Was it all really about immigration ?

quarky

Supply and demand of basic services. The infrastructure isn't coping with the increases that we are having in terms of housing, etc.

Democractic control. I have long being in favour of those making the decisions being affected by them, which means power devolved locally where possible (which is why I would have voted for Scottish independence I think). The EU is the opposite of that because it wants to centralise control at yet another level about national level.

Economics. I think having more control over our economy is going to be better in the long run. The EU economically is a mess, no one would deny that, and they constantly fail to deal with the issues.

Also, after living overseas for years, it just seems weird not to be an independent country.

Maybe I am wrong, maybe right, none of us will ever know.

Heartfeltdawn

Drew_fx said:

Out of interest guv, what were you doing there? I thought exit polls were not allowed?

@Drew_fx I was poll clerking. Got down to the polling station at 6.30am, set the place up (signs, tables, voting boothes etc). Doors open bang on 7am and then it's 15 hours of handing out ballots, telling people what the process involves, keeping my patience when morons talk of using pens instead of pencils and conspiracy theories, general admin, dealing with people dropping in postal ballots, proxy voters, anyone who hasn't appeared on the electoral roll and wants to vote (we had one all day which was simple to rectify with one phone call). 

At 10pm the doors are shut. When they close then the ballot boxes are immediately sealed with those plastic cable ties that can only be removed by cutting them (in Bristol, every ballot box is sealed with witnesses when the polls close. They are only opened when every single one is back and accounted for in the count building). All unused ballot papers are rounded up in one bag. The list of voters goes in another envelope, the list of ballot papers issued to which voter number in another envelope, a few calculations are done to make sure everything tallies up (ie.that the number of ballots issued matches the correct serial number that was next to be used) and so on. I also claimed the prize as we had a little bet on the eventual number of ballots we'd issue all day and I was 6 away. 

It was the fith time I've done it. I've got enough experience to be a presiding officer now (head of each polling station) but the lack of driving licence means I can't do it as I need to lug a ballot box and suitcase full of stuff around and there's no way I'm doing that on a pushbike. PO's get more money than clerks. Either counting or clerking is a really good way to see a totally different side of politics and to get a handle on the type of people in that voting area. Bristol had a 72.3% turnout so decent figures but my station was never rushed, just a good steady flow of people and well up on the May 2016 local election turnout. So when people talk to you, as a poll clerk you have to remain neutral so it's a case of nodding along and listening. The actual feel of it is like a fucking long coffee morning and it's mostly good natured.

On the pencils front, you probably saw news articles on the folk handing out pens outside of polling stations and whining when the police were called. This is absolutely the right thing to do and follows Electoral Commission guidelines. It happened when I clerked in Bath one year. Some students started protesting against the then-proposed rise in student fees outside of the polling station, thus hampering people who wanted to vote. Cops called, they came, students dispersed. Those rules are there so that campaigning of any kind can't hinder those trying to vote. 

UnclePsychosis

If immigration wasn't a massive vote winner then the likes of Farage would never have been daft enough to produce those hugely controversial "breaking point" posters.

There's no point risking being called a racist if you don't think it'll get you votes.

Jeremiah

I wonder if the short term result will be a big increase in migration (in both directions) as those keen to come to the UK (or leave) rush to do so while they still can.

marantz1300

A lot of people tend to blame the immigrants for their shit life's rather then politician's who do the bidding of their corporate masters.
We'll see how jit pans out.Looks A bit grim in the financial markets at the moment.
Still who needs jobs , workers/human rights and cheap goods.

Axe_meister

marantz1300 said:

A lot of people tend to blame the immigrants for their shit life's rather then politician's who do the bidding of their corporate masters.
We'll see how jit pans out.Looks A bit grim in the financial markets at the moment.
Still who needs jobs , workers/human rights and cheap goods.

And a lot of people will blame immigrants and the politicians rather than blame themselves for their shit lives!

EricTheWeary

They had people from Prince's End on the local news. It's where I spent chunks of my childhood and very white working class. Previously a target area for the BNP and one for UKIP now. It was all about immigration for them. One of my admin staff at work told me she'd voted Leave because of the immigration issue. Couldn't quite bring myself to ask which way her Jamaican mother voted...

siremoon

I voted Leave because I was appalled by the EU's refusal to look at itself and the way it operated and realise there were things which needed reform. I see now it is talking about changes.  Horse bolted etc.  I genuinely believe if they'd given Cameron more when they had the chance then this wouldn't have happened.  They put two fingers up to him and this is the result.

The shock in Europe at the outcome is very instructive imo.  It clearly never occured to them that this might happen.  This is going to hurt them just as much as us if not more.  The hotheads in certain capital cities across the continent need to shut up and realise that what is needed now is calm and a measured process. Thankfully Germany seems to be realising this

lloyd

I have to say that voting in Britain is very British. No need for security, no fears of rigging or intimidation.

Just a few old dears in your local church or community centre drinking tea.

Which is nice.

I've done a bit of election work as a student-counting votes on the night and postal ones earlier on-good little earner to be fair, and all te weak tea and biscuits you can handle.

