Honest question no baiting or insults

professorben

What was so wrong with being in the EU anyway?
I mean I've not been affected negatively in anyway that I can see by being in the EU.

PolarityMan

As a remain supported I think the biggest risk would have been that as the rest of the EU moved towards political union then we would have our input increasingly side-lined leading to a gradual decline in value from membership.

I think it would have been a long time (likely decades) before the drawbacks outweighed the benefits though and of course there's no guarantee that circumstances wouldn't change during that time.

Heartfeltdawn

The EU turned me into a newt. 

I didn't get better. 

english_bob

Do you mean "baiting"? "Bating" would be something different...

Axe_meister

The biggest risk with EU is the southern nations being a massive drag on the EU economy as a whole.
The only way to fix that is a closer political union, I.e the ability to set tax rates, pension ages, etc, etc.
Which as usual only means taxes/ages go up.

professorben

english_bob;1132703" said:

Do you mean "baiting"? "Bating" would be something different...

Ha ha epic typo. Lol

Fretwired

professorben said:

What was so wrong with being in the EU anyway?
I mean I've not been affected negatively in anyway that I can see by being in the EU.

Ask yourself this - do you want the Euro?

If the answer is no then leave now as our influence will diminish overtime and we'll be shackled to economically stagnant bloc that increasingly can't make decisions. The real power is in the Euro zone. We are not members, so when the economic rules are being discussed we have to leave the room. The EU is aiming for closer fiscal union (harmonisation of tax rates, budgets and so forth) and political union (EU army, seat at the security council, foreign minister) - I don't want that either.

If you want the Euro then campaign to join the Euro zone. At least we'd have a seat at the top table. But look at Europe. Greece has been treated appallingly and people are in poverty. Youth unemployment is running at 25% in some countries and growth is stagnant. Countries with the Euro can't react to the economic problems in their country as they're shackled to an inflexible currency/economic model. I don't want the UK to end up like Greece or Spain.

To most people the EU means two things. freedom of movement and free trade. If we had those elements then my guess is most people would be happy. I'm for a free trade deal that allows us to cut our own deals with other countries and I'm not fussed about freedom of movement - I'm happy to keep it with some basic protection. I think the benefits of free movement outweigh the downsides.

I want our parliament to set our laws and our courts to uphold the law along with the ECHR. The growth in the world economy will be in Asia - an independent UK can prosper IMHO.

The EU is not all bad, but the above are my major reasons for wanting to leave.

professorben

@fretwired fair point, but we were full members, without the Euro, Germany managed to extricate itself from recession a lot faster and stronger than we were, they had the euro.
I don't see that we would have been forced to take the Euro if we have managed to avoid it for the last 15 years.

hobbio

professorben said:

What was so wrong with being in the EU anyway?
I mean I've not been affected negatively in anyway that I can see by being in the EU.

Nor me, but what I didn't want was to become just another state in a United States of Europe. I simply don't want ever-closer integration.

I'm not anti-immigration, far from it, and I like being able to travel freely myself. Conversely, I don't think that leaving would affect us as badly economically as the doomsayers were making out.

I was a borderline voter for a good while, and only really made up my mind to vote Leave in the week running up to the referendum.

The reason I now regret my vote is because of who I've aligned myself with, without realising that I was doing so. If you drew a venn diagram of mine and Farage's politics there would be the tiniest overlap that said "don't want closer integration", but other than that I find UKIP politics abhorrent.

I did think about this a lot before voting, and I thought about those people I know from the EU in this country and my Brit friends in the EU. What I couldn't do was vote Remain just because of their circumstances if my conscience was telling me to vote Leave.

I would vote Remain if I had the chance again, and then fight closer integration as a separate battle if and when it came up. Hindsight is a wonderful thing.

professorben

hobbio;1132725" said:

professorben said:

What was so wrong with being in the EU anyway?

I mean I've not been affected negatively in anyway that I can see by being in the EU.










Nor me, but what I didn't want was to become just another state in a United States of Europe. I simply don't want ever-closer integration.I'm not anti-immigration, far from it, and I like being able to travel freely myself. Conversely, I don't think that leaving would affect us as badly economically as the doomsayers were making out.I was a borderline voter for a good while, and only really made up my mind to vote Leave in the week running up to the referendum.The reason I now regret my vote is because of who I've aligned myself with, without realising that I was doing so. If you drew a venn diagram of mine and Farage's politics there would be the tiniest overlap that said "don't want closer integration", but other than that I find UKIP politics abhorrent. I did think about this a lot before voting, and I thought about those people I know from the EU in this country and my Brit friends in the EU. What I couldn't do was vote Remain just because of their circumstances if my conscience was telling me to vote Leave.I would vote Remain if I had the chance again, and then fight closer integration as a separate battle if and when it came up. Hindsight is a wonderful thing.

