Gibson R9 2016 historic or not.

musicalstash

Has anyone got any experience with this particular year of R9s, read online that the build specs vary around this era but not too sure if for the better. 

Also is a R9 historic just a standard r9 with the historic term added to models after 2016 or is there any physical difference which make them more desirable.


Thanks 

meltedbuzzbox

Are you buying the guitar to play or own as a conversation piece?

RandallFlagg

In 2016 the Gibson Custom Shop offered Historic Reissues and the True Historic Reissues.

From memory the Historic R9s would retail for around £4K-£4,500 and the True Historics for around £6,000-£6,500.

I can't recall all the different “upgrades” for the True Historics but they used what Gibson claimed were more accurate plastics, more accurate pickup covers with more a more historically accurate  corner radius, hand sanded tops with more accurate carve, better figured and sometimes lighter woods. 

I think there were a few improvements to the 2014 onwards Historic reissues over the previous years using improved dyes, hide glue, and the improved Custombucker pickups in place of the Burstbuckers. 2014-2016 guitars were considered good quality years and the 2014 upgrades were well received. The R8s had some nice slightly flamey tops around this time as well.

Andertons did a comparison video at the time between the Historic and True Historic and Lee couldn't really find much real world difference for the player, they pretty much felt and sounded the same.

I had a 2016 Historic R8 and it was a fine guitar.

When the True Historic line was dropped I think the new plastics and pickup covers carried over to become standard on what they now just call “reissues” from the Custom Shop. The pickups fitted from 2018 onwards are the “unpotted” Custombuckers with Alnico III magnets.

digitalkettle

I love my Gibsons but what a confusing world of bullshit they’ve built! Where does ‘Collector’s Choice’ and ‘Made 2 Measure’ fit in?

musicalstash

RandallFlagg said:

In 2016 the Gibson Custom Shop offered Historic Reissues and the True Historic Reissues.

From memory the Historic R9s would retail for around £4K-£4,500 and the True Historics for around £6,000-£6,500.

I can't recall all the different “upgrades” for the True Historics but they used what Gibson claimed were more accurate plastics, more accurate pickup covers with more a more historically accurate  corner radius, hand sanded tops with more accurate carve, better figured and sometimes lighter woods. 

I think there were a few improvements to the 2014 onwards Historic reissues over the previous years using improved dyes, hide glue, and the improved Custombucker pickups in place of the Burstbuckers. 2014-2016 guitars were considered good quality years and the 2014 upgrades were well received. The R8s had some nice slightly flamey tops around this time as well.

Andertons did a comparison video at the time between the Historic and True Historic and Lee couldn't really find much real world difference for the player, they pretty much felt and sounded the same.

I had a 2016 Historic R8 and it was a fine guitar.

When the True Historic line was dropped I think the new plastics and pickup covers carried over to become standard on what they now just call “reissues” from the Custom Shop. The pickups fitted from 2018 onwards are the “unpotted” Custombuckers with Alnico III magnets.

Thanks for taking the time out to respond with such an in depth answer it's really appreciated. 

I am going to view one this weekend but it's alot of money and don't want to be stuck with one of the undesirable years ( 2012?) and wasn't sure if this was one of them. 

Will checkout the Andertons video.

Thanks again 

meltedbuzzbox

musicalstash said:

RandallFlagg said:

In 2016 the Gibson Custom Shop offered Historic Reissues and the True Historic Reissues.

From memory the Historic R9s would retail for around £4K-£4,500 and the True Historics for around £6,000-£6,500.

I can't recall all the different “upgrades” for the True Historics but they used what Gibson claimed were more accurate plastics, more accurate pickup covers with more a more historically accurate  corner radius, hand sanded tops with more accurate carve, better figured and sometimes lighter woods. 

I think there were a few improvements to the 2014 onwards Historic reissues over the previous years using improved dyes, hide glue, and the improved Custombucker pickups in place of the Burstbuckers. 2014-2016 guitars were considered good quality years and the 2014 upgrades were well received. The R8s had some nice slightly flamey tops around this time as well.

Andertons did a comparison video at the time between the Historic and True Historic and Lee couldn't really find much real world difference for the player, they pretty much felt and sounded the same.

I had a 2016 Historic R8 and it was a fine guitar.

When the True Historic line was dropped I think the new plastics and pickup covers carried over to become standard on what they now just call “reissues” from the Custom Shop. The pickups fitted from 2018 onwards are the “unpotted” Custombuckers with Alnico III magnets.

Thanks for taking the time out to respond with such an in depth answer it's really appreciated. 

I am going to view one this weekend but it's alot of money and don't want to be stuck with one of the undesirable years ( 2012?) and wasn't sure if this was one of them. 

