Paypal- freezing money in a dispute- Illegal.

stickyfiddle

ICBM;451010" said:

stickyfiddle said:



Of course - it's in the Telegraph! But it's still a ridiculous proposition. The next step will be a unified EU sales tax to make things "easier".





I agree, but saying that we would be "better off out of Europe" and thus facing even more trade barriers to sell anything into the EU is cutting off your nose to spite your face, and putting it as the last sentence in an otherwise useful article is childish and reduces its credibility. I expected better even of the Torygraph.

Yes, of course. I'd rather we had what Iceland has - no membership but great trade agreements and none of the bureaucracy. Unfortunately it took a massive credit default and a couple of very hard years for them to get it. 

I don't understand the black/white argument that most pro-EU people use, suggesting that we couldn't leave but also make agreements with all members to keep the trade agreements.

Eventually someone will leave the EU, whether it's us or Greece or whoever, and it'll be a defining event when it happens- it may well kill the EU entirely, which is why all the EU bods don't want it to happen.

chillidoggy

No doubt there's thousands of shiny-arsed, pen-pushing EU bastards on big fat expense accounts that are hoping their gravy-train monster never ends.

ICBM

stickyfiddle said:

I don't understand the black/white argument that most pro-EU people use, suggesting that we couldn't leave but also make agreements with all members to keep the trade agreements.

We could, but it would likely not be as easy as the anti-EU people say - especially if the EU does start to fall apart, since the inevitable consequence will be protectionism. I don't think it's a black and white issue - I am very opposed to the Eurocracy and its creeping undemocratic dictatorship, but I think it's a huge mistake to think that leaving would be any kind of answer. Staying in and fighting to make it better is the answer. We could also start by doing as most of the other countries have long ago realised they could, and simply ignore a lot of what they don't like… it's almost as if our government comply to the letter on purpose to blame someone else.

For a perfect example, if we leave Europe - even to stay within a trade area - we have not the slightest chance of influencing things like this VAT regulation.

Sambostar

I think the problem is that our government make most of the rules.  They do like to shoot themselves in both feet, I don't know why, excellent bureaucrats,  great butt hole munchers but lousy politicians and diplomats I guess.  Oh and they ALWAYS like to adopt a new Directive into national legislation straight away, which gives the rest of the Euro businesses a 5 year competitive advantage, if they adopt it at all, almost as if they WANT to drive us into the ground.

All great Empires have fallen when they get too big and overstretch themselves.  The EU is no different, the idealists even want hold of Russia in the longer term.  Either the rules need to change or we need to leave.

It is supposed to be about bringing the rest of the world up to speed, I agree with that part, but not reducing the developed world to a third world country with cowboy capitalism and poverty earnings and massive inflation.  Look at where the money is being sucked away to.  We have never had such a poor pay packet to GDP.

It won't be Greece or the UK that bring Europe down, it will be Germany, as they have no domestic market whatsoever.  Come the crunch the Krauts will fall and fall hard and the people know it and want change, but the government ploughs on regardless.

Look at where this is leading.  I would rather pay higher prices and more tax and have a better quality of life than get all sorts of useless shit for cheap, massive house price inflation, unaffordable necessities, roads that leave you waiting two hours for a 10 minute journey.

bingefeller

@Gassage is the French dude saying he never got the item you sent?

thecolourbox

For all the good and bad of being in or out, ive always thought that if we had stronger leaders like the countries who seem to do best out of it, we might have more chance of getting more how we want it. Last few governments and leaders have been too weak and petty in my view, or distracted by vanity projects

Back to the topic though, good on you for pointing it out to PayPal. Though its easy for them to be nice about it when theyve been sussed as they can rely on 99% of others not to suss it!

crunchman

ICBM said:

For a perfect example, if we leave Europe - even to stay within a trade area - we have not the slightest chance of influencing things like this VAT regulation.

From my understanding, this particular one wouldn't be a problem if we left Europe.

We wouldn't be liable to collect VAT for the French/German/Polish etc. governments if we weren't in the EU.  Sales within the UK for a band selling a few tracks would be under the VAT threshold so life is simple for small businesses again.

Amazon, Feebay etc. would no longer be able to scam the system by paying VAT at a lower rate in Luxembourg which they can currently do.  If they sold stuff here they would have to pay UK VAT.

As an example, if I buy something from the States online I don't think I have to pay local sales tax on it.  This would surely be a similar situation.  If I go over a certain threshold then there are customs charges, but for small transactions it's fine.  I've definitely bought ebooks direct from US publishers (to avoid lining Amazon/Luxembourg pockets) without needing to pay any sales tax.

If I buy something from the States that attracts VAT and import duties etc. then it's my duty to pay it not the sellers.

The best thing they could do is kick Luxembourg out of Europe.  It's their VAT rate and welcoming of tax dodging corporations that has bought this about in the first place.

Gassage

bingefeller said:

@Gassage is the French dude saying he never got the item you sent?

Yup

imalone

crunchman said:

ICBM said:

For a perfect example, if we leave Europe - even to stay within a trade area - we have not the slightest chance of influencing things like this VAT regulation.

From my understanding, this particular one wouldn't be a problem if we left Europe.

We wouldn't be liable to collect VAT for the French/German/Polish etc. governments if we weren't in the EU.  Sales within the UK for a band selling a few tracks would be under the VAT threshold so life is simple for small businesses again.

Amazon, Feebay etc. would no longer be able to scam the system by paying VAT at a lower rate in Luxembourg which they can currently do.  If they sold stuff here they would have to pay UK VAT.

They would still be able to scam the system, see Starbucks' arrangements to transfer profits overseas. Multinationals can get round rules unless there's a coordinated effort to prevent them.

bingefeller

Gassage said:

bingefeller said:

@Gassage is the French dude saying he never got the item you sent?

Yup

That sucks.  Hope you get it sorted.