The Rugby Union Thread

snakemanStoo

Watching the Sale/Leicester match.  Learned a few rules that I'd never encountered before, including if there's lightening then the players should be taken off the pitch for their safety.

Gassage

Norm Hadley, party king of rugby, hardest man ever (well maybe) passed.

He lived life to the full in every aspect.

Cause of death: trying to be Norm Hadley for far longer than is humanly possible.

..

sev112

Some of you youngsters might not remember ... But in the early 90s I guess, they increased points for a try from 4 to 5 to encourage more tries and running rugby. Did precisely the opposite , loads more penalties as teams just rather give a penalty away than a try. Same will happen if we go up to 6 points. If you want more tries than penalties then give less points for tries, not more.

Rocker

Why not sin bin *everone* who gives away a penalty. No excuses. Offside - bin, joining ruck from side - bin etc.

Fretwired

exocet said:

What I fail to understand is how New Zealand manage to maintain such a consistently high standard. Even without Super Rugby, they'd still be just as good. I don't subscribe to the thinking that the NH have to play the SH in order for us to improve. Why can't improve without that? If the fans can see that the skill levels are lower in NH, surely the coaches can see it as well. What is it about the NZ system that enables them to deliver such a high quantity of quality players and why can't the NH do the same?

SH teams don't play in thick mud on freezing cold days .. Haskell played rugby in New Zealand and claims he never played a game in NZ on a wet pitch. He advocates the UK rugby season moves more towards the summer and avoids the grim months of Jan/Feb to improve handling skills.

snakemanStoo

It rains in Dunedin 367 days out of the year, yet the Highlanders don't play on wet pitches?

kjdowd

snakemanStoo;1017018" said:

Watching the Sale/Leicester match.  Learned a few rules that I'd never encountered before, including if there's lightening then the players should be taken off the pitch for their safety.

Saw the highlights last night. Cipriani's try was rather special... I'd love to think he was a Lions wild card, but too many ahead of him in the queue.

lloyd

The weather is definitely a factor, but it's not just one thing. It's a combination of many things that gives the SH teams an edge. The biggest factor for me being playing high intensity meaningful matches week in week out in the Super competition. In the European leagues, Pro12 particularly there's too many weak teams in them that are walkover teams which don't constitute a meaningful top quality game of rugby as well as the fact that international games are played while the domestic season is playing which means losing a lot of the top players for 8/9 games a year. The French league probably has too many foreigners playing in key positions for the top teams, which dilutes the National teams choices.

crunchman

Fretwired said:

exocet said:

What I fail to understand is how New Zealand manage to maintain such a consistently high standard. Even without Super Rugby, they'd still be just as good. I don't subscribe to the thinking that the NH have to play the SH in order for us to improve. Why can't improve without that? If the fans can see that the skill levels are lower in NH, surely the coaches can see it as well. What is it about the NZ system that enables them to deliver such a high quantity of quality players and why can't the NH do the same?

SH teams don't play in thick mud on freezing cold days .. Haskell played rugby in New Zealand and claims he never played a game in NZ on a wet pitch. He advocates the UK rugby season moves more towards the summer and avoids the grim months of Jan/Feb to improve handling skills.

You wouldn't want to move the season to the summer.  There are still a lot of people who play both rugby and cricket - even if not at the very highest level.  Rugby would lose good players to cricket and vice versa.  Rugby is a winter sport anyway.

Fretwired

lloyd said:

The weather is definitely a factor, but it's not just one thing. It's a combination of many things that gives the SH teams an edge. The biggest factor for me being playing high intensity meaningful matches week in week out in the Super competition. In the European leagues, Pro12 particularly there's too many weak teams in them that are walkover teams which don't constitute a meaningful top quality game of rugby as well as the fact that international games are played while the domestic season is playing which means losing a lot of the top players for 8/9 games a year. The French league probably has too many foreigners playing in key positions for the top teams, which dilutes the National teams choices.

I think the weather and the lifestyle allow people to take sport seriously. Who wants to run around a muddy field on a cold, wet January evening?

My nephew emigrated to Oz five years ago and was a top hockey player who played in a team in London which had a few ex-international players in it. In Oz he made the third team of his local club and they have 8 teams. They are all highly-competitive and sport mad. His uncle has just emigrated (to retire) with his daughter and husband. She's a fully qualified maths teacher and he's a sports teacher (he doesn't have the right teaching qualifications so didn't expect he'd get a job teaching in Oz). She got a job as a teacher and he got a job as one of the school's rugby coaches - they have three. That's all he'll be doing. How many UK state schools do you know with dedicated rugby coaches?

