Kirk “The Weak Link” Hammett - Chris Zoupa

Boromedic

Just in case anyone has any doubts about me owning the record in question....

Philly_Q

I've got it on vinyl if we're scoring points.  But we're not.  Peace.

Boromedic

Philly_Q said:

I've got it on vinyl if we're scoring points.  But we're not.  Peace.

No we're not, and props to you for having it on vinyl, I'm guessing an OG release too? Or has it been reissued? It literally was just in case anyone was doubting whether I'm an OG thrash fan alongside my love for post Black Album Metallica.

Reverend

Boromedic said:

So this:

Is better than this:

Don't think so, it's not even close. 

a million time better

fretmeister

Boromedic said:

fretmeister said:

Boromedic said:

Philly_Q said:

@Boromedic We get it, you're a fan of Hardwired and Death Magnetic.  I find them bloated and tedious.

No not a big fan of Death Magnetic, at times it is exactly what you've said, but Hardwired is a real return to the old days quality. Unfortunately some prejudices remain it seems.

"Prejudices"

Really? 
It's just different tastes, that all. Don't take it so personally.

I haven't at all, what an earth are you on about, I disagree with your opinion as it's wrong that's all. I'm also aware that Metallica's success means their best stuff since 91 is universally disliked regardless of how good it is. That's what I'm on about, if someone had said Jason had written something more significant then fine, but Doomsday is not a milestone thrash record and it's not better than Metallica's best since 91. It would be largely forgotten now if it wasn't for the fact Jason joined Metallica.

You can have your opinion and I'll have mine, I'm not bothered at all, but I'll fight my corner on this because if you could blind listen to those songs and not know who it was (obviously that's never gonna happen), I'm pretty sure your opinion would be different. That's the prejudices I'm on about.

Prejudice: An unfair or unreasonable opinion or feeling.

I'm not convinced you are using the right word to describe different tastes in music.

Boromedic

No that's a perfect explanation, it's an unfair opinion because of who Metallica became, which prejudices people's opinions about their later material.

It always clouds the issue, especially with the OG crowd.

Boromedic

Reverend said:

Boromedic said:

So this:

Is better than this:

Don't think so, it's not even close. 

a million time better

Did you like AJFA (the album)? Would you consider that better than Doomsday?

fretmeister

If a fan buys an album and is really looking forward to it and then doesn't like it - for whatever reason - or doesn't like it as much as a different album, you are saying that is an example of prejudice?

You are claiming that the dislike and / or liking something else better is "unfair"?

Boromedic

fretmeister said:

If a fan buys an album and is really looking forward to it and then doesn't like it - for whatever reason - or doesn't like it as much as a different album, you are saying that is an example of prejudice?

You are claiming that the dislike and / or liking something else better is "unfair"?

I've explained it well enough above, not always and in this case yes.

fretmeister

As someone who

i) bought every single Metallica album / EP on the day of release since I first heard of them in 1986 when a mate had a single TDK 90 min with Master of Puppets on one side and AC/DC's If you want blood on the other; and

ii) Started seeing them live when they were still a support band; and

iii) Arsed up my first A-level sittings because instead I learned every note on Ride the Lightning; and

iv) Did actually really like Hardwired... and thought it was a massive improvement over Death Magnetic; and

v) Actually liked the St. Anger songs when done live (or on the limited DVD that showed the songs in rehearsal); 

vi) have been a proud Metallica fan since 1986 (that's 36 years) and will be seeing them again live when I can


I find the idea that it is prejudicial / unfair / unreasonable for me to like an album by another artist more than "Hardwired..." to be absolutely 100% batshit.

Boromedic

I'll put it in simpler terms, so it's clearer. If Metallica had still done the black album etc. and were just as big now, yet they could release their early fan favourites from the first 4 now and they'd never been heard before. The OG fans wouldn't like them songs just because of the Black Album and subsequent "issues", music and stuff. I'm talking Master and Creeping Death and things like that. 

That's what I'm on about, you may well think you're being objective in your opinions, but there's no way Doomsday for the Deceiver is better than their best since the black album. No way at all, tell me why it's better? St Anger is complete crap, if you were comparing that, I couldn't agree more, shit songs, shit editing, shit playing, the snare. The Beyond Magnetic EP? I'd sooner listen to Flotsam too.

Some of the tracks on Death and Hardwired, again not as good as Flotsam. Atlas Rise, not a chance, nor Spit, they're just clearly better compositionally, lyrically, and musically. Jason wrote better metal songs than the greatest heavy metal songwriter of all time..... Yeah of course he did

Philly_Q

Boromedic said:

I'll put it in simpler terms, so it's clearer. If Metallica had still done the black album etc. and were just as big now, yet they could release their early fan favourites from the first 4 now and they'd never been heard before. The OG fans wouldn't like them songs just because of the Black Album and subsequent "issues", music and stuff. I'm talking Master and Creeping Death and things like that. 

That's what I'm on about, you may well think you're being objective in your opinions, but there's no way Doomsday for the Deceiver is better than their best since the black album. No way at all, tell me why it's better? St Anger is complete crap, if you were comparing that, I couldn't agree more, shit songs, shit editing, shit playing, the snare. The Beyond Magnetic EP? I'd sooner listen to Flotsam too.

