Football - Euro 2020 Championship

Creed_Clicks

How many of the England or Italian squad are strat players and how many are tele players? I reckon Mancini would be a strat player.

Yorkie

TheBigDipper said:

I'm too biased towards England to be able to make any meaningful comment about them. I'm proud of their achievement and it's no disgrace to come second against the best team in the tournament.

If Italy hadn't conceded early and lost their way for much of the first half, I think England would have struggled more than they did. Mancini has built a national team and a plan that knows how to win and knows how not to lose when winning is difficult. 

So, congratulations Italy and well done England. Onwards and upwards! 

Couldn't have said it better. They'll get nothing but praise from me. 

Jon

Bidley

YellowLedBetterMan said:

Bidley said:

Big club bias is nonsense. Phillips played every game, as did Rice. Both their clubs are at a similar level to Villa in the PL.

Not really the point I'm trying to make. It's not big club bias that Grealish didn't start. It's Mason Mount having a great season for Chelsea, Grealish being out for the majority of the last 6 months with "shin splints". Plus, after Mount had been the starter for the majority of the tournament, would it be fair to suddenly drop him in the final? I don't think so.

I was replying to crunchman's comment that big club bias may have been a factor in Grealish not starting.

Chuffola

Poor England performance in that match - the tournament was all but set up for them and to play that defensively in a home final is very disappointing. Southgate not the tactical genius some claimed. Subs were awful and not having Henderson, Sterling or Grealish as penalty takers is just bizarre. Expecting 2 players who hadn't really touched the ball to take pens and then putting a 19 year old who's never been in this position as 5th taker was madness. 

Harry Kane was poor as well and why he's captain I'll never understand. Not one touch in the box or shot on goal from a world class striker is mind-boggling. 

meltedbuzzbox

We all know why Southgate doesn't pick grealish,  he doesn't like the way he wears his socks

Jonathanthomas83

I have no skin in the game being a proud Welshman, but to overlook Sancho and Rashford for pretty much the entire tournament and then fuss and fart about with their substitution, giving them the least possible on field minutes as he could just so they could take a penalty each...IN THE FINAL, is a bit of a piss take, in my humble opinion. Very disappointing.

Secondly, as far as I'm aware, and am happy to be corrected, Southgate chose the penalty takers, so blaming Grealish and Sterling for not stepping up is a bit much.

Seems Southgate is as good at picking a penalty taker as he is at taking them!

viz

Creed_Clicks said:

@viz ill assume you’re on the wind up then. “Sackable offence” ffs. At least you admitted you don’t know anything about football.
On a side note what about the general thuggery, again, by some England fans outside the stadium and online. 

No, I’m not on the wind up, and thank you for saying ffs to me. It looked like common assault to me, but then I don’t have any interest in the game so I’ll leave you to it. Oh, and yes, some of the behaviour of the England audience outside and online was utterly disgraceful, as usual.

crunchman

Something as cynical as that foul on Saka at the end of normal time should be a straight red.  It's just blatant cheating.

joeyowen

Unlucky guys!

Great tournament for you, but in the end it just came down to experience.  Italy have a very mature squad, they know how to handle pressure, manage a game etc....  They are unbeaten in 34 games now, it's astonishing. 

If England can keep the younger players playing, and hopefully not crucify them after this, it may come good yet.

Remember Italy didn't even qualify for the World Cup just a few years ago!

Snap

Italy deserved the win. After about 30 minutes they commanded the game. 
Quite funny that for all the talk about the team being set up more defensively, that the goal was scored by our number three after a charging attacking run from Trippier.

Not sure what the slating of Mount and Rice is about, I think they have had a very good tournament. Tbh, they all have, we just came up short against a revitalised Italian team. 

The choice of penalty takers was a bit bizarre though. 

Not sure about the idea of starting with Grealish. He is a cracking option to have on the bench as he does change the game, most of the time, but not every time. 

Very disappointed this morning, but not really surprised.

Creed_Clicks

@viz come on, common assault really? You should check out Australian rules football, rugby, Gaelic football, hurling, where you would see far worse within the rules. (Apologies for the ffs part)

On another note. Looks like the Italians are on the wind up now.

"Football has come home"

WeegieBoy

crunchman said:

Something as cynical as that foul on Saka at the end of normal time should be a straight red.  It's just blatant cheating.