Will checkout the Andertons video.

Thanks again 

If you like the way it sounds and feels why would you get caught up in all the bullshit?

A good guitar is a good guitar. The certificate, original truss rod adjuster, tenon length and all the other crap doesn't matter

tomajoha

As @RandallFlagg said. 

2016’s are generally v good. 2015 is seen as an avoid year due to a move to short tenons but this was corrected in 2016.

2016 seem to have skipped a lot of the QC issues that crept into 2017 ( and some 2018s) Custom shop stuff when Gibson was piling high and selling cheap and had pissed off most of its long-standing staff.

 As is always the caveat with the big G: there are dogs and diamonds in any year so if it speaks to you it’s probably good enough. Happy strumming 

RaymondLin

digitalkettle said:

I love my Gibsons but what a confusing world of bullshit they’ve built! Where does ‘Collector’s Choice’ and ‘Made 2 Measure’ fit in?

Collector's Choice is a selection of limited edition guitars that is a replica or specific Bursts, like the Beast.  M2M is Gibson's Custom Shop program that makes what you want.  You want a Pink Burst with white binding and gold hardware, they can do that. 

digitalkettle

RaymondLin said:

digitalkettle said:

I love my Gibsons but what a confusing world of bullshit they’ve built! Where does ‘Collector’s Choice’ and ‘Made 2 Measure’ fit in?

Collector's Choice is a selection of limited edition guitars that is a replica or specific Bursts, like the Beast.  M2M is Gibson's Custom Shop program that makes what you want.  You want a Pink Burst with white binding and gold hardware, they can do that. 

Yum! I think CC has finished now(?)...did they ever make a ‘Beano’?

Also, you can get off-the-peg M2M guitars...shrug.

RaymondLin

digitalkettle said:

RaymondLin said:

digitalkettle said:

I love my Gibsons but what a confusing world of bullshit they’ve built! Where does ‘Collector’s Choice’ and ‘Made 2 Measure’ fit in?

Collector's Choice is a selection of limited edition guitars that is a replica or specific Bursts, like the Beast.  M2M is Gibson's Custom Shop program that makes what you want.  You want a Pink Burst with white binding and gold hardware, they can do that. 

Yum! I think CC has finished now(?)...did they ever make a ‘Beano’?

Also, you can get off-the-peg M2M guitars...shrug.

That M2M off the peg is most likely M2M by the store, just like a Fender Custom Shop guitar.  

digitalkettle

musicalstash said:

I am going to view one this weekend but it's alot of money and don't want to be stuck with one of the undesirable years ( 2012?) and wasn't sure if this was one of them. 

I got ‘stuck with’ a 2012 R9...only, that was back in 2012 when there was no stigma

What was the stigma? Partly the two-piece rosewood boards (never confirmed mine...which looks great by the way) and partly the subsequent accuracy shenanigans?

I love it and it’s probably been my most gigged guitar in all that time! Could be a proper bargain if you found one now.

digitalkettle

RaymondLin said:

digitalkettle said:

Yum! I think CC has finished now(?)...did they ever make a ‘Beano’?

Also, you can get off-the-peg M2M guitars...shrug.

That M2M off the peg is most likely M2M by the store, just like a Fender Custom Shop guitar.  

Yep...I was mainly highlighting the confusion they generate...I think I remember the schpiel when M2M came out: your dealer would transport you to a clandestine location where you would be taught to smell the difference between tonewoods in a dimly lit lounge while they inspected your wallet in the back room.

RaymondLin

digitalkettle said:

RaymondLin said:

digitalkettle said:

Yum! I think CC has finished now(?)...did they ever make a ‘Beano’?

Also, you can get off-the-peg M2M guitars...shrug.

That M2M off the peg is most likely M2M by the store, just like a Fender Custom Shop guitar.  

Yep...I was mainly highlighting the confusion they generate...I think I remember the schpiel when M2M came out: your dealer would transport you to a clandestine location where you would be taught to smell the difference between tonewoods in a dimly lit lounge while they inspected your wallet in the back room.

A Gibson Class 5 was an off the peg run from the Custom Shop.  It isn't a Reissue or a M2M or CC or replica.  It's just Custom Shop level of a Les Paul. 

hyperben

A 2012 model might actually be the best bang for your buck. Nothing really wrong with a 2 piece fretboard as long as it plays well and sounds good! You need to convince the seller the guitar isn’t worth the going rate first though   I’d never pay as much for a 2012 as I would for a 2019 model.

musicalstash

Just been sent the serial number it's R96 but the setup certificate is signed 12/12/15.

