ODs with a clean blend? (thread formerly known as "Palmer Root effects")

DarnWeight

Has anyone tried one of these?  Not exactly eye-catching, and a few interesting design choices...the jutty out bits at the back to protect straight jacks, which conversely get in the way of angled ones.  Um, right.  Anyways, that aside, I'm very interested in the overdrive, as (a) it's cheap, and (b) has a clean blend knob a la the Sparkle Drive.  The few youtube demos I've watched have me pretty much convinced, and it would make a good portable alternative to my Liquid Blues, which is absolutely massive.

Any wisdom gratefully received!

DarnWeight

Not getting any joy RE: the original question regarding Palmer FX, so thought I'd broaden it out to encompass OD pedals with a clean blend (like the above-mentioned).  As I said, I have a Damage Control Liquid Blues which pulls this trick off with aplomb...but I'm rehearsing/playing-out semi-regularly now, and I'd like something similar, but smaller, that I can run off a standard 9v DC supply.

So far I'm liking what I've heard of the Way Huge Pork Loin.  Anything else good out there that I've missed?

monquixote

Nova Drive can do this and loads more.

IanSavage

On the cheap the Danelectro Wasabi does it: http://www.gak.co.uk/en/danelectro-wasabi-overdrive/1447?gclid=CLr-p8Df8boCFfLHtAodRxoA5Q

ThePrettyDamned

I tried the Palmer one and it was good for that thing. I don't dig clean blend much, but it did work well. Worked well on bass, too.

Fusionista

Rather surprisingly unsure what you mean by clean-blend - is that level (clean boost) and gain, like the Lovepedal Eternity or the Blackstar HT-Drive  (DC Liquid Blues equivalent ?)

As to Palmer, that's a nice looking spread of no-nonsense pedals.  Like to try them all.

ICBM

Have you tried a Boss ODB-3 Bass Overdrive for guitar? It does have a clean blend.

Personally I like clean blend for bass overdrive but can't stand it for guitar… but that's just me.

IanSavage

ICBM said:

Have you tried a Boss ODB-3 Bass Overdrive for guitar? It does have a clean blend.

Personally I like clean blend for bass overdrive but can't stand it for guitar… but that's just me.

I bloody love my ODB3, haven't tried it on guitar yet though. Think the reason it works so well for bass is that you can get that nice balance between having a bit of aggressive dirt and not losing the kick-in-the-gut punch of the bass...

Fusionista

Ah, I get it.  You mean wet/dry blend.  Why dintcha say so ?

EricTheWeary

I am struggling to get my head around this a bit. I think I understand that a clean blend knob will balance the amount of affected signal against the unaffected signal. Like with a delay pedal you want to hear the original note as well as the delay (well, most of the time) and not just the effect? However, in practice with what is a mono signal into a mono amp ( assuming that's how the OP would use it - and a Sparkle Drive, for example, only has one Out) is it significantly different from careful use of the gain knob on an average OD pedal?

On the Palmer site is a combined delay and compressor pedal which is a new thing to me. Even though I don't really know why I would want that!

DarnWeight

Weird, a big comment I posted just upped and disappeared completely.  Oh well.

Yeah, sorry, wet/dry would cover it...I just think of it as "that Sparkle Drive thing" 'cos that's the most commonly encountered example on 6-string FX.  I'm switching between a Tele and a Bass VI type (Eastwood Sidejack VI) in my current situation, so something bass-friendly would probably be a good thing.

Cirrus

Yeah, I've never been a fan of clean blend on overdrive. It feels like you put on a terrifying monster costume with a cape and mask and huge metal boots but then you turn up the clean blend and it's like you forgot to tuck your willy into the trousers.

ICBM

EricTheWeary said:

However, in practice with what is a mono signal into a mono amp ( assuming that's how the OP would use it - and a Sparkle Drive, for example, only has one Out) is it significantly different from careful use of the gain knob on an average OD pedal?

It's not like turning down the gain at all - that gives you a signal that's either clean or overdriven depending on how hard you play, but never both at the same time.

What you get with a clean blend is the clean signal mixed with an overdriven signal. To me, it sounds dreadful for guitar - like something is broken, where you get a clean signal leaking into the overdriven or like a distorted signal riding on top of the clean. The Sparkle Drive was possibly the worst-sounding overdrive pedal I've ever tried.

