A person kills your child..,

Kurtis

darthed1981 said:

Kurtis said:

darthed1981 said:

Fuck, fuck, fuck

Immersed a child in boiling water?

I'd put a bullet through this nasty crazy monster's head.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-wear-68557974

I'm not saying it should be law, or we should bring back the death penalty, but I would do it.

Would you really? 

Id like to think there's a bit of bravado going on here. 

Bravado isn't the word I'd use, I didn't mean it in a gung ho way.

Would I really do it? You never know until you are there do you?

I have a big problem with anyone who would hurt children, and their own children even more so.

Don't know about that, pretty sure I could refrain from murdering someone. Where's "there" though? 

I think most people are against child abuse. 

darthed1981

Petepassion said:

And this is the problem, I myself have been close to a form of child abuse, I wasn't the abuser or being abused, but very close to the situation. On one hand I felt immense rage/anger, yet I knew rationally there was a reason and in this particular case I could see why the person was slowly mentally breaking down and could no longer cope. It was nothing like the case above, but still not good.
   Naturally we respond emotionally, we're only human, but I believe a big part of that anger is due to not seeing the full picture.
   I posted a link earlier to an old documentary 'Child of rage', initially seeing a child beat her little brothers head on the concrete floor, many would be outraged, but then when you learn what this little girl went through you really can't hold her accountable for her actions.

Yup, certainly many abusers were themselves abused, and sometimes it's a circle of tragedy.

A mum abusing her own baby boy though is just chilling.  No idea if you have kids but I do and when they are small their parents are literally everything to them.  Not just the physical torture that poor child went through but the emotional torture that his Mummy was doing it...

It would have been literally hell on Earth.

Hence, my comment about happily pulling the trigger myself, which was just honestly my first reaction on reading that article.

fretmeister

Petepassion said:

And this is the problem, I myself have been close to a form of child abuse, I wasn't the abuser or being abused, but very close to the situation. On one hand I felt immense rage/anger, yet I knew rationally there was a reason and in this particular case I could see why the person was slowly mentally breaking down and could no longer cope. It was nothing like the case above, but still not good.
   Naturally we respond emotionally, we're only human, but I believe a big part of that anger is due to not seeing the full picture.
   I posted a link earlier to an old documentary 'Child of rage', initially seeing a child beat her little brothers head on the concrete floor, many would be outraged, but then when you learn what this little girl went through you really can't hold her accountable for her actions.

To convict a young child the prosecution has to prove the child knew what they were doing was wrong and that they understood the gravity of their actions.

And that’s without considering the mental damage the child has from abuse.

Some countries have a set age for criminal liability, and others test the individual child’s understanding.

As you can imagine, it’s a contentious issue.

Snags

Ref the OP, personally I'd want to see them forced to join tFB but only allowed to participate in Off Topic and P&E.

Sporky

Snags said:

Ref the OP, personally I'd want to see them forced to join tFB but only allowed to participate in Off Topic and P&E.

NPE is a pretty harsh punishment - that should appease the string-em-up brigade. 

Petepassion

fretmeister said:

Petepassion said:

And this is the problem, I myself have been close to a form of child abuse, I wasn't the abuser or being abused, but very close to the situation. On one hand I felt immense rage/anger, yet I knew rationally there was a reason and in this particular case I could see why the person was slowly mentally breaking down and could no longer cope. It was nothing like the case above, but still not good.
   Naturally we respond emotionally, we're only human, but I believe a big part of that anger is due to not seeing the full picture.
   I posted a link earlier to an old documentary 'Child of rage', initially seeing a child beat her little brothers head on the concrete floor, many would be outraged, but then when you learn what this little girl went through you really can't hold her accountable for her actions.

To convict a young child the prosecution has to prove the child knew what they were doing was wrong and that they understood the gravity of their actions.

And that’s without considering the mental damage the child has from abuse.

Some countries have a set age for criminal liability, and others test the individual child’s understanding.

As you can imagine, it’s a contentious issue.

I was thinking not so much about 'prosecution' but more about how this stuff makes you feel initially towards the child in the documentary and how feelings change when we see the bigger picture.

