Amp Reverb. What's the point?

mani

For recording I much prefer a spring reverb in the amp - seems like a whole lot more ambience is captured.

I don't mind digital emulations, but my first choice is a Fender style spring reverb - just don't push an amp over.  :-O

Voxman

Skarloey said:

Amp reverb units like the Accutronics can be high maintenance.

I speak as someone who had one...er....tank on me.

Never had any problems with the Accutronic (aka Sound Enhancements) spring reverb units in either my Laney VC30-210, or Marshall DSL401.

ICBM

Voxman said:

Skarloey said:

Amp reverb units like the Accutronics can be high maintenance.

I speak as someone who had one...er....tank on me.

Never had any problems with the Accutronic (aka Sound Enhancements) spring reverb units in either my Laney VC30-210, or Marshall DSL401.

Failure on the transducer bobbin at the output end of recent Accutronics units of the newer push-connector type is extremely common. Easily the most frequent cause of dead reverb tanks.

Older ones are much better, as were older Beltons - if they broke, it was almost always at the phono jack connection and was easy to repair. Unfortunately when Belton bought Accutronics a few years ago they adopted the newer Accutronics design.

Sassafras

There's another maker of reverb tanks that are supposed to be much better than accutronics, I just can't think of their name at the moment.

Someone on here must be able to jog my memory.

smigeon

I think it's the TAD ones - e.g. from Thomann...

ICBM

Hammond originally, also Gibbs - these are basically the same as older Accutronics, they were all the same company really.

Nowadays the only ones I know of other than Accu-Bell (Accutronics-Belton) are the ones sold by Tube Amp Doctor. I don't know the actual manufaturer, but they don't have the same design flaw so I would be inclined to use them instead. There are many unbranded ones that you find in cheap Chinese and Korean amps as well, and none of those use the same design either! Although they don't generally sound all that good.

AbandonMute

I think the main reason it's still on amps is a legacy from the olden days. The only significant benefit I see these days is for guys who insist on a single cable between guitar and amp and no effects loops.

For everyone else I agree it's more suitable to choose a reverb that suits your style. I've never played an amp reverb and thought 'that's the only ambience I'm going to want' (then again I haven't played many of these holy grail old Fenders).

 

Misty

I'm probably old school, but my amps must have reverb. In my humble opinion, for guitar at least, a good spring reverb can't be beaten, and although some of the pedals out there do a great job, putting a reverb pedal into the front end of an amp introduces, for me, new problems such as hiss or, if the amp is set to break up even a little, distorted reverb, which isn't nice. OK I could put it in my amp's loop, but then it's more cables....I like things kept simple. 

That said, I've had those problems with Accutrionics reverb tanks as mentioned above, on several different units, and it's a pain, but in answer to Sassafras's question, apparently the ones to go for are the MOD ones, available from Amplified Parts in the USA. I have one in my Dr Z Maz Sr; it replaced the original Accutronics unit, and it sounds good. Dr Z fits them as standard now.

I also have an old Deluxe Reverb, and to me that reverb is an absolutely vital part of the whole experience of using that amp. 

ICBM

One thing that's a bit daft is that amps with digital reverb almost always only have a reverb mix knob - which considering the power of the DSP unit that's used to generate it, it would be very easy to provide a couple more knobs - probably on the back, because you're unlikely to need them as often it is true - to select reverb type, time, tone etc.

A great example is the Marshall Vintage Modern - it has digital reverb, but the chosen parameters make it sound small and lifeless instead of deep and lush, and it you turn up further it's just the same but louder, rather than longer or deeper.

Even though the 'reverb' control on a classic Fender is also just a reverb mix, it does work as a time control to some extent as well, especially when the amp is up louder, since the vibration from the speakers then feeds back into it and makes it sustain longer. This is a classic low-technology happy accident that just naturally works! And is difficult to emulate with a digital.

Dave_Mc

ICBM said:

A *good* spring reverb is a thing of beauty and sounds fantastic, especially in a combo where it picks up vibration from the speakers and adds more complexity than a digital will - I'm surprised you don't like the reverb in old Fenders... but if you don't, you don't! It's not wrong, just taste. (Or lack of :-P .)