It *can* work with two completely separate amps, but not with it going through the same amp in my opinion. But I know some people like it.

For some reason it's completely different for bass - as IanSavage says it works really well, you get the punch and clarity of the clean signal with added edge and dirt. I don't know why it should be so different from guitar, but it is!

Fusionista

EricTheWeary said:

On the Palmer site is a combined delay and compressor pedal which is a new thing to me. Even though I don't really know why I would want that!

Exactly my thoughts  )

DarnWeight

To nail my colours to the mast, I think it only really works on guitar for light to medium drive sounds.  An overly-filthy drive sound with pristine clean blended in does sound a bit "fake" somehow.  Most of the drives I'm researching fall into this low-to-med gain territory.

I was particularly interested in the Pork Loin because it differs a bit from all the others...the clean side goes through a preamp stage ("modified classic British" according to the ad copy), so you get a bit of "colour" added rather than a pure, dry unaffected tone.

DarnWeight

Fusionista said:

Rather surprisingly unsure what you mean by clean-blend - is that level (clean boost) and gain, like the Lovepedal Eternity or the Blackstar HT-Drive  (DC Liquid Blues equivalent ?)

Basically a mix control to let you blend some of the unaffected clean signal back in to the output.  Don't think either of the ones you mentioned has that specifically.

ThePrettyDamned said:

I tried the Palmer one and it was good for that thing. I don't dig clean blend much, but it did work well. Worked well on bass, too.

Cheers, a genuine first-hand account!  Sounds like it might be a good option for me.

ICBM said:

Have you tried a Boss ODB-3 Bass Overdrive for guitar? It does have a clean blend.

Personally I like clean blend for bass overdrive but can't stand it for guitar… but that's just me.

Yeah, some think it just sounds a bit "fake", and I can see how that might grate.  I like it!  I do have to switch between 6-string and a Bass VI type guitar (Eastwood Sidejack VI) with my current setup, so something bass-friendly might be doubly useful.  

monquixote

The bass big muff does it. 

The EBS Mutlidrive does it, but you can't control the amount. 

There are a few wet/dry boxes designed for bass players you could try.

EDIT: It's just occured to me that I have a Multidrive I'd be happy to sell if it tickles your pickle.

DarnWeight

And, finally, there's my disappearing comment (at 1208PM above), a full 2 hours after I first clicked "Post"!

Maxi

Clean blend is something normally reserved for bass FX when dealing with O.D or distortion .

For guitar clean blend is useful for things like modulation or delay FX . Who really wants 100% wet mix on reversed delay or reverb ?

You can make a blend circuit daughter board easily to fit most pedals with room to fit an extra blend pot . 

If not the option is to make a loop pedal with the split and blend loop .

Split and blend was one of the first things I made .

Maxi

Where a lot of blend controls will sound good on guitar dirt is where its used to blend something other than clean with dirt .

Like OverDrive / Distortion or different gain or filter stages . Loads of pedal brands simply place a split and blend circuit somewhere in a typical circuit and sell it as a new pedal . They wont call it split and blend control tho .... they will give it some other fancy name like contour or voicing or what ever . ISF ?

That just gave me an idea ....

I make speaker emulation circuits ...

guitarfishbay

http://www.maxonfx.com/vintage-series-effects-pedals/od-820-overdrive-pro

Maxon OD820 will do it. Copy pasted from tech talk -


"The OD820 circuit is basically a hot-rodded 808 with a few special tricks.  After a JFET input buffer, the signal is sent a dual-gang Drive pot where it is split between a clean gain stage and the overdrive stage.  As the Drive knob is turned up, more signal is sent to the overdrive stage while the drive of this stage is also turned up.  If the Drive knob is turned down, more signal is sent to the clean gain stage and the drive of the overdrive stage is turned down.  At 12 o’clock on the Drive knob, signal is split 50/50 clean/overdriven."

I haven't tried one but they actually sound like a good idea for high gain amps. Sometimes a TS boost feels like too much of a change when activated, a blend knob should in theory make it easier to control that so you don't lose all of the original feel/tone.