A throw away society and why I'm scared for the future of our planet.

Fretwired

Phil_aka_Pip said:

@fob You're right. We used to put our glass religiously in the bottle banks by the footie ground. The chap in the pub told us we were wasting our time - he was the driver of the truck that picked the bottle banks up when they were full ... and took them straight to the landfill site.

I wouldn't have thought bottles were buried - they are easy to recycle. My council is poor but they don't bury bottles as the glass is turned in road aggregates - demand is high and money can be made. Our council publishes how much it makes from recycling.

ICBM

Evilmags said:

And lots of old ford's are now hotrods in the US.

Although in many cases the only original component is the Ford badge .

Placidcasual79

You are right to be concerned about the future of the planet. Simply put there is not the political will to meaningfully address the issue. The science is undeniable - unchecked capitalism is not sustainable. The price (amongst other things such as the emotional and physical wellbeing of the majority) is the stability of our planet. 

The measures put in place to address this issue are at best a tokenistic attempt at vote winning. Governments/politicians are transient and short term and therefore unconcerned with addressing longer term issues such as the damage being done to the environment. Of greater significance is the fact that a serious attempt to reduce waste, harmful emissions and the destruction of essential ecology would have drastic repercussions for industry. Politicians, governments and the countries they claim to represent are in hoc to world banks and therefore utterly unable to impose the sanctions required. 

Despite it being inevitable, governments across the world are prepared to sacrifice almost everything to prevent the wheels coming of the capitalist juggernaut. Rather than looking at sustainability or the quality of life enjoyed by the majority, most countries governments prioritise GDP.

The 'throw away' nature of todays society is a result of consumerist culture - a culture created and perpetuated to serve the interests of the powerful. 

It is a sickening inditement of our times that we are shamed into paying for a supermarket shopping bag or fined for not recycling when, on daily basis, governments make deals with big business that disregard environmental issues and serve to line only their own pockets.

These problems are all a direct result of the current prevalent ideology and favoured system of social control - global capitalism. 

scrumhalf

What annoys me is that many of the things we could do to improve our surroundings are classed as being "environmental" and thus off-limits to those who feel that even reading the word will turn them into a tree-hugger.

It needs to be stresses that so much could be done by just not being such an appalling bunch of slobs.

dtr

I'm going to play devil's advocate here...

I reckon most politicians get into it because they want things to be better and reckon they can make a difference.  Then they realise that the only way they can get into power, or stay there, is basically by bribing voters.

People vote on the basis of who promises to make them better off.  Everyone wants to be on the gravy train.  We choose the politicians who are most obliging, so there's no point blaming them.  

People also want cheap stuff.  We can get well built things that last a lifetime, but mostly choose the cheap crap that we can throw away because, hey, it's so cheap!  We choose which companies we give money to, so there's no point blaming the ones getting rich because we want so much of their disposable, exploitative crap.

It's all just us.  We all want to be a bit richer, and we'd all prefer the cat shits in the neighbours' garden than ours.  That's just human nature, and I don't know what can make it change, but it's sure as hell not politicians and businessmen.

Fretwired

Placidcasual79 said:

Despite it being inevitable, governments across the world are prepared to sacrifice almost everything to prevent the wheels coming of the capitalist juggernaut. Rather than looking at sustainability or the quality of life enjoyed by the majority, most countries governments prioritise GDP.

The 'throw away' nature of todays society is a result of consumerist culture - a culture created and perpetuated to serve the interests of the powerful. 

I know what you're saying but it's not all bad news. The EU has introduced new laws and has taxed landfill to make it expensive to bury stuff (some people say this is part of the dumping problem). And where possible goods have to be recyclable - in the UK we now recycle tins, bottles, cardboard, plastics, paper, clothes, shoes, garden and food waste. Car manufacturers have set-up car recycling plants and there are recycling plants for everything from aircraft to computers, household appliances - recycling is big business.

As for the throwaway nature of society some of this is driven by the green agenda - older polluting cars are taxed more and cost more to run so people have opted to buy more fuel efficient vehicles - the government also offered a scrappage scheme to get older polluting vehicles off the road. Improvements in technology mean we buy new TVs and computers to keep up with services etc .. not a problem so long as all this stuff gets recycled and reused.

People are the problem - chucking litter around when there's a bin nearby. Preferring to dump old beds and fridges in the countryside rather than paying their local council to take it away.

All the crap in the sea is a separate issue ... maybe we should pay into a fund that pays for the seas to be cleaned. Maybe we should back this kid ...

therose789

Fretwired said:

Placidcasual79 said:

Despite it being inevitable, governments across the world are prepared to sacrifice almost everything to prevent the wheels coming of the capitalist juggernaut. Rather than looking at sustainability or the quality of life enjoyed by the majority, most countries governments prioritise GDP.

