Yamaha acoustics

fnpt

Thanks, I’ll do it properly instead of eyeballing it. I did increase the tension on the rod when I got the guitar and I suspect I may have gone too far. I’ve now reduced it a little bit again and the buzzing has reduced to almost inaudible.
 I’ll get a set of feeler gauges to check it properly.

Alexlotl

Nipped into G4M today - had the whole family with me, so had to earn my guitar time by distracting the kids while my wife tried out pianos, and didn't have more than 10 minutes.

Tried an FG800, and they did just feel too big for my small frame (I wear a small t-shirt). They had an FS3 on demo which felt a much more comfortable size, but they also had a mahogany top FS850 which TBH felt more than its equal, and sounded better to my ears, although the woods are obviously very different. Finish wise, it felt the equal of the red label, while the FG800 had noticably sharp fret ends etc. Very easy on the eye, too.

Anyway, I might give serious thought to picking one up.

Smellyfingers

Alexlotl said:

Nipped into G4M today - had the whole family with me, so had to earn my guitar time by distracting the kids while my wife tried out pianos, and didn't have more than 10 minutes.

Tried an FG800, and they did just feel too big for my small frame (I wear a small t-shirt). They had an FS3 on demo which felt a much more comfortable size, but they also had a mahogany top FS850 which TBH felt more than its equal, and sounded better to my ears, although the woods are obviously very different. Finish wise, it felt the equal of the red label, while the FG800 had noticably sharp fret ends etc. Very easy on the eye, too.

Anyway, I might give serious thought to picking one up.

I found the FG5 Red label a noticeable step up, tone wise, from the FG3.

The only differences seem to be a bone nut and saddle, and the fact FG5s are at least partly made in Japan. But the guy in the shop did confirm they are assembled with significantly more care.

Alexlotl

Yeah, I’d like to play an FS5, but they seem to be out of stock almost everywhere (PMT has one, in Birmingham), including the Yamaha boutique.

But TBH, if I think I can be happy with a £400 guitar rather than a £1200 one, then that’s a win in my book. 

tomjax

I tried that same FG850 in Gear 4 Music a couple of weeks ago. I commented on it earlier in this thread, it was a surprisingly great guitar for that kind of money.

Gomers

Congratulations on the LL16, a very complete guitar for the money, I used to have one which was lovely.

I got a bit of a Yamaha obsession a couple of years ago and wanted to try some of the higher-end models.  Bought an 80's L15a from GuitarGuitar online.  All solid, made in Taiwan and incredible.  That made way for my current LA-8 and LL-500.  The LA-8 is so close to the LL-500's greatness, that I could happily live with either.

DavidR

Gomers said:

Congratulations on the LL16, a very complete guitar for the money, I used to have one which was lovely.

I got a bit of a Yamaha obsession a couple of years ago and wanted to try some of the higher-end models.  Bought an 80's L15a from GuitarGuitar online.  All solid, made in Taiwan and incredible.  That made way for my current LA-8 and LL-500.  The LA-8 is so close to the LL-500's greatness, that I could happily live with either.

Yeh me too. Yer standard player could have a lot of fun just exploring the Yamaha acoustic stable. Most would find great value and an instrument to suit them. Their value/quality/breadth of choice/depth of choice algorithm is pretty near unbeatable. I'm convinced many pay more for less quality. DOI, as stated, a Yamaha fanboy. :-)

guitarjack66

DavidR said:

Gomers said:

Congratulations on the LL16, a very complete guitar for the money, I used to have one which was lovely.

I got a bit of a Yamaha obsession a couple of years ago and wanted to try some of the higher-end models.  Bought an 80's L15a from GuitarGuitar online.  All solid, made in Taiwan and incredible.  That made way for my current LA-8 and LL-500.  The LA-8 is so close to the LL-500's greatness, that I could happily live with either.

Yeh me too. Yer standard player could have a lot of fun just exploring the Yamaha acoustic stable. Most would find great value and an instrument to suit them. Their value/quality/breadth of choice/depth of choice algorithm is pretty near unbeatable. I'm convinced many pay more for less quality. DOI, as stated, a Yamaha fanboy. :-)

Any 45mm nut widths in the Yamaha stable? This is the thing that keeps me away from them.

DavidR

Yes. Standard nut widths on FG’s and LL’s for example is 44mm. OK for most players but not all. Yamaha may have made the calculation that more people would complain about 45mm being ‘too big’ than would complain about 44mm being ‘too small’ and that, around the world, 44mm is optimal.

Also, doesn’t stop FG being arguably top-selling square-shouldered dreadnought internationally. They might not want to interfere too much with that!

