The Rugby Union Thread

fretmeister

p90fool said:

tbm said:

Yeah, if it opens up England will get minced. If it doesn't though...   Like those first two Boks tries were against the run of play and were the result of them jumping on opportunities the French gave them. Just don't give them the chances and slow down the breakdown and don't give away penalties and  take you opportunities and score some tries. Easy. 

I agree. "Let's keep it turgid, guys" is probably England's mantra before every game, but to be fair they are good at bogging down good opposition. 

It is our only hope I think!

elstoof

Borthwick’s career has been building up to this moment

crunchman

TimmyO said:

Agree with that - I think the only thing England have to try and deal with that is May's and Stewards' defensive nouse positionally. I'd pick those 2 

Steward has to come back in.  You don't want Smith under those kicks SA put up.

exocet

SA won't want to put too much effort into playing England, they'll want to hold as much back as possible to conserve energy for the final. On that basis, I don't expect to see a thumping dished out - might even allow a "turgid England" to turn the game around in the final 15 mins by stepping on the gas...if they can find it.

fretmeister

Turgid... but with Ford going for the drop goal every time he's in range might be our only hope.

Creed_Clicks

When I look at Borthwick, he always reminds me of a fella who smells of Guinness farts.

Offset

Anyone know of a good sports bar in central Athens which will be showing the semis?!

sev112

Smith to the wing, steward to FB

guitars4you

I dare say that Farrell wouldn't mind being dropped for this one !!!!!!!!!!!!!! - 'Count me out boss'

exocet

Creed_Clicks said:

When I look at Borthwick, he always reminds me of a fella who smells of Guinness farts.

Post match / on camera interviews he comes across as being so out of his comfort zone / rabbit in the headlights type stuff. England should've stuck with Stuart Lancaster back in 2015 and fully supported him to build the squad and style of play for 2019 WC and beyond.

Gassage

For those of you who consistently slag Farrell off….

I’m lucky enough to have spent 12 yrs interacting professionally with Owen Farrell.

To say he’s the most honest and hardworking bloke you’ll meet is wholly accurate.

Those Eng fans booing him need to give themselves an uppercut. It’s totally unacceptable.

My take:

#ENGvRSA #rugbyworldcup2023

Owen Farrell: You never realise what you have until you've lost it : PlanetRugby

elstoof

What’s your take on the “leadership group” claims by Cipriani?

Gassage

elstoof said:

What’s your take on the “leadership group” claims by Cipriani?

That if he launched his own wine range the vintage would be spoiled by the acerbic fruit.

He's an absolute flake of a player who wasn't near to good enough in attitude, fitness or commitment.

digitalscream

Gassage said:

For those of you who consistently slag Farrell off….

I’m lucky enough to have spent 12 yrs interacting professionally with Owen Farrell.

To say he’s the most honest and hardworking bloke you’ll meet is wholly accurate.

Those Eng fans booing him need to give themselves an uppercut. It’s totally unacceptable.

My take:

#ENGvRSA #rugbyworldcup2023

Owen Farrell: You never realise what you have until you've lost it : PlanetRugby

OK, genuine question - why do you think a lot of fans don't like him?

TJT1979

Good article @Gassage. I agree that the treatment of Farrell in general in unwarranted. 

In the last few years the high tackles have done him no favours. 

What I personally struggle with is the sense that he’s undroppable, even when others seem to to be on better form. During this WC I think Ford earned the right to continue, yet as soon as Farrell was available he went straight back in despite being more hit and miss in terms of current form. This is in no way Farrell’s fault… all he can do is train and play to his best, and the rest is out of his hands. 

What are your thoughts on the rumours that Arundell isn’t being picked because of friction with OF?

Gassage

TJT1979 said:

Good article @Gassage. I agree that the treatment of Farrell in general in unwarranted. 

In the last few years the high tackles have done him no favours. 