Would this make it a 2015?  

digitalkettle

R96 = R9 made in 2016

musicalstash

digitalkettle said:

R96 = R9 made in 2016

Thanks,  its more to do with being built to 2016 specs rather than the 2015 model.  

guitars4you

digitalkettle said:

musicalstash said:

I am going to view one this weekend but it's alot of money and don't want to be stuck with one of the undesirable years ( 2012?) and wasn't sure if this was one of them. 

I got ‘stuck with’ a 2012 R9...only, that was back in 2012 when there was no stigma

What was the stigma? Partly the two-piece rosewood boards (never confirmed mine...which looks great by the way) and partly the subsequent accuracy shenanigans?

I love it and it’s probably been my most gigged guitar in all that time! Could be a proper bargain if you found one now.

I recently had a 2012 R9 in the shop - Only way to confirm the 2pc fingerboard is to remove the nut - Do we all need/want to do that - Not all 2012 are 2pc fingerboards - But you have to accept it might be

But now play it - I was conscious of all the negatives such a guitar was going to receive - And I suppose what 'negatives' the 2pc fingerboard would impart on the tonal character/sustain - It certainly won't have any impact on the feel/playability - Bottom line is I played every note expecting to find some nasty dead spots - Not unusual to find a dead spot on any R9, of any age, any era - Could not find one 

Granted a 2pc fingerboard is not historically correct - But I have some news for all 59 LP fans - Gibson have not made an accurate 59 LP since 1959 

Bottom line is the feel, playability and tone 

digitalkettle

guitars4you said:

digitalkettle said:

musicalstash said:

I am going to view one this weekend but it's alot of money and don't want to be stuck with one of the undesirable years ( 2012?) and wasn't sure if this was one of them. 

I got ‘stuck with’ a 2012 R9...only, that was back in 2012 when there was no stigma

What was the stigma? Partly the two-piece rosewood boards (never confirmed mine...which looks great by the way) and partly the subsequent accuracy shenanigans?

I love it and it’s probably been my most gigged guitar in all that time! Could be a proper bargain if you found one now.

I recently had a 2012 R9 in the shop - Only way to confirm the 2pc fingerboard is to remove the nut - Do we all need/want to do that - Not all 2012 are 2pc fingerboards - But you have to accept it might be 

Mine was sold as a 'Yamano spec' (there's an inflammatory term) so I'll admit that I'm curious...but not enough to bother prising the nut out

guitars4you

digitalkettle said:

guitars4you said:

digitalkettle said:

musicalstash said:

I am going to view one this weekend but it's alot of money and don't want to be stuck with one of the undesirable years ( 2012?) and wasn't sure if this was one of them. 

I got ‘stuck with’ a 2012 R9...only, that was back in 2012 when there was no stigma

What was the stigma? Partly the two-piece rosewood boards (never confirmed mine...which looks great by the way) and partly the subsequent accuracy shenanigans?

I love it and it’s probably been my most gigged guitar in all that time! Could be a proper bargain if you found one now.

I recently had a 2012 R9 in the shop - Only way to confirm the 2pc fingerboard is to remove the nut - Do we all need/want to do that - Not all 2012 are 2pc fingerboards - But you have to accept it might be 

Mine was sold as a 'Yamano spec' (there's an inflammatory term) so I'll admit that I'm curious...but not enough to bother prising the nut out

exactly

tomajoha

guitars4you said:

digitalkettle said:

musicalstash said:

I am going to view one this weekend but it's alot of money and don't want to be stuck with one of the undesirable years ( 2012?) and wasn't sure if this was one of them. 

I got ‘stuck with’ a 2012 R9...only, that was back in 2012 when there was no stigma

What was the stigma? Partly the two-piece rosewood boards (never confirmed mine...which looks great by the way) and partly the subsequent accuracy shenanigans?

I love it and it’s probably been my most gigged guitar in all that time! Could be a proper bargain if you found one now.

I recently had a 2012 R9 in the shop - Only way to confirm the 2pc fingerboard is to remove the nut - Do we all need/want to do that - Not all 2012 are 2pc fingerboards - But you have to accept it might be

But now play it - I was conscious of all the negatives such a guitar was going to receive - And I suppose what 'negatives' the 2pc fingerboard would impart on the tonal character/sustain - It certainly won't have any impact on the feel/playability - Bottom line is I played every note expecting to find some nasty dead spots - Not unusual to find a dead spot on any R9, of any age, any era - Could not find one 

Granted a 2pc fingerboard is not historically correct - But I have some news for all 59 LP fans - Gibson have not made an accurate 59 LP since 1959 

Exactly, the woods are wrong, the lacquers wrong etc etc. On raw materials alone they will never be what they were.

I personally don’t mind what spec it is along as it plays well.