:-)

MartinB

They all seem to be very good at their price point, I think the only reasons I'm not playing one are semi-irrational personal preference stuff. The LLs strike me as quite even, sparkly and refined sounding, and I like something drier and earthier for how I play. The FG3/5 seem to be going for my type of tone preference and I'd probably enjoy playing one, but they're so orange, it's almost like a Gretsch colour! If the FG3 or 5 came in a nice burst or an actual light natural finish, I'd look at them again.

DavidR

Actually my FG5 is a bit orange! Never noticed that before but it’s actually orange in the same way Donald Trump is orange!! Well spotted @MartinB ;

BillDL

You really know how to polarise potential purchasers with that colour description @DavidR 

Tannin

DavidR said:

Yes. Standard nut widths on FG’s and LL’s for example is 44mm. OK for most players but not all. Yamaha may have made the calculation that more people would complain about 45mm being ‘too big’ than would complain about 44mm being ‘too small’ and that, around the world, 44mm is optimal.

The funny thing is that the oft-quoted "45mm" standard nut width is usually not 45mm at all! It is more commonly than not (and always in the USA) an imperial measure 1 3/4" nut, which is 44.5mm. That's very close to 44mm - but I can certainly tell the difference, even just half a millimetre. 

44mm has a reasonable claim to being the "World Standard" nut width. All mass-produced Australian guitars (Maton, Cole Clark, and Pratley - Fenech is more a boutique maker) use 44mm. Then you've got Yamaha and assorted other Japanese brands, plus odds and ends elsewhere. 

44.5mm has an even better claim, while the 42mm and 43mm sizes are less common than either these days. In Europe, 46mm is a big thing. 

I would love to see a bit more standardisation - not in the sense of all brands moving to the same size! - but in the sense of  it becoming standard for major makers to offer a range of nut widths. Takamine do (except that all the Takamine models I fancy come with the 43mm nut I hate and the ones I'm not so interested in offer a nice roomy 45mm!) and to some extent Martin does also. In Europe both Furch and Lakewood offer a good range - off the top of my head, 43mm, 44mm, 45,, and 46mm., and it doesn't seem to have messed up their economies of scale (Which ones any given retailer orders is a different question though.)  You'd think in these days of CNC everything that different nut sizes would be an easy thing to do. Curiously, two of the most CNC-focussed of all makers, Taylor and Cole Clark, offer no choice at all! Go figure.

MartinB

DavidR said:

Actually my FG5 is a bit orange! Never noticed that before but it’s actually orange in the same way Donald Trump is orange!! Well spotted @MartinB ;

I was thinking more like Brian Setzer's Gretsch!

guitarjack66

DavidR said:

Yes. Standard nut widths on FG’s and LL’s for example is 44mm. OK for most players but not all. Yamaha may have made the calculation that more people would complain about 45mm being ‘too big’ than would complain about 44mm being ‘too small’ and that, around the world, 44mm is optimal.

Also, doesn’t stop FG being arguably top-selling square-shouldered dreadnought internationally. They might not want to interfere too much with that!

:-)

If a Cort Parlour can have a 45mm neck I'd have thought Yamaha could try a model or two and try it out. Especially considering how much they sell in the West and our proclivity for generally being taller and heavier than our Eastern counterparts.

Tannin

Curiously enough, it is more-or-less conventional for small body guitars (like parlours) to have wider nuts*. I think this may be because people expect you to play fingerstyle on them rather than strum the guts out of them. 

Except for bloody Takamine New Yorkers. (Or am I repeating myself?)

MartinB

The small body/wide nut thing is a historical quirk too. Both larger bodies and narrower nuts were part of attempts to bring banjo players over to the guitar, pushing louder, narrower necked instruments for rhythm styles in band settings.

bluecat

I was always told, Yamaha acoustics were excellent,and that was from a lot of top players in the seventies,but the quality of sound would not alter with age. Although the build quality is faultless.

DavidR

bluecat said:

I was always told, Yamaha acoustics were excellent,and that was from a lot of top players in the seventies,but the quality of sound would not alter with age. Although the build quality is faultless.

Not perfect though. Older FG's have rep for bowed tops, perhaps because they were a bit thin. Buying a 70's FG demands an assessment of action to include the possibility that it is high because the strings have pulled the bridge up. Not an easy fix especially if saddle at lowest possible. Yamaha seem to have sussed that out at some point and it no longer happens. Probably. Later FG's are, by definition, not so old. But it's a recognised thing so I'm sure they know.

bluecat

Probably the all solid wood ones are far far better nowadays. I can't really comment on that. I have not played one for years.