It's in the rules as unsporting behaviour which by definition carries a yellow. It's stopping an attack but not a clear goalscoring opportunity. 

Cynical absolutely, but that's part of the game. If it's within the rules it can't be cheating regardless of whether the act is unsavoury or not. 

mikeyrob73

Highlight of this thread is realising I’m not the only ICTFC fan on here 
@GoldenEraGuitars ;

guitars4you

just listening to R5 and picked up on the fact that Italy are the first side to do the double in the same year - Eurovision Song Contest and Euro Championship - Had a chance of the treble but lost at Wimbledon 

Hattigol

Huge disappointment. I thought Italy would win on pens but I've never ever been so miserable at seeing winnings from a bet hit my account.

Are people thinking it's acceptable that we didn't have a shot for he last 118 minutes of the 120? At Wembley, in front of our own crowd?

Or thinking that a system in which the second time Kane touched the ball in the opposition penalty area was when he took his penalty was one that worked well?

Or happy that we brought on the country's most exciting prospect, Grealish, after 98 minutes, by which time the Italians were utterly dominating?

I'm proud that we got to the Final which is a big step forward but disappointed that we decided not to attack and effectively went out without a fight. Chiellini and Bonucci probably never had an easier 90 mins in their combined 312 years of playing.

And as for Southgate saying they practised penalties regularly - so Sancho and Saka practice hitting them halfway between centre and post about 3 feet off the ground so it's ideal for a keeper? 

We will literally never get a better chance.

That's all from me.

guitars4you

just had a text from a mate

'Sure was a great start but a sac a crap at the end'

menamestom

digitalscream said:

But hey...as I said, if that sort of thing's acceptable in football, then it's just another reason not to watch. The governing body could easily stamp it out with a 10 minute sin-bin for yellows and mandatory yellow/red for dangerous play, just like in rugby, but they don't because the fans obviously don't object.

I wouldn't say it's accepted, it's certainly pushing the rules and a long way from sporting behavior, but the rules don't class shirt pulling as dangerous and it wasn't a clear goal scoring opportunity so the rules state yellow card.

I suppose the rules could be changed but most fouls of this type don't result is something that looks so dramatic and football injuries tend to be studs to leg or elbow to head, I can't really think of any examples where somebody has been injured by their shirt.  IT did look bad and I'm not defending it, it's just not common enough in this extreme to completely change the rules.

Either way, if this classifies as a reason not to watch football the same could be applied to any sport, all sports have an unsavory side and many sports with dangers have things far more dangerous that go unpunished .  IMO.

As an England fan I'm not sore about it, what it says to me as Saka had got past him is he should have come on earlier.  Chiellini on a yellow and Saka running at them could have caused more problems.

UnclePsychosis

yocky said:

How do we know that the senior players weren't stepping up the plate? During the pre-pens huddle it looked like Southgate was just pointing to players and making a list.

Southgate is too good a man manager to hang the players out to dry, so he took responsibility for the penalty takers but I think everyone knows that's not how it works - the coach just arbitrarily picking penalty takers without consulting the players is unthinkable. 

Leaving a 19yo - who has never taken a penalty at senior level - to take penalty number 5 (so that he has the whole shootout to put pressure on himself) whilst senior players and supposed "generational talent" like Sterling and Grealish stand around looking at the floor looks more and more insane by the minute. Poor kid. 

Heartfeltdawn

UnclePsychosis said:

Southgate is too good a man manager to hang the players out to dry, so he took responsibility for the penalty takers but I think everyone knows that's not how it works - the coach just arbitrarily picking penalty takers without consulting the players is unthinkable. 

Leaving a 19yo - who has never taken a penalty at senior level - to take penalty number 5 (so that he has the whole shootout to put pressure on himself) whilst senior players and supposed "generational talent" like Sterling and Grealish stand around looking at the floor looks more and more insane by the minute. Poor kid. 

If that was the case, one wonders if this is a case of training field-derived stats being used to formulate decisions ie. Saka looked fucking good in practice doing it so let's get him doing it for real. It has a similar feel to Ed Smith's time with England cricket and some of the leftfield choices that he'd be responsible for (Jason Roy opening in Tests being a prime example). 

joeyowen

I have read that only 3 players in the 26 have scored more than 2 penalties in their career.

That right there may have been the issue!