Some of the tracks on Death and Hardwired, again not as good as Flotsam. Atlas Rise, not a chance, nor Spit, they're just clearly better compositionally, lyrically, and musically. Jason wrote better metal songs than the greatest heavy metal songwriter of all time..... Yeah of course he did

I don't want to prolong the argument, we're all getting a bit silly here, but you keep saying "their best since the black album", and now you're saying "the greatest heavy metal songwriter of all time", as if they're statements of fact.

They're not facts, they're just opinions.

Boromedic

Philly_Q said:

Boromedic said:

I'll put it in simpler terms, so it's clearer. If Metallica had still done the black album etc. and were just as big now, yet they could release their early fan favourites from the first 4 now and they'd never been heard before. The OG fans wouldn't like them songs just because of the Black Album and subsequent "issues", music and stuff. I'm talking Master and Creeping Death and things like that. 

That's what I'm on about, you may well think you're being objective in your opinions, but there's no way Doomsday for the Deceiver is better than their best since the black album. No way at all, tell me why it's better? St Anger is complete crap, if you were comparing that, I couldn't agree more, shit songs, shit editing, shit playing, the snare. The Beyond Magnetic EP? I'd sooner listen to Flotsam too.

Some of the tracks on Death and Hardwired, again not as good as Flotsam. Atlas Rise, not a chance, nor Spit, they're just clearly better compositionally, lyrically, and musically. Jason wrote better metal songs than the greatest heavy metal songwriter of all time..... Yeah of course he did

I don't want to prolong the argument, we're all getting a bit silly here, but you keep saying "their best since the black album", and now you're saying "the greatest heavy metal songwriter of all time", as if they're statements of fact.

They're not facts, they're just opinions.

So which is their best since the Black Album? Also who sold the most records in the thrash genre? They might be opinions but they're backed up with facts. Again someone will now point out that sales don't mean anything, but yeah they do, it's the only metric you can use as anything else is an opinion. 

Boromedic

fretmeister said:

As someone who

i) bought every single Metallica album / EP on the day of release since I first heard of them in 1986 when a mate had a single TDK 90 min with Master of Puppets on one side and AC/DC's If you want blood on the other; and

ii) Started seeing them live when they were still a support band; and

iii) Arsed up my first A-level sittings because instead I learned every note on Ride the Lightning; and

iv) Did actually really like Hardwired... and thought it was a massive improvement over Death Magnetic; and

v) Actually liked the St. Anger songs when done live (or on the limited DVD that showed the songs in rehearsal); 

vi) have been a proud Metallica fan since 1986 (that's 36 years) and will be seeing them again live when I can


I find the idea that it is prejudicial / unfair / unreasonable for me to like an album by another artist more than "Hardwired..." to be absolutely 100% batshit.

Which songs were you missing off the cassette as Master is too long for one side of a C90?

Boromedic

P.s. I'll scratch you off the list, it wasn't your opinion I was questioning in the main. You're still wrong though..... Hardwired is better than Doomsday

fretmeister

Boromedic said:

I'll put it in simpler terms, so it's clearer. If Metallica had still done the black album etc. and were just as big now, yet they could release their early fan favourites from the first 4 now and they'd never been heard before. The OG fans wouldn't like them songs just because of the Black Album and subsequent "issues", music and stuff. I'm talking Master and Creeping Death and things like that. 

That's what I'm on about, you may well think you're being objective in your opinions, but there's no way Doomsday for the Deceiver is better than their best since the black album. No way at all, tell me why it's better? St Anger is complete crap, if you were comparing that, I couldn't agree more, shit songs, shit editing, shit playing, the snare. The Beyond Magnetic EP? I'd sooner listen to Flotsam too.

Some of the tracks on Death and Hardwired, again not as good as Flotsam. Atlas Rise, not a chance, nor Spit, they're just clearly better compositionally, lyrically, and musically. Jason wrote better metal songs than the greatest heavy metal songwriter of all time..... Yeah of course he did

I don't need you to put it in simpler terms. I fully understand what you are saying - you are just 100% wrong in the reasons why I like A more than B.

I do not think I'm being objective in my opinions. 

I'm being subjective. I never claimed otherwise.

Doomsday is better because I like it more. It's that simple. It's not "unfair" for me to like Album A more than Album B.
There are people who like St Anger more than Ride. Are they unfair?



What next? I'm "unfair" for liking Hash browns more than Chips? I'm failing to be objective about the different potato meal types?

I like Doomsday more than I like Hardwired. Therefore for me Doomsday is better.
There is no deep conspiracy. No fair / unfair thought process. Just personal taste. Just pure emotional reaction to hearing a song.


Sign of The Times
Ride the Lightning
Kind of Blue
Thriller
Sgt Peppers...


Can you put that list in an order for me to like best that isn't unfair please?

Boromedic

If they tour again (hopefully this year), I'm gonna grab a ticket, we should go together and discuss this at length pre show....

fretmeister

I really want to see them again but I'll have to wait until it is safer to do so.

Teenage child has ME/CFS and it's a nightmare keeping her away from covid as it is.
I'd have to isolate for a week after the show.

Boromedic

fretmeister said:

I really want to see them again but I'll have to wait until it is safer to do so.

Teenage child has ME/CFS and it's a nightmare keeping her away from covid as it is.
I'd have to isolate for a week after the show.

Nightmare, sorry to hear that I hope all the Covid stuff dies down enough to make it safer for you. I hope her condition improves over time too, very difficult one to manage bless her.

Boromedic

P.s. Anyone who likes St Anger more than Ride needs a psych exam....