What I personally struggle with is the sense that he’s undroppable, even when others seem to to be on better form. During this WC I think Ford earned the right to continue, yet as soon as Farrell was available he went straight back in despite being more hit and miss in terms of current form. This is in no way Farrell’s fault… all he can do is train and play to his best, and the rest is out of his hands. 

What are your thoughts on the rumours that Arundell isn’t being picked because of friction with OF?

I know for a fact it's absolute bollocks. Much more down to Arundell's defence.

crunchman

digitalscream said:

Gassage said:

For those of you who consistently slag Farrell off….

I’m lucky enough to have spent 12 yrs interacting professionally with Owen Farrell.

To say he’s the most honest and hardworking bloke you’ll meet is wholly accurate.

Those Eng fans booing him need to give themselves an uppercut. It’s totally unacceptable.

My take:

#ENGvRSA #rugbyworldcup2023

Owen Farrell: You never realise what you have until you've lost it : PlanetRugby

OK, genuine question - why do you think a lot of fans don't like him?

 I can't answer for @Gassage but as a fan there are a few factors.

He doesn't have the flair of a Ford or Smith.

There are the persistent high tackles.  He's a liability.  There is a significant chance of him getting sent off and England playing with 14 men in any match he's in (possibly 13 men if Curry is playing as well).  It's the persistent nature of them, which suggests stupidity or arrogance on his part.  He's either too stupid to change, or so arrogant he doesn't think he needs to.

His perpetual whining at refs is annoying.  I know it's his job to talk to the ref as captain, but Lawes didn't whine in the same way when he was captain.

Above all, I think it's his association with the style of play that England have adopted.  When he's in the team, it's like we have given up on running the ball, and are just going to kick it all the time.  It's the lack of ambition.  That's not Farrell's fault but he is the symptom for it and becomes the scapegoat.

Gassage

digitalscream said:

Gassage said:

For those of you who consistently slag Farrell off….

I’m lucky enough to have spent 12 yrs interacting professionally with Owen Farrell.

To say he’s the most honest and hardworking bloke you’ll meet is wholly accurate.

Those Eng fans booing him need to give themselves an uppercut. It’s totally unacceptable.

My take:

#ENGvRSA #rugbyworldcup2023

Owen Farrell: You never realise what you have until you've lost it : PlanetRugby

OK, genuine question - why do you think a lot of fans don't like him?

I wish I knew.

elstoof

I can’t comment on his character off the pitch obviously, and I don’t agree with booing him for being picked. As a player I think he’s quite limited and not englands best 10 even on his best day. His distribution is one dimensional, he’s not a great ball carrier, defensively he’s a liability - particularly when he sees red, which happens regularly - just watch any one of the anti-highlight reels on YouTube. He can kick reliably enough though. I can’t understand why every match day XV is built around getting him on the pitch, anywhere, doesn’t matter so long as he’s there.

All the talk in his defence revolves around what a great leader he is and what he does behind the scenes, that may be true but where exactly has he led the team? Whatever’s going on in training doesn’t seem to be doing any good on match day, the team played better when he was banned. That’s probably more damning than any comment I can make on his playing abilities imo. Perhaps his eagerness to “step up” is what’s allowing others on the team to shy away from any responsibilities themselves

Blaendulais

elstoof said:

I can’t comment on his character off the pitch obviously, and I don’t agree with booing him for being picked. As a player I think he’s quite limited and not englands best 10 even on his best day. His distribution is one dimensional, he’s not a great ball carrier, defensively he’s a liability - particularly when he sees red, which happens regularly - just watch any one of the anti-highlight reels on YouTube. He can kick reliably enough though. I can’t understand why every match day XV is built around gutting on the pitch, anywhere, doesn’t matter so long as he’s there.

All the talk in his defence revolves around what a great leader he is and what he does behind the scenes, that may be true but where exactly has he led the team? Whatever’s going on in training doesn’t seem to be doing any good on match day, the team played better when he was banned. That’s probably more damning than any comment I can make on his playing abilities imo. Perhaps his eagerness to “step up” is what’s allowing others on the team to shy away from any responsibilities themselves

wisdom