Kurtis

darthed1981 said:

Petepassion said:

And this is the problem, I myself have been close to a form of child abuse, I wasn't the abuser or being abused, but very close to the situation. On one hand I felt immense rage/anger, yet I knew rationally there was a reason and in this particular case I could see why the person was slowly mentally breaking down and could no longer cope. It was nothing like the case above, but still not good.
   Naturally we respond emotionally, we're only human, but I believe a big part of that anger is due to not seeing the full picture.
   I posted a link earlier to an old documentary 'Child of rage', initially seeing a child beat her little brothers head on the concrete floor, many would be outraged, but then when you learn what this little girl went through you really can't hold her accountable for her actions.

Yup, certainly many abusers were themselves abused, and sometimes it's a circle of tragedy.

A mum abusing her own baby boy though is just chilling.  No idea if you have kids but I do and when they are small their parents are literally everything to them.  Not just the physical torture that poor child went through but the emotional torture that his Mummy was doing it...

It would have been literally hell on Earth.

Hence, my comment about happily pulling the trigger myself, which was just honestly my first reaction on reading that article.

It's obviously an extremely bad situation. I think we can all agree on that.

I just wonder why people say these things when they don't really mean it.

Maybe I'm just not very emotional. 

darthed1981

Kurtis said:

darthed1981 said:

Petepassion said:

And this is the problem, I myself have been close to a form of child abuse, I wasn't the abuser or being abused, but very close to the situation. On one hand I felt immense rage/anger, yet I knew rationally there was a reason and in this particular case I could see why the person was slowly mentally breaking down and could no longer cope. It was nothing like the case above, but still not good.
   Naturally we respond emotionally, we're only human, but I believe a big part of that anger is due to not seeing the full picture.
   I posted a link earlier to an old documentary 'Child of rage', initially seeing a child beat her little brothers head on the concrete floor, many would be outraged, but then when you learn what this little girl went through you really can't hold her accountable for her actions.

Yup, certainly many abusers were themselves abused, and sometimes it's a circle of tragedy.

A mum abusing her own baby boy though is just chilling.  No idea if you have kids but I do and when they are small their parents are literally everything to them.  Not just the physical torture that poor child went through but the emotional torture that his Mummy was doing it...

It would have been literally hell on Earth.

Hence, my comment about happily pulling the trigger myself, which was just honestly my first reaction on reading that article.

It's obviously an extremely bad situation. I think we can all agree on that.

I just wonder why people say these things when they don't really mean it. 

What makes you think I didn't mean it?

You got kids?

My point was a very honest answer to the initial question in the thread.

An emotional, instant response to any given situation may involve "terminal" violence.  If for example I caught someone trying to sexually abuse a child, let alone one of mine, I'm not sure I would, or could, control my initial reaction, and I've got a temper.

I get it, Private Eye have mocked it for years ("If I see this I swear I'll do time - Family Man") so I get the cynicism, it's probably correct.

On the other hand, if you literally wouldn't try and physically tear the world apart to protect your child, you might not want to be a parent, because that's how your own children make you feel, especially when they are very small.

However, society needs to be better than that, so I don't support the death penalty.

Kurtis

darthed1981 said:

Kurtis said:

darthed1981 said:

Petepassion said:

And this is the problem, I myself have been close to a form of child abuse, I wasn't the abuser or being abused, but very close to the situation. On one hand I felt immense rage/anger, yet I knew rationally there was a reason and in this particular case I could see why the person was slowly mentally breaking down and could no longer cope. It was nothing like the case above, but still not good.
   Naturally we respond emotionally, we're only human, but I believe a big part of that anger is due to not seeing the full picture.
   I posted a link earlier to an old documentary 'Child of rage', initially seeing a child beat her little brothers head on the concrete floor, many would be outraged, but then when you learn what this little girl went through you really can't hold her accountable for her actions.

Yup, certainly many abusers were themselves abused, and sometimes it's a circle of tragedy.

A mum abusing her own baby boy though is just chilling.  No idea if you have kids but I do and when they are small their parents are literally everything to them.  Not just the physical torture that poor child went through but the emotional torture that his Mummy was doing it...

It would have been literally hell on Earth.

Hence, my comment about happily pulling the trigger myself, which was just honestly my first reaction on reading that article.

It's obviously an extremely bad situation. I think we can all agree on that.

I just wonder why people say these things when they don't really mean it. 

What makes you think I didn't mean it?

You got kids?

Well that's what I'm asking you.

Yes, I have a young son. 

Kurtis

So if I put you in a room with her and a loaded gun you wouldn't be able to stop yourself committing murder? 

