To those moaning about concert prices...

Gassage

Take a look at your music collection...any illegal downloads? The simple fact is that the only way artists can monetise their talents is through live shows. The pirating market has killed MCPS fees and others...Lao when moaning, just think about what we, collectively, have done to the recording market.

Myranda

OK, and for those of us willing to still spend hundreds a year on CDs who don't download illegally.

Can I still moan about the cost of concert tickets?

Can I also moan that Ticketmaster is scalping itself with "Getmein"? AC DC tickets at "any price, any area" comes up as nothing... but GetMeIn has them... starting at £215 for seats so far back you might as well buy the DVD when it comes out.

joeyowen

I'll happily share the blame, when the people who turned it from an art to a cooperate business share it with me.

There's a lot more to this than the users

MrSwanson

I spent £12.50 last week to see a gig, which was undoubtedly one of the best I've ever been to! This was an American artist who after all the costs of the venue, paying all the crew etc couldn't have been making much money. Anything over £50 - 60 is pretty extortionate and I've been to plenty over that price bracket!

ThorpyFX

Get mein and services like it are a serious travesty. How are they allowed to sell the tickets at one price, claim they are sold out and then sell them minutes later on get mein et Al. Scandalous legitimised touting.

Paul_C

I had a brief flirtation with Napster and Limewire when I first got online, I haven't acquired anything illegally for years as it never sat comfortably with me even though I found ways to justify it to myself.

martinw

Yes, I can see why those multi-millionaires need to charge £100 a ticket.

Drew_TNBD

joeyowen said:

I'll happily share the blame, when the people who turned it from an art to a cooperate business share it with me. 

Why can't it be both?

monquixote

Gassage said:

Take a look at your music collection...any illegal downloads? 

None

Can I moan about concert tickets now?

Gassage

I totally agree re the secondary touting but it's not the point I made. And, it's pretty much a fact what I said....artists make nowt from recordings in comparison to yesteryear

Gassage

joeyowen said:

I'll happily share the blame, when the people who turned it from an art to a cooperate business share it with me.

There's a lot more to this than the users

Google early adopter/commoditisation model....it's happened to music as it did with iron and steel

joeyowen

Drew_fx;548549" said:

 Why can't it be both?

Like I said I'll happily state the blame. Tbh, I haven't used torrents in many years, as I use Spotify. But even that doesn't feel like the most legitimate way.

There are many to blame for the change

FelineGuitars

The things that annoy the hell out of me :

Ticketmaster or whoever owning their own secondary ticketing companies like GetMeIn etc and ripping off fans and the artists too.

Obscene ticket prices

paying to print my own ticket

Gigs that start at 6.30 and end by 9.30 so the venue can have a student club night afterwards - I mean who cn get to a gig by 6.30 if they work and don't work in town.

harpo

'Booking fees' wtf are they all about?

John_P

+1 and wisdom to all those points.

I don't download with paying for it - crikey it's cheap enough now.

I'm happy to pay to see bands - musicians deserve to get paid,  I would ask in return that people put on a good show.    

I don't like having to pay the extra's to agencies,  it's a bit frustrating when some acts go on silly early (or silly late).

While we're moaning I would love more gigs in yorkshire - I can't take time of work outside the hols, so some gigs are impossible to get to and we do have some nice venues up here.

Moe_Zambeek

The whole Ticketmaster / Getmein thing is scandalous. How that is legal is beyond me.

I have no illegal downloads either but I no longer care about ticket prices - I'm now of the opinion stadium shows are largely rubbish for the listener and you may as well watch on DVD. Anything bigger than Barrowland loses the atmosphere and connection between band and fan that makes live music a worthwhile experience...and you'd get 3 or 4 gigs at that scale for the price of an enormo show.

Gassage

Moe_Zambeek said:

The whole Ticketmaster / Getmein thing is scandalous. How that is legal is beyond me.

I have no illegal downloads either but I no longer care about ticket prices - I'm now of the opinion stadium shows are largely rubbish for the listener and you may as well watch on DVD. Anything bigger than Barrowland loses the atmosphere and connection between band and fan that makes live music a worthwhile experience...and you'd get 3 or 4 gigs at that scale for the price of an enormo show.

Go see Coldplay in a stadium....you'll change your mind

randomhandclaps

Gassage said:

Take a look at your music collection...any illegal downloads? The simple fact is that the only way artists can monetise their talents is through live shows. The pirating market has killed MCPS fees and others...Lao when moaning, just think about what we, collectively, have done to the recording market.

Unfortunately, although this seems like a convenient argument it's completely untrue.  As someone who has never downloaded an illegal album (far too obsessed with the physical item), has worked in both recording labels and publishing house and knows several managers and TMs of currently active bands from the gargantuan to the tiny I can safely tell you that the 'demise' of the music industry has very little to do with downloading and completely to do with money men and the dinosaurs that milked the cow during the prime years of popular music effectively pulling up the rope ladder behind them.

