What happens when you die ??

sinbaadi

You appear in a strange games arcade and your grandpa Rick mocks your pathetic attempt at "The <Your Name> Game".  Then he takes a turn which also lasts approximately 2 minutes.

Sporky

Wolfetone said:

My view is that I find it incredibly difficult to conceive of the universe as an accidental thing as there is so much cleverness in it with nature being the main thing.

But there's so much bad "design" in nature.

Why do we have a blind spot? Squid don't. Their retinal cells face forwards, ours face backwards. There's no advantage to backward-facing retinal cells, but they do result in a blind spot.

Why do giraffes have a nerve that goes all the way from the brain, loops around one of the main blood vessels connecting to the heart, and goes almost all the way back up their neck to the larynx?

Those are both downright stupid - no intelligent designer (to coin a phrase) would do things like that.

Kalimna

EnglishBob - sorry, i meant that i was on the Dawkins 'end' of the scale. I missed a word out

Adam

aord43

Wolfetone said:

aord43 said:

Wolfetone said:

I believe that our existence is so unbelievably fantastic, that there must surely be more to our being than the physical aspect.

The human (and animal) form is a mystifying and wonderful creation that still confounds understanding and science. As it's unravelled, the more astonishing it becomes. Our bodies are fantastic machines and it's 'operating system' could be described as our essence or 'soul'. It's well within the realms of my thinking that the physical and being are two separate things and therefore capable of different endings.

Putting my cards firmly on the table, I cannot believe that we weren't created and that there are unbelievable things to be eventually revealed. I am certain that the spirit travels on.

  

This is just "the argument from personal incredulity".  There are many things in the modern world that people from 1000 years ago would find impossible.
Just because you can't understand something is not an argument for magic.

I can't claim authorship of the following but this is just the tip of the iceberg. It will be a little longer until mankind can create such things.I think I wouldn't be alone in being amazed at our being.

I believe that there are more things to be revealed that instruments cannot measure yet. What about the unique nature of our irises and finger prints and DNA. Our creator has us individually and uniquely made. We are all utterly unique. Whether you are an believer or atheistic, surely, you cannot be nothing but staggered at our being. 

..SNIP...

Yes all amazing things but I am not sure what you think that proves.

aord43

xibxang said:

fields5069 said:

horse said:

But if you accept that there is still more to discover, then why can't that include things which at the moment you'd consider as 'magic'? My limited understanding is that at quantum level things which would seem magical based on our day to day lives' experience of and understanding of the world do very much happen - our physical world is actually very different to what we commonly think of it as.

My comment on this would be - what is that magic? Nearly all religious "miracles" are bullshit and can be dis-proven, or at least replicated. I can't think of anything in day to day life which needs a supernatural explanation.

Have a look at this video. In short though, particles behave in a certain way until you look at them and then their behaviour changes completely. Because you're looking at them.

No time to watch now but I assume that's the double-slit experiment. Very cool and bizarre. Just shows how weird nature is.

marantz1300

You decompose and your molecules are recycled as other life forms.

there is a finite amount of carbon on earth ,all life that has ever existed is using the same carbon.

you have no conscious thought so there is no feeling.

nothing to worry about .

a nice rest and parts of you become something else.

Drew_TNBD

xibxang said:

fields5069 said:

horse said:

But if you accept that there is still more to discover, then why can't that include things which at the moment you'd consider as 'magic'? My limited understanding is that at quantum level things which would seem magical based on our day to day lives' experience of and understanding of the world do very much happen - our physical world is actually very different to what we commonly think of it as.

My comment on this would be - what is that magic? Nearly all religious "miracles" are bullshit and can be dis-proven, or at least replicated. I can't think of anything in day to day life which needs a supernatural explanation.

Have a look at this video. In short though, particles behave in a certain way until you look at them and then their behaviour changes completely. Because you're looking at them.

OMG! NOW I BLEVI IN GAWD!

