Any experiences?

I've had a listen to some patches online and I am tending to agree with the above. Hi gain amp tones sound better through a Kemper.

Either of them do everything very well.

I'm a Kemper man personally. The fact that Kemper is a profiler means that you can always find what you're looking for as it's not limited to certain 'models'. I would also argue that the Kemper FX are high quality and flexible. I've never once felt that the Kemper was the limiting factor in my sound.

willo

@CHRISB50 I don't have hands on Kemper experience, but I do with the Helix. The thing I'd try to make sure, when getting opinions and demos of the Helix, is whether they are recent or not (i.e. post 3.5 release, which was around the last year). That's when the entire Helix cab/micing system got overhauled and it improved the quality of sounds across the board. Personally, the Helix works for me because of workflow (it's a full audio interface, great app and decent onboard workflow for setting up), sounds are great for me, and the constant run of updates and new features (added a bunch of new amps, a Nobels ODR1, a Nobels bass pre-amp and a Digitech Freqout in the last couple of months, years after launch).

Musicwolf

CHRISB50 said:

I'm now decided. I'll be going down the digital route.

So, Helix or Kemper?

I'm not and never have been a massive user of effects. Only really use delay and reverb.

I've been doing a bit of research and the general consensus seems to be that Helix has better effects, Kemper better amp sounds. Also Kemper does hi gain better.

Any experiences?

I've had a listen to some patches online and I am tending to agree with the above. Hi gain amp tones sound better through a Kemper.

I own both and I'll refer you to an answer which I gave on a different thread

https://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/comment/3755810/#Comment_3755810

As @grappagreen says above - either will do the job.

CHRISB50

Thanks @grappagreen @willo and @Musicwolf ;

Voxman

The Vox Valvetronix VT20X and VT40X offer a convenient lightweight mix of valve and digital modelling. Ideal for home use and even jamming with friends, open mic nights and even smaller gigs, with a built in attenuator and headphone socket, these sound great and are incredibly versatile.

The valve isn't a gimmick that merely warns the sound but it's actually used as a power valve which is what gives a tone, feel and response much nearer to an all tube amp than digital modelling on its own can typically do. Even has bias settings. Best of both worlds perhaps?

Jay100

I’ve never been able to get a tube amp to sound good at ‘reasonable’ home volume despite my best efforts and a lot of money. 

Tried attenuators and amps with supposedly good master volumes, but the speaker still needs to move enough air to sound/feel good and that point is just too much, in my house anyway.

I bought a Quad Cortex and some Adam monitors in the end and haven’t looked back. Sounds great, has loads of flexibility and keeps my family happy. 

It’s never going to give the amp in the room feel, but it feels surprisingly good to play. 

Just my 2 cents!

CHRISB50

Voxman said:

The Vox Valvetronix VT20X and VT40X offer a convenient lightweight mix of valve and digital modelling. Ideal for home use and even jamming with friends, open mic nights and even smaller gigs, with a built in attenuator and headphone socket, these sound great and are incredibly versatile.

The valve isn't a gimmick that merely warns the sound but it's actually used as a power valve which is what gives a tone, feel and response much nearer to an all tube amp than digital modelling on its own can typically do. Even has bias settings. Best of both worlds perhaps?

Not something I'd considered. Cheers.

But with the amount of love dedicated modelers seem to be getting, I think I'm still headed down that route.

CHRISB50

Jay100 said:

I’ve never been able to get a tube amp to sound good at ‘reasonable’ home volume despite my best efforts and a lot of money. 

Tried attenuators and amps with supposedly good master volumes, but the speaker still needs to move enough air to sound/feel good and that point is just too much, in my house anyway.

I bought a Quad Cortex and some Adam monitors in the end and haven’t looked back. Sounds great, has loads of flexibility and keeps my family happy. 

It’s never going to give the amp in the room feel, but it feels surprisingly good to play. 

Just my 2 cents!

Sure. I know what you mean.

To be honest the best home tube tone I've had was from a 100W JCM900 head I used to have. Sounded good at any volume. But a bit big and OTT for my uses now.

How do you find the Quad? 

Jay100

CHRISB50 said:

Jay100 said:

I’ve never been able to get a tube amp to sound good at ‘reasonable’ home volume despite my best efforts and a lot of money. 

Tried attenuators and amps with supposedly good master volumes, but the speaker still needs to move enough air to sound/feel good and that point is just too much, in my house anyway.

I bought a Quad Cortex and some Adam monitors in the end and haven’t looked back. Sounds great, has loads of flexibility and keeps my family happy. 

It’s never going to give the amp in the room feel, but it feels surprisingly good to play. 

Just my 2 cents!

Sure. I know what you mean.

To be honest the best home tube tone I've had was from a 100W JCM900 head I used to have. Sounded good at any volume. But a bit big and OTT for my uses now.

How do you find the Quad? 

I really like it. Had a Helix LT before which I was less keen on. The amps felt and sounded little ‘2D’ but the Quad Cortex feels better to play and the amps have a richer sound, if all those descriptions don’t sound like total nonsense!

The QC is getting better all the time now with the desktop editor being released and plugin integration on its way too.

Voxman

CHRISB50 said:

Voxman said:

The Vox Valvetronix VT20X and VT40X offer a convenient lightweight mix of valve and digital modelling. Ideal for home use and even jamming with friends, open mic nights and even smaller gigs, with a built in attenuator and headphone socket, these sound great and are incredibly versatile.

The valve isn't a gimmick that merely warns the sound but it's actually used as a power valve which is what gives a tone, feel and response much nearer to an all tube amp than digital modelling on its own can typically do. Even has bias settings. Best of both worlds perhaps?

Not something I'd considered. Cheers.

But with the amount of love dedicated modelers seem to be getting, I think I'm still headed down that route.

Depends on your needs and how much tweaking you're prepared to do. Modern mfx are not plug n play, and you' re likely to have a steep learning curve (but see below) I also don't recommend them for use with a guitar amp.  To get the best out of them and if you want to use their amp and cab models, studio monitoring headphones and FRFR powered speakers are the best approach.

Yes, I know some folk love using their mfx 4 cable with their tube amp. But real success stories are rare as most folk struggle with this set up. I've got 3 tube and 3 hybrid amps and my Pod Go sounds best through my Headrush FRFR 108s.  You can put an MFX through the fx return of an amp, whereby it's being used as a power amp only but youll likely want to turn the cab models off.

Although it doesn't fit my gigging needs and I'm returning it, I've been trying out the Valeton GP200 which I'm very impressed with. Simpler and less complex than my Pod Go it sounds really good and is as good as Pod Go tonally that has Helix modeling!  It feels very robust and well made with lots of good features. Very easy to get great tones from and even the factory patches are good.  These are terrific bang for buck and are well worth checking out. Sonicake, who make the Valeton, have a Facebook page that often have discounts and a no quibble 30 day return offer.