The F1 thread

Cols

I’d be surprised if continued involvement in F1 isn’t an agenda item at every board meeting.  It’s perhaps a bit more serious this time due to last year’s announcement that they were cutting over 10000 jobs worldwide in order to reduce costs.

 
Mercedes have to kick in surprisingly little funding to the team these days - only $30-40 million per year.  The rest of the budget is covered by prize money and sponsorship.

It’s the powertrain involvement which is really expensive, and more difficult to extricate themselves from due to supply contracts with Force India, Williams and - from next year - McLaren.

Dontgiveupyourdayjob

Cols said:

I’d be surprised if continued involvement in F1 isn’t an agenda item at every board meeting.  It’s perhaps a bit more serious this time due to last year’s announcement that they were cutting over 10000 jobs worldwide in order to reduce costs.

 
Mercedes have to kick in surprisingly little funding to the team these days - only $30-40 million per year.  The rest of the budget is covered by prize money and sponsorship.

It’s the powertrain involvement which is really expensive, and more difficult to extricate themselves from due to supply contracts with Force India, Williams and - from next year - McLaren.

The article states they'll still continue supply power plants beyond 2020. Its the continuation of the full factory team that potentially has a question mark over it, with the 9 month notice period deadline around the corner. 

Fretwired

Toto Wolff and Lawrence Stroll in bid to buy Mercedes team. Mercedes, BMW, Audi and Porsche have been racing each other competitively in Formula E which is where the board thinks it should focus its cash.

http://www.gptoday.com/full_story/view/707460/Stroll_and_Wolff_to_buy_Mercedes_F1_team/

https://www.essentiallysports.com/mercedes-f1-could-be-bought-over-by-toto-wolff-and-lawrence-stroll-in-2021-claims-reports/

TimmyO

Toto called Formula E "Mario Kart with human drivers" recently 

Mr Stroll is reportedly a pretty toxic personality - that could be a troubled enterprise... 

Fretwired

TimmyO said:

Toto called Formula E "Mario Kart with human drivers" recently 

Mr Stroll is reportedly a pretty toxic personality - that could be a troubled enterprise... 

I'm sure Toto could find a less toxic buyer .. I think Mercedes have seen that the likes of Porsche, BMW and VW Audi have no interest in F1. The viewing figures might be a concern as well. I'm also not sure Aston Martin would be interested in having Stroll on their board. Mercedes could take a bigger stake and rename the F1 team Aston Martin - it has heritage and would fit in Mercedes portfolio as the cars already use Mercedes engines and other components.

PC_Dave

Fretwired said:

TimmyO said:

Toto called Formula E "Mario Kart with human drivers" recently 

Mr Stroll is reportedly a pretty toxic personality - that could be a troubled enterprise... 

I'm sure Toto could find a less toxic buyer .. I think Mercedes have seen that the likes of Porsche, BMW and VW Audi have no interest in F1. The viewing figures might be a concern as well. I'm also not sure Aston Martin would be interested in having Stroll on their board. Mercedes could take a bigger stake and rename the F1 team Aston Martin - it has heritage and would fit in Mercedes portfolio as the cars already use Mercedes engines and other components.

How would that work with the Aston Martin Red Bull Racing Team? Surely they wouldn't be too happy?

Fretwired

PC_Dave said:

Fretwired said:

How would that work with the Aston Martin Red Bull Racing Team? Surely they wouldn't be too happy?

I think Red Bull would drop Aston Martin if Mercedes takes a controlling stake in the company. Mercedes have told shareholders they are investigating whether or not to takeover AM or just invest more money. A takeover could be on the cards.

stickyfiddle

Merc already supply engines for Aston road cars, so I’m not sure see a conflict if Merc buys more shares in AM but keeps the Brackley racing team as Mercedes. 

I’m still not convinced they will leave the sport, as they pull so much sponsorship that it apparently costs them less than 50m a year to run. That’s some really serious marketing for not much money. 

But I wouldn’t mind that much if they quit, as long as the team is taken over and not dissolved. I’m a fan, but it wouldn’t be a bad thing for other people to start winning, and you could see them throwing more weight behind McLaren like the old days if they sold the team to AM/Stroll. 

2021 will be interesting either way. 

Fretwired

stickyfiddle said:

Merc already supply engines for Aston road cars, so I’m not sure see a conflict if Merc buys more shares in AM but keeps the Brackley racing team as Mercedes. 

But Merc have no board representation. If they take AM over then they will be running the company - a clear conflict of interest. The owner of Red Bull is a no-nonsense businessman - he'll remember that Merc refused to supply Red Bull with engines.

stickyfiddle

Fretwired said:

stickyfiddle said:

Merc already supply engines for Aston road cars, so I’m not sure see a conflict if Merc buys more shares in AM but keeps the Brackley racing team as Mercedes. 

But Merc have no board representation. If they take AM over then they will be running the company - a clear conflict of interest. The owner of Red Bull is a no-nonsense businessman - he'll remember that Merc refused to supply Red Bull with engines.

Sure. But that’s Red Bull’s problem, not Merc’s. AM will have a contract and they’ll have to abide by it or pay to break it. It won’t be the biggest contract to have been broken in F1 history

Fretwired

stickyfiddle said:

Sure. But that’s Red Bull’s problem, not Merc’s. AM will have a contract and they’ll have to abide by it or pay to break it. It won’t be the biggest contract to have been broken in F1 history

But Mercedes could terminate the contract - they refused to sell Red Bull engines and see the team as major competitors. And in the event they bought AM Mercedes wouldn't want a company they own which is powered by their engines and tech on the side of a car powered by a Honda engine.

stickyfiddle

Yes, exactyl what I meant by “that’s RB’s problem”

Fretwired

stickyfiddle said:

Yes, exactyl what I meant by “that’s RB’s problem”

Agree. I think in the unlikely event it happened they'd agree to split.

Cols

In the meantime, Hamilton’s Mercedes contract extension has gone from “All done, just needs to be announced” through “Hit a snag as Hamilton wants lots more money” to “Haven’t actually started any discussions yet TBH”.  

Fretwired

F1 has a problem with the virus that's sweeping around the world. The Chinese Grand Prix is in April and could be cancelled as Chinese leaders put the country into lock down. Other venues could be affected. F1 chiefs are worried.

boogieman

Is Papa Stroll thinking of buying Merc because lil Lance is spitting his dummy because he’s not winning stuff? Or are there other reasons? 

Fretwired

boogieman said:

Is Papa Stroll thinking of buying Merc because lil Lance is spitting his dummy because he’s not winning stuff? Or are there other reasons? 

What I have read is if Stroll buys the team (unlikely I'd say) it will be run by Wolff (who'd be a shareholder and team principal) and he'd keep the existing driver line-up. Stroll Jnr is basically useless. He couldn't get a seat a Williams if his dad paid them. Besides, if Hamilton stayed and Bottas made way for Stroll Jnr the F1 audience would see how bad Stroll Jnr really is .. Hamilton would crush him every race.

Cols

Stroll has kicked in £182m to acquire 20% of Aston Martin, with Racing Point being rebranded accordingly.

Aston Martin: F1 billionaire owner leads rescue deal https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-51323241

PC_Dave

Title partnership with Aston Martin and Red Bull ending at the end of 2020 just officially announced.

Octafish

So looks like rumours of Stroll snr getting together with Aston Martin and Wolff to take over Mercedes Team were a case of 'insiders' taking 2 and 2 and making 5. Still think it's highly likely Mercedes will stick around and give Hamilton a new contract.