Roland

Sporky said:

I'm of the view that near death experiences are an emergent consequence of how the brain works. 

There is research which supports this view. Experiments have duplicated near death experiences by inducing a shortage of oxygen.

horse said:

fields5069 said:

horse said:

But if you accept that there is still more to discover, then why can't that include things which at the moment you'd consider as 'magic'? My limited understanding is that at quantum level things which would seem magical based on our day to day lives' experience of and understanding of the world do very much happen - our physical world is actually very different to what we commonly think of it as.

My comment on this would be - what is that magic? Nearly all religious "miracles" are bullshit and can be dis-proven, or at least replicated. I can't think of anything in day to day life which needs a supernatural explanation.

Well for me the actual existence of the universe and our individual consciousness could do with some additional explanation

Current thinking on consciousness is that we each build and carry with us a mental model of the world. We update this model continually. The model contains a wide range of stuff, from visual images of our surroundings to values and attitudes. We are prone to question and reject, or even ignore, information which does not match the model. It's easier to reject something which doesn't match the model because it requires less effort than considering and updating. Failure to adequately weigh up information and update the model can lead to several conditions. At one extreme are various forms of madness. Nearer home is extremism, where someone latches onto a world view which is sold to them, rather than working out their own. Racism, nationalism, sexism, and other -isms are found here. Society often declares as insane any world view which is radically different from that societies norms. 

This theory of consciousness needs a bit of digesting. It doesn't tell us whether anything is right or wrong. It does help us understand how we can manage uncertainty by holding contradictory views. It also explains why some people hold and defend beliefs which to others seem wrong. 

marantz1300

Space and time do not exist, but blink in and out of existence when they react with gravitational loops in contact with their granular selfs.

Wolfetone

aord43 said:

Wolfetone said:

aord43 said:

Wolfetone said:

I believe that our existence is so unbelievably fantastic, that there must surely be more to our being than the physical aspect.

The human (and animal) form is a mystifying and wonderful creation that still confounds understanding and science. As it's unravelled, the more astonishing it becomes. Our bodies are fantastic machines and it's 'operating system' could be described as our essence or 'soul'. It's well within the realms of my thinking that the physical and being are two separate things and therefore capable of different endings.

Putting my cards firmly on the table, I cannot believe that we weren't created and that there are unbelievable things to be eventually revealed. I am certain that the spirit travels on.

  

This is just "the argument from personal incredulity".  There are many things in the modern world that people from 1000 years ago would find impossible.
Just because you can't understand something is not an argument for magic.

I can't claim authorship of the following but this is just the tip of the iceberg. It will be a little longer until mankind can create such things.I think I wouldn't be alone in being amazed at our being.

I believe that there are more things to be revealed that instruments cannot measure yet. What about the unique nature of our irises and finger prints and DNA. Our creator has us individually and uniquely made. We are all utterly unique. Whether you are an believer or atheistic, surely, you cannot be nothing but staggered at our being. 

..SNIP...

Yes all amazing things but I am not sure what you think that proves.

It doesn't prove anything and nor did I say so.

It's an observation which, to me, may suggest something. I am fairly sure that we are in the stone age where it comes to understanding the true nature of the universe and, apart from pressing forward, we should keep an open mind about all things.

Seeking out adversarial arguments about such things doesn't make sense because all we have is our opinions based upon our own individual experiences.

Sassafras

marantz1300 said:

Space and time do not exist, but blink in and out of existence when they react with gravitational loops in contact with their granular selfs.

I often wondered if that was the case.

Philtre

Axe_meister said:

Do you remember what it was like before you where born/concieved?

I remember something after I was born. My mum said, "son, just remember one thing - I before E except after C".

Wolfetone

Sporky said:

Wolfetone said:

My view is that I find it incredibly difficult to conceive of the universe as an accidental thing as there is so much cleverness in it with nature being the main thing.

But there's so much bad "design" in nature.