Firstly to look at the money men.  There was a time when labels scouted, researched and invested.  The music industry was about musicians as marketable artists not saleable assets.  This meant that as a labels you lived and died by your ability to spot talent or market it.  Record companies, now being managed by second generation rich kids (which isn't the cause, it's just an aggravating factor) know virtually fucking zilch of music and are obsessed with sales figures. 

People look at the music industry and say "Where are the working class bands tapping into societal conscience?  It's all middle class kids regurgitating trite shit now!".  Will we ever seen a punk or grunge movement again?  Like fuck we will.  The reasoning is really simple. Do what they do and forget about music and look at it like you would stock broking.  Why would you invest your money in a talented working class band on the dole, whose time may not just be now when in reception is a pretty rich girl with acoustic guitar, a ready to go CD daddy paid for, along with a thriving Facebook and Twitter page managed by a design company in the city and topped up with tens of thousand of Facebook likes and imaginary Twitter followers purchased and created illegally  from Mumbai?   

To reference what particularly has kicked of this is David Gilmour's ticket pricing -

How the fuck has illegal downloading effected Gilmour's kitty?  If he was struggling to survive on the multi-millions he made of records in the first 30-40 years prior to downloading, plus the fact his record still rate incredibly high on physical sales, then in reality it isn't his ticket pricing he need to be looking at upping, it's he financial advice.   Thousand of smaller bands are kept going solely because fan still buy physical vinyl and CDs and are more than happy to go to their local venue and pay to get to see them.

Clearly gone are the days when Gilmour could remember sowing the seeds of his success based on a swelling student fan base.  It wasn't old rich people that made Floyd successful, it was youngsters supporting them.  I'm sure loads of struggling young musicians and students are going to be queuing up to spend two weeks food budget on a visit to the RAH.

Like sport in this country it's not attracting the young and the lower classes but rather becoming an elite club.  I would have more respect if he did a Masons only gig.  If Gilmour or the like are that desperately concerned about money then I'd sooner them stay at home and count their fortunes rather than insult us that extra measures like photo IDs ensure us that only 'real fans' can go.  What utter bollocks.

What separates Gilmour success from equivalent and equally talented classical musicians of his era is the size of the fan base.  Classical music has traditionally sold better to the middle and upper classes, whilst popular music has managed to penetrate the far larger market that is provided by the working class.  So to put it quite simply the likes of Gilmour et al owe the larger part of their success and wealth to hard working, lower class people who were willing to invest a larger percentage of their earning into purchasing albums and supporting the band.  The response of the over fat money grabbing dinosaurs, under the advice of their sycophantic accountants it to cut those people out so they can squeeze a bit more cash out before they dive headlong into their graves.  Presumably the extra money will be put towards a solid gold 'middle finger' headstone.

Gilmour and the like owe people fuck all.  They can do what they want.  What they cannot do though is hide from the fact that they are a large factor in a declining music industry.  They don't owe anything to the struggling musicians following up behind them but ultimately their ignorance of this will kill the industry quicker than any amount of illegal downloading.  Classical music and art has survived centuries because patrons have constantly reinvested, passed on knowledge and facilities and taken on apprentices to ensure the art lives on.  The money chasing attitudes of both the business men and the 'legends' with short-memories will ensure that without a serious reform or awakening the relatively infantile popular music world with struggle to function.  Exactly like the majority of the sporting world an industry built on the interest and enthusiasm of the mass populous has been taken over and hijacked as a play thing for the rich and elite.

digitalscream

Gassage said:

I totally agree re the secondary touting but it's not the point I made. And, it's pretty much a fact what I said....artists make nowt from recordings in comparison to yesteryear

The artists charging a fortune for tickets are making a lot of money from their recordings, though. It's generally the ones not making a fortune on recordings who aren't charging so much for concert tickets.

Based on that, it's more a case of supply vs demand. You can charge whatever you want if there are a lot of people willing to pay exhorbitant prices.

EricTheWeary

£100 to be at the back of an arena, over charged on drinks, car parking and merchandise, terrible sound, surrounded by idiots talking and taking selfies. Not really interested.My last arena gig I went to was about £50 a ticket and I think I've drawn the line there.
In December I went to the RSC at £50 a ticket. As a value for money experience this craps on arena gigs and Shakespeare isn't promoting a new album.
Off to see Robert Cray in October. I think that's £30 a ticket, pleasant venue and even the back rows can see him. I might buy a t shirt or CD on top as I won't be spending the evening feeling I'm being fleeced.

randomhandclaps

digitalscream said:

The artists charging a fortune for tickets are making a lot of money from their recordings, though. It's generally the ones not making a fortune on recordings who aren't charging so much for concert tickets.

So repeatedly true and easily provable it succinctly makes a complete nonsense of the motivation being anything other than money-grabbing (which comes down to whether you agree with it or not).  There's no necessity or nobility, it's just business.