True that.
As far as I can make out the uk is Goldilocks, it's too hot, or too sweet, or whatever, well now it seems we get to watch the bears eating the porridge from outside the window.......hoping we can pay through the nose for the scraps at the end.

professorben

For the record, I don't believe that the economy will tank and we will end up like a 3rd world country.
I just saw the potential affect the change would have on my family.
Seriously if I lose my gf I'll never get another that hot again, I'm seriously punching above my weight there!!!!!

Chalky

Axe_meister;1132706" said:

The biggest risk with EU is the southern nations being a massive drag on the EU economy as a whole.
The only way to fix that is a closer political union, I.e the ability to set tax rates, pension ages, etc, etc.
Which as usual only means taxes/ages go up.

Succinct truth Sir. The only thing I'd add is the ridiculously high levels of youth unemployment in the southern nations, not just because of its economic impact but because of its social impact if the EU continues to ignore it.

dtr

Fretwired said:

professorben said:

What was so wrong with being in the EU anyway?
I mean I've not been affected negatively in anyway that I can see by being in the EU.

Ask yourself this - do you want the Euro?

If the answer is no then leave now as our influence will diminish overtime and we'll be shackled to economically stagnant bloc that increasingly can't make decisions. The real power is in the Euro zone. We are not members, so when the economic rules are being discussed we have to leave the room. The EU is aiming for closing fiscal union (harmonisation of tax rates, budgets and so forth) and political union (EU army, seat at the security council, foreign minister) - I don't want that either.

If you want the Euro then campaign to join the Euro zone. At least we'd have a seat at the top table. But look at Europe. Greece has been treated appallingly and people are in poverty. Youth unemployment is running at 25% in some countries and growth is stagnant. Countries with the Euro can't react to the economic problems in their country as they're shackled to an inflexible currency/economic model. I don't want the UK to end up like Greece or Spain.

To most people the EU means two things. freedom of movement and free trade. If we had those elements then my guess is most people would be happy. I'm for a free trade deal that allows us to cut our own deals with other countries and I'm not fussed about freedom of movement - I'm happy to keep it with some basic protection. I think the benefits of free movement outweigh the downsides.

I want our parliament to set our laws and our courts to uphold the law along with the ECHR. The growth in the world economy will be in Asia - an independent UK can prosper IMHO.

The EU is not all bad, but the above are my major reasons for wanting to leave.

Huh?!  None of that is about anything real, it's just crystal-ball gazing!  Don't you have any concrete examples of actual problems?

Chalky

@dtr - the youth unemployment is very real for those caught up in it.

english_bob

professorben said:

Seriously if I lose my gf I'll never get another that hot again, I'm seriously punching above my weight there!!!!!

So the 'bating thread comes later then.

professorben

english_bob;1132747" said:

professorben said:

Seriously if I lose my gf I'll never get another that hot again, I'm seriously punching above my weight there!!!!!So the 'bating thread comes later then.

Give me your credit card details I'll snapchat you......

digitalscream

professorben said:

Seriously if I lose my gf I'll never get another that hot again, I'm seriously punching above my weight there!!!!!

For the record, he's underselling it here.

professorben

@dtr this is kinda my point, as far as I can see, there were no real problems.

professorben

digitalscream;1132757" said:

professorben said:Seriously if I lose my gf I'll never get another that hot again, I'm seriously punching above my weight there!!!!!





For the record, he's underselling it here.

Thanks mate....... I think.

lloyd

I'm a remainer but good points above.

The biggest issues I have with the EU are:

It's unelected officials

The corruption, in particular the benefits given to the MEP's-hotels, expenses etc

The fact that we're 20+ very different countries with very different cultures as well as different problems, strengths and weaknesses where a "one size fits all policy" doesn't work

The Euro

Larger countries dictating to the smaller ones

dtr

Chalky said:

@dtr - the youth unemployment is very real for those caught up in it.

I agree, but youth unemployment has been coming down significantly in the last 5 years...

To me it looks like that graph is going in the direction I'd want to see continue. (Got it from here by the way - http://researchbriefings.parliament.uk/ResearchBriefing/Summary/SN05871)

it doesn't sound like you're AGAINST youth unemployment almost halving over the last five years, so I'm struggling to see what the basis of your argument is.