Fretwired

crunchman said:

Fretwired said:

exocet said:

What I fail to understand is how New Zealand manage to maintain such a consistently high standard. Even without Super Rugby, they'd still be just as good. I don't subscribe to the thinking that the NH have to play the SH in order for us to improve. Why can't improve without that? If the fans can see that the skill levels are lower in NH, surely the coaches can see it as well. What is it about the NZ system that enables them to deliver such a high quantity of quality players and why can't the NH do the same?

SH teams don't play in thick mud on freezing cold days .. Haskell played rugby in New Zealand and claims he never played a game in NZ on a wet pitch. He advocates the UK rugby season moves more towards the summer and avoids the grim months of Jan/Feb to improve handling skills.

You wouldn't want to move the season to the summer.  There are still a lot of people who play both rugby and cricket - even if not at the very highest level.  Rugby would lose good players to cricket and vice versa.  Rugby is a winter sport anyway.

Haskell's view .. http://www.skysports.com/rugby-union/news/22105/10056823/james-haskell-feels-england-should-move-domestic-game-to-summer

lloyd

I'm not sure we should take anything Haskell says about anything seriously

lloyd

Fretwired said:

lloyd said:

The weather is definitely a factor, but it's not just one thing. It's a combination of many things that gives the SH teams an edge. The biggest factor for me being playing high intensity meaningful matches week in week out in the Super competition. In the European leagues, Pro12 particularly there's too many weak teams in them that are walkover teams which don't constitute a meaningful top quality game of rugby as well as the fact that international games are played while the domestic season is playing which means losing a lot of the top players for 8/9 games a year. The French league probably has too many foreigners playing in key positions for the top teams, which dilutes the National teams choices.

I think the weather and the lifestyle allow people to take sport seriously. Who wants to run around a muddy field on a cold, wet January evening?

My nephew emigrated to Oz five years ago and was a top hockey player who played in a team in London which had a few ex-international players in it. In Oz he made the third team of his local club and they have 8 teams. They are all highly-competitive and sport mad. His uncle has just emigrated (to retire) with his daughter and husband. She's a fully qualified maths teacher and he's a sports teacher (he doesn't have the right teaching qualifications so didn't expect he'd get a job teaching in Oz). She got a job as a teacher and he got a job as one of the school's rugby coaches - they have three. That's all he'll be doing. How many UK state schools do you know with dedicated rugby coaches?

I've said this a few times in this thread but I've never met an Aussie that's not up for hitting the park to throw a footy about, I've loved with a few down the years and they've all been similar. They're a sports mad country, who wouldn't want to be outside all the time in that climate? Thats definitely a factor in their sporting success.

cj73

I'm sure I recall Luca Vialli saying the difference between the terrier like British footballers and the cultural continental was the weather.

He couldn't imagine having players standing around at training whilst they discussed tactics / worked on skills

lloyd

Alex Cuthbert is out of the NZ tour with an Achilles problem, dissapointing for him of course but I'm glad he won't be on the pitch down there. I hope he gets his head right and finds some form next season.

koneguitarist

Probably best thing for him. But Williams looks like he could be out, so let's hope Hallam Amos and others are up to it.

lloyd

We're going to get destroyed. Regardless of who plays, playing this tour at the end of this season is crazy.

tbm

lloyd said:

We're going to get destroyed. Regardless of who plays, playing this tour at the end of this season is crazy.

Yeah, I think the summer after RWC should be tour free. Ireland are doing 3 tests in SA. It'll be carnage.

lloyd

tbm said:

lloyd said:

We're going to get destroyed. Regardless of who plays, playing this tour at the end of this season is crazy.

Yeah, I think the summer after RWC should be tour free. Ireland are doing 3 tests in SA. It'll be carnage.

Ouch, could well be worse!

eSully

lloyd said:

tbm said:

lloyd said:

We're going to get destroyed. Regardless of who plays, playing this tour at the end of this season is crazy.

Yeah, I think the summer after RWC should be tour free. Ireland are doing 3 tests in SA. It'll be carnage.

Ouch, could well be worse!

I'd take SA over a tour to NZ at the end of the season anyday. Plus Ireland only have the 3 tests. Don't Wales have a friendly against England lined up before the tour and playing the Chiefs during