Why do we have a blind spot? Squid don't. Their retinal cells face forwards, ours face backwards. There's no advantage to backward-facing retinal cells, but they do result in a blind spot.

Why do giraffes have a nerve that goes all the way from the brain, loops around one of the main blood vessels connecting to the heart, and goes almost all the way back up their neck to the larynx?

Those are both downright stupid - no intelligent designer (to coin a phrase) would do things like that.

That's interesting but, doesn't that make a bit of a case against the theory of evolution? Surely those stupid features would have disappeared through evolution...unless their presence and design actually does have a purpose and we haven't spotted it yet?

ibis

Funkfingers said:

tone1 said:

You get different sort of GAS  

T'is true.

A guitarist in my area works in his family's undertaking business. Flatus builds up in the recently deceased. Eventually, it lets itself out. In short, stiffs fart.

Ever see Swiss Army Man?

Emp_Fab

We can all ask @chillidoggy on Tuesday.  He's decided to sacrifice himself to Irma in the name of some Bulldog spirit or something.

menamestom

Wolfetone said:

Sporky said:

Wolfetone said:

My view is that I find it incredibly difficult to conceive of the universe as an accidental thing as there is so much cleverness in it with nature being the main thing.

But there's so much bad "design" in nature.

Why do we have a blind spot? Squid don't. Their retinal cells face forwards, ours face backwards. There's no advantage to backward-facing retinal cells, but they do result in a blind spot.

Why do giraffes have a nerve that goes all the way from the brain, loops around one of the main blood vessels connecting to the heart, and goes almost all the way back up their neck to the larynx?

Those are both downright stupid - no intelligent designer (to coin a phrase) would do things like that.

That's interesting but, doesn't that make a bit of a case against the theory of evolution? Surely those stupid features would have disappeared through evolution...unless their presence and design actually does have a purpose and we haven't spotted it yet?

Bad 'design' can become useful with changes in conditions/environment, which is totally down to chance.  What can be a disadvantage can become an advantage if the conditions change.  Example, people with sickle cell anemia being less susceptible to malaria.  There's no such things as stupid features, features either suit the environment or they don't.  If the environment changes the cards are re-dealt.

Kalimna

Regarding giraffes and evolution. Evolution works by making slow changes to an organisms body plan right from the protein molecules to the overall shape. Things can only change incrementally, and the clock cant go backwards. Without a little knowledge of embryology, it is difficult to explain the giraffe as mentioned above. But if you can picture the nerve in question (the recurrent laryngeal nerve, humans have it too but on a shorter neck) joining 2 points on the small blob of cells that is a giraffe embryo (an interesting side point, but if you look at the very early stages of vertebrate embryos then they are virtually indestinguishable fish look like apes etc) being crossed over by the artery, then as the embryo develops and the various body parts settle in their eventual place, the elongation of the neck versus the static heart stretches the nerve to follow its path. To replace this with a more sensible route would need for the larynx to disappear along with its nerve and then redevelop with a foreknowledge of where it will end up and then 'know' how to get there without entanglement. In shory it couldnt happen. This would be so much easier to explain with a diagram!!!

There are many quirks about the human body that act as good evidence for evolution and the accumulation of adaptations to specific points.
Apart from the neck as described above, we have an appendix that does one of three things - either nothing at all, sickness or death. It has no known usefull function.
Another quirk may also point to humans being a missing link/transitional species. Generally speaking humans have a high mortality during birth than other mammals. One of the reasons postulated is that the human birth canal (female pelvis) hasnt evolved in step with the human evolution into fully erect posture and consequently babies get 'stuck' a lot more frequently. Another 100000years or so would have sorted it.
But i ramble on.

siraxeman

Kalimna said:

Another 100000years or so would have sorted it.

The story of evolution!

Reverend

Philtre said:

Axe_meister said:

Do you remember what it was like before you where born/concieved?

I remember something after I was born. My mum said, "son, just remember one thing - I before E except after C".

Which is not true. That's scientifically proven. 

ToneControl

SFA