The 'throw away' nature of todays society is a result of consumerist culture - a culture created and perpetuated to serve the interests of the powerful. 

I know what you're saying but it's not all bad news. The EU has introduced new laws and has taxed landfill to make it expensive to bury stuff (some people say this is part of the dumping problem). And where possible goods have to be recyclable - in the UK we now recycle tins, bottles, cardboard, plastics, paper, clothes, shoes, garden and food waste. Car manufacturers have set-up car recycling plants and there are recycling plants for everything from aircraft to computers, household appliances - recycling is big business.

As for the throwaway nature of society some of this is driven by the green agenda - older polluting cars are taxed more and cost more to run so people have opted to buy more fuel efficient vehicles - the government also offered a scrappage scheme to get older polluting vehicles off the road. Improvements in technology mean we buy new TVs and computers to keep up with services etc .. not a problem so long as all this stuff gets recycled and reused.

People are the problem - chucking litter around when there's a bin nearby. Preferring to dump old beds and fridges in the countryside rather than paying their local council to take it away.

All the crap in the sea is a separate issue ... maybe we should pay into a fund that pays for the seas to be cleaned. Maybe we should back this kid ...

I think your last point hit the nail on the head for me, there is a blatant disregard for the earth. In a lot of our amazing countryside you don't have to walk 15 metres before you see a can of energy drink or a mcdonald's wrapper. 

Its lazy and ignorant. 

A friend of mine owns some woodland in durham. Its closed off so the public shouldn't really use it but people dump stuff there all the time, it's awful! 

I think what @dtr said about the human condition rings true but only if you let it. The people who dump stuff are probably thinking that 'at least its not in my yard' which i'm sure most of us would agree is selfish. However, you can choose to do something about it and I feel a lot of people choose to bury their heads in the sand and throw their fridges into the woods. . 

Phil_aka_Pip

Fretwired said:

Phil_aka_Pip said:

@fob You're right. We used to put our glass religiously in the bottle banks by the footie ground. The chap in the pub told us we were wasting our time - he was the driver of the truck that picked the bottle banks up when they were full ... and took them straight to the landfill site.

I wouldn't have thought bottles were buried - they are easy to recycle. My council is poor but they don't bury bottles as the glass is turned in road aggregates - demand is high and money can be made. Our council publishes how much it makes from recycling.

I don't believe that chap was lying. Why would he?

lloyd

Phil_aka_Pip said:

Fretwired said:

Phil_aka_Pip said:

@fob You're right. We used to put our glass religiously in the bottle banks by the footie ground. The chap in the pub told us we were wasting our time - he was the driver of the truck that picked the bottle banks up when they were full ... and took them straight to the landfill site.

I wouldn't have thought bottles were buried - they are easy to recycle. My council is poor but they don't bury bottles as the glass is turned in road aggregates - demand is high and money can be made. Our council publishes how much it makes from recycling.

I don't believe that chap was lying. Why would he?

Can't believe everything a bloke in a pub tells you. Could be lying for a number of reasons. As said before, councils make money from recycling the easy stuff or sell it at a profit to China.

TheBlueWolf

lloyd;1044589" said:

There is nothing you can do as an individual that will make much difference, this comes down to the whole world coming together and sorting it at a higher level.

Doing your bit is important of course as it will normalise it...eventually, but for every person over here turning lights off and reusing plastic bags, there's 50 more throwing everything in the bin.

This.....

As individuals we should all do our bit but it relies on everyone else doing the same

Danny1969

If things were more expensive people might be less inclined to throw them away when they developed a fault. Today I've done an iPhone 6, a Macbook Pro, a Samsung notebook but written off a £199 Acer laptop and an LG TV as the owners wouldn't spend £60 % of the cost to fix those 2 items. 

Things have never been cheaper luxury goods wise but it's all ending up as land fill 

Sambostar

Neighbours all have bins overflowing with food and wrapping.  Me, I produce a carrier bag of waste every fortnight. The recycling bin is full of beer cans, which form 30% of my nutritional needs which I believe get recycled.  I'd be happy to drop the council tax and make people pay for their waste.  All my personal stuff is secondhand from people's garages and kitchens.   Once upon a time everyone was like me, these days we are in the minority.  It's almost like a status symbol to throw out as much as you can.  Out of sight definitely is out of mind.  People who employ cheap fly tippers should be made to physically suffer.  But it's also the mechanisms of out society that don't allow, or worse still, prohibit people from doing things themselves.  This is so wrong IMO.