A bad spring reverb - which includes many solid-state-driven ones in more modern amps, and even some valve-driven ones - is really not as good as a decent digital. Digitals are now really good-sounding - although some suffer from poorly-chosen parameters which aren't accessible on the amp (eg Marshall Vintage Modern) - and are much more reliable than most modern spring reverb tanks.

I'd take a good digital over a bad solid-state or valve reverb, a good solid-state over a bad digital or valve, and a good valve reverb over anything. If that makes sense .

+1

I like a good amp-based spring reverb but the one in my genz benz black pearl, at least to my tastes, is horrible. To add insult to injury, some bright spark decided not to make it footswitchable, either, which means mine stays off all the time. If it were footswitchable I reckon I could find a passable setting for occasional use at least- but I haven't come close to finding a setting which I'd want to have on all the time (or even most of the time).

Jeremiah

What's the point of having EQ on an amp when you could use a pedal?

p90fool

Jeremiah;500988" said:

What's the point of having EQ on an amp when you could use a pedal?

True. I guess we all have ideas about what should or shouldn't be built into the amp.
I like on-board reverb, but don't like amps with built-in distortion for example. I can line up half a dozen overdrive or fuzz pedals then pick and choose whichever I want in an instant. As soon as you put it in the amp you're lumbered with the same one all the time.

I guess that's how some people feel about reverb.

Bellycaster

Funny how peoples opinions vary. I'm only speaking for me, but before I started playing Guitar properly again after a long hiatus, I was under the impression that just about every amp had Reverb built in. so back then the question would have been reversed due to my former lack of knowledge.

"What's the Point of a Reverb Pedal?"

It's an awakening now to realise just how many amps DO NOT have reverb Built in, I still almost take it for granted because my former experiences with amps always gave me reverb on tap, even the cheapest, shittiest amps I owned from starting out had reverb on them.

I won't buy an Amp without Reverb now, because:

a) I don't have sodding room on my pedalboard for a Reverb Pedal.

b) Well, I don't need a "b)" because the "a)" was so brilliant.

:-)

richardhomer

Surely most plays only use a small amount of reverb to make things sound less 'flat' when playing at home? In which case, the need for 'quality' is a moot point.

All older Fender amps' reverbs have sounded very good to me - similarly Mk Series Boogies and some later Mesas, such as Lonestars.

I'm with @Bellycaster - I've never really seen the 'point' of a reverb pedal.

JohnPerry

Have you got one to see the point of?

richardhomer

JohnPerry;501379" said:

Have you got one to see the point of?

Clearly not.....

iseverynamegone

I love the reverb on my Marshall Club and Country.

Never owned a reverb pedal so if someone wants to send me a Big Sky so I can run some comparisions and report back is be happy to oblige ...

Richardj

As I play mostly at home reverb on the amp is a bit of a must.  I don't see how you can compare an amp with a proper spring reverb to anything digital.  It is fundamental to the sound of my Twin for sure.  It also depends on what type of reverb sound you want.  I have my ZCat for the big ambient swooshy stuff.

meltedbuzzbox

Adam_MD said:

Anybody used a Hall of fame in front of the amp rather than a loop?  I don't have a loop on my ta-15 and while I don't really use reverb at volume I do like it in a house/small room environment.  Considering how many people I know ave raved about how good the HOF is I've been pretty disappointed with it tbh.  I'm not talking about using the amp for dirt either this is with a clean amp with pedals for drive. 

Im no fan of reverb but I have used the mini HOF and to be fair it sounded half decent. 

It had been changed for a new preset via USB but I have to say it was alright. It wasn't in the loop either. 

ICBM

iseverynamegone said:

I love the reverb on my Marshall Club and Country.

I miss my Club & Country…

That was the amp involved in a funny accident though - when it fell over with the reverb turned up high . If yours has the wheels, make sure you don't roll it directly forward and leave it like that - with all the wheels pointing backwards and the weight of the speakers at the front they are slightly unstable and a small push, or pull on the guitar cable, and the whole thing will fall over! Very luckily I had a right-angle cable in it, so it wasn't damaged. It was behind me and I didn't see it fall over though, so I did need new underpants .

I don't miss the weight of it, it was the amp that started me on the long circular quest for a smaller and lighter amp that sounded as good… but finally ended up with a Mesa Trem-o-verb, because nothing smaller and lighter did. I'd have another C&C at the right price though, it's still probably my favourite Marshall.