Petepassion

It’s that gut reaction, how we feel in the moment, but doesn’t necessarily mean we would carry it through in the cold light of day

darthed1981

Kurtis said:

So if I put you in a room with her and a loaded gun you wouldn't be able to stop yourself committing murder? 

Oh come on dude, you are trolling now.  I've been pretty patient across threads with you (apart from telling you to f-off that one time) but you are over the line.

I did edit my post above, perhaps read that and you will get a better idea.

Timcito

Petepassion said:

It’s that gut reaction, how we feel in the moment, but doesn’t necessarily mean we would carry it through in the cold light of day

Yes, I think the original proposition is so wildly grotesque that it defies a meaningful response. My gut reaction may be 'You hurt my family, I want you dead,' but who knows whether we would actually want that in the cold light of day.

darthed1981

Petepassion said:

It’s that gut reaction, how we feel in the moment, but doesn’t necessarily mean we would carry it through in the cold light of day

Exactly.

Kurtis

darthed1981 said:

Kurtis said:

So if I put you in a room with her and a loaded gun you wouldn't be able to stop yourself committing murder? 

Oh come on dude, you are trolling now.  I've been pretty patient across threads with you (apart from telling you to f-off that one time) but you are over the line.

I did edit my post above, perhaps read that and you will get a better idea.

Honestly don't understand why you think I'm trolling (wasn't trolling before either). Is that what you say when someone asks you a difficult question?

darthed1981

Timcito said:

Petepassion said:

It’s that gut reaction, how we feel in the moment, but doesn’t necessarily mean we would carry it through in the cold light of day

Yes, I think the original proposition is so wildly grotesque that it defies a meaningful response. My gut reaction may be 'You hurt my family, I want you dead,' but who knows whether we would actually want that in the cold light of day.

Yup that's exactly what I'm trying to say.

I was so shocked reading the article I posted to (the child was so badly burned by his mother he would need a general anaesthetic for a dressing change, I mean can you imagine the pain and suffering of that) that my reaction was I'd happily put a bullet through her head to send her straight to hell.

That's what we are talking about, it doesn't mean that my life is a constant parade of vigilante executions.

darthed1981

Kurtis said:

darthed1981 said:

Kurtis said:

So if I put you in a room with her and a loaded gun you wouldn't be able to stop yourself committing murder? 

Oh come on dude, you are trolling now.  I've been pretty patient across threads with you (apart from telling you to f-off that one time) but you are over the line.

I did edit my post above, perhaps read that and you will get a better idea.

Honestly don't understand why you think I'm trolling (wasn't trolling before either). Is that what you say when someone asks you a difficult question?

Dude, just leave it.

Kurtis

. 

Kurtis

darthed1981 said:

Timcito said:

Petepassion said:

It’s that gut reaction, how we feel in the moment, but doesn’t necessarily mean we would carry it through in the cold light of day

Yes, I think the original proposition is so wildly grotesque that it defies a meaningful response. My gut reaction may be 'You hurt my family, I want you dead,' but who knows whether we would actually want that in the cold light of day.

Yup that's exactly what I'm trying to say.

I was so shocked reading the article I posted to (the child was so badly burned by his mother he would need a general anaesthetic for a dressing change, I mean can you imagine the pain and suffering of that) that my reaction was I'd happily put a bullet through her head to send her straight to hell.

That's what we are talking about, it doesn't mean that my life is a constant parade of vigilante executions.

No one is suggesting it is.

All I'm saying is not everyones first reaction is terminal violence. 

Please don't make out I shouldn't be a parent. That's just a really shitty thing to say. 

darthed1981

Kurtis said:

darthed1981 said:

Timcito said:

Petepassion said:

It’s that gut reaction, how we feel in the moment, but doesn’t necessarily mean we would carry it through in the cold light of day

Yes, I think the original proposition is so wildly grotesque that it defies a meaningful response. My gut reaction may be 'You hurt my family, I want you dead,' but who knows whether we would actually want that in the cold light of day.

Yup that's exactly what I'm trying to say.

I was so shocked reading the article I posted to (the child was so badly burned by his mother he would need a general anaesthetic for a dressing change, I mean can you imagine the pain and suffering of that) that my reaction was I'd happily put a bullet through her head to send her straight to hell.

That's what we are talking about, it doesn't mean that my life is a constant parade of vigilante executions.

No one is suggesting it is. 

OK, cool, good.  Let's leave it there