Also, I know fridges in the woods are actually unsightly, but what damage do they really do?  I would imagine that they boost the local arachnid population for starters.

lloyd

Fridges full of nasty chemicals I believe.

Placidcasual79

Sambostar said:

Neighbours all have bins overflowing with food and wrapping.  Me, I produce a carrier bag of waste every fortnight. The recycling bin is full of beer cans, which form 30% of my nutritional needs which I believe get recycled.  I'd be happy to drop the council tax and make people pay for their waste.  All my personal stuff is secondhand from people's garages and kitchens.   Once upon a time everyone was like me, these days we are in the minority.  It's almost like a status symbol to throw out as much as you can.  Out of sight definitely is out of mind.  People who employ cheap fly tippers should be made to physically suffer.  But it's also the mechanisms of out society that don't allow, or worse still, prohibit people from doing things themselves.  This is so wrong IMO.

Also, I know fridges in the woods are actually unsightly, but what damage do they really do?  I would imagine that they boost the local arachnid population for starters.

Fridges in the woods don't keep your larger cold and are to far a walk from the sofa....

JRL

UnclePsychosis said:

lloyd said:

Modern life creates rubbish/waste/damage, unless we all go back to subsistence living I can't see it going away.

Maybe, but we can change the fact that we generate a truly ridiculous amount of totally unnecessary waste.

Why, when every single large organisation in the UK is at least *pretending* that they are environmentally friendly, do bananas still come in bags in the supermarket? They've got their own fucking wrapping ffs.

There's a lot of idiots that put bunches of loose bananas into the wafer thin fruit and veg bags that you get at supermarkets. As if that's going to give it any more protection!

Axe_meister

Funny how a lot of people blame industry for pollution. Who are industry producing goods for ?
Us of course.

Phil_aka_Pip

lloyd said:

Phil_aka_Pip said:

Fretwired said:

Phil_aka_Pip said:

@fob You're right. We used to put our glass religiously in the bottle banks by the footie ground. The chap in the pub told us we were wasting our time - he was the driver of the truck that picked the bottle banks up when they were full ... and took them straight to the landfill site.

I wouldn't have thought bottles were buried - they are easy to recycle. My council is poor but they don't bury bottles as the glass is turned in road aggregates - demand is high and money can be made. Our council publishes how much it makes from recycling.

I don't believe that chap was lying. Why would he?

Can't believe everything a bloke in a pub tells you. Could be lying for a number of reasons. As said before, councils make money from recycling the easy stuff or sell it at a profit to China.

He wasn't a bloke I'd never seen before and was unlikely to see again. He was like me, a regular in the same pub. There would be ways to find out if he was lying. I still can't think of why he would.

skankdelvar

Sealed plastic bags are essential to the ripening process of bananas, retaining - as they do - the natural gases which turn this humble member of the genus Musa from unprepossessing green-ness to succulent yellow.

Even if bananas are sold loose I always take a plastic bag within which to store them. It would be barbarous to do otherwise.

Sambostar

Barbanabarbarous indeed.

I seriously bet I am King wasteless here though eh, apart from the odd save the planet vegan weirdo.  In terms of vaguely normal people I reckon I am.  I go to the counter and if something is split or whatever, me covered in cow shit or mud or cement, it doesn't bother me in the least and I buy all the out of date shite.  I also would reckon I am the only one who carries a waste carriers licence and doesn't use the Council tip as well and only uses private tips.  I collect other people's shite and recycle it.  I pay a premium to dump stuff, I'm not allowed in the Council Tip.  I have been once in the last ten years and had to dress up as a civilian and pretend I didn't know what I was doing less I break a fingernail. 

I hate wasting things and I hate throwing them away even more.  I even have a pile of cigarette butts in the step of the Transit even though fish like to eat them.

It all started going wrong when they changed Fairy Liquid bottles I reckon.

Given that scrap metal is at an all time low, I can't see things like plastics and paper making a profit right now and there are no where near enough recycling facilities around, it all depends on the private sector to take the initiative.

Around here Yeolia have the contract for green waste with the council, they then dump it at the commercial private green waste recycler.  There is no facility for chipboard and waste wood recycling, although there was talk, there is no money it in, so anything that has been treated CCU you have to landfill (Officially) as it can't be recycled or burnt.  So that is minimum tare 1 tonne, some £140 odd later then.  Civilians don't realise that shit.  Mind you, the modern stuff, under EU rules doesn't have any arsenic so it only lasts 4 years max instead of 10 or 15 so maybe you can burn that.  Farms aren't allowed bonfires.  It's pretty tightly wrapped up.

Flanging_Fred

I have underpants that are older than @Bucket. ; Do I get a Greenpeace gold star?

(or total social rejection?)