Drew_TNBD

EricTheWeary;1124408" said:

They had people from Prince's End on the local news. It's where I spent chunks of my childhood and very white working class. Previously a target area for the BNP and one for UKIP now. It was all about immigration for them. One of my admin staff at work told me she'd voted Leave because of the immigration issue. Couldn't quite bring myself to ask which way her Jamaican mother voted...

So someone mixed race can't be concerned about immigration? That's a bit racist Eric. I'll show my mixed race daughter this thread when she is old enough!

ThePrettyDamned

Just watched anglia news and it was a bit cringey, hearing people's reasons for voting leave. I'm sure there are remain voters with similarly shit reasons but...

"I don't trust David Cameron" - err...

"London doesn't get migrants like we do" - err...

"I regret voting leave" - not sure what to say in response.

It's a bit weird. It's almost like some voted in protest, but for something that's unrelated to the protest they wanted...

lloyd

Drew_fx;1124416" said:

[quote="EricTheWeary;1124408"]They had people from Prince's End on the local news. It's where I spent chunks of my childhood and very white working class. Previously a target area for the BNP and one for UKIP now. It was all about immigration for them. One of my admin staff at work told me she'd voted Leave because of the immigration issue. Couldn't quite bring myself to ask which way her Jamaican mother voted...

So someone mixed race can't be concerned about immigration? That's a bit racist Eric. I'll show my mixed race daughter this thread when she is old enough!
[/quote]

Yeah, weird logic.

I know at least one black British and a few white foreigners who have expressed concern about immigration, it's a legitimate issue that doesn't have to be about race in the slightest.

The fact that somebody's parents or grandparents immigrated 30/50 years ago has fuck all to do with immigration issues today.

The biggest issue about immigration today (I think) has more to do with the chronic underfunding and wasted use of funds of public services over the last few decades.

capo4th

ThePrettyDamned said:

Just watched anglia news and it was a bit cringey, hearing people's reasons for voting leave. I'm sure there are remain voters with similarly shit reasons but...

"I don't trust David Cameron" - err...

"London doesn't get migrants like we do" - err...

"I regret voting leave" - not sure what to say in response.

It's a bit weird. It's almost like some voted in protest, but for something that's unrelated to the protest they wanted...

this loads of people have done this without any thought apart from a few sound bites they have heard down the pub or listening to Farage on the TV. Enjoy filling up your car next week!

guitarfishbay

I've got loads of mates who look like XYZ race but are more British than I am. I often wonder if people from all white families think culture is built in to skin tone and surname - not an attack on anyone here just an observation (and first hand in many cases).

TheBlueWolf

There's no getting around the fact that immigration played it's parr, although I'd hope it's not the only thing people based their vote on.

I've noticed amongst Leave voters on my Facebook feed, that it featured highly, along with Britain not being bogged down in so much red tape.

EricTheWeary

Drew_fx said:

EricTheWeary;1124408" said:

They had people from Prince's End on the local news. It's where I spent chunks of my childhood and very white working class. Previously a target area for the BNP and one for UKIP now. It was all about immigration for them. One of my admin staff at work told me she'd voted Leave because of the immigration issue. Couldn't quite bring myself to ask which way her Jamaican mother voted...

So someone mixed race can't be concerned about immigration? That's a bit racist Eric. I'll show my mixed race daughter this thread when she is old enough!

She can be and obviously is, just seemed a bit ironic. 

chillidoggy

Emp raises a good question. 

Round here, immigration is a huge issue, whether real or perceived. I suspect that's the case in most other areas, too. And that's what the politicos ignored: People were convinced it was an issue, and they failed to address the concerns. Simple as that.

But then there's the EU itself. An unstoppable, power-hungry monster. It's like The Empire from Star Wars, with Juncker as The Emperor.

Drew_TNBD

guitarfishbay;1124442" said:

I've got loads of mates who look like XYZ race but are more British than I am. I often wonder if people from all white families think culture is built in to skin tone and surname - not an attack on anyone here just an observation (and first hand in many cases).

You should ask the Polish that question!

Drew_TNBD

EricTheWeary said:

Drew_fx said:

EricTheWeary;1124408" said:

They had people from Prince's End on the local news. It's where I spent chunks of my childhood and very white working class. Previously a target area for the BNP and one for UKIP now. It was all about immigration for them. One of my admin staff at work told me she'd voted Leave because of the immigration issue. Couldn't quite bring myself to ask which way her Jamaican mother voted...

So someone mixed race can't be concerned about immigration? That's a bit racist Eric. I'll show my mixed race daughter this thread when she is old enough!

She can be and obviously is, just seemed a bit ironic. 

Nothing ironic about it. She is her own person and isn't tied to what her parents want or think.

cacophony

ronnyb said:

Without getting into the argument that they do low paid jobs which British people won't do, it's interesting to note that the 2 highest polling areas for leave were Boston and South Holland, Lincolnshire, close to 75% for leave. There's been loads in the media about eastern European immigrants working in Agriculture there putting a strain on public services. 

and the 5th biggest majority for the leave camp, was gt yarmouth, which is like downtown sarajevo/tirana. that's not coincidence. when people start to feel like `outsiders` in the towns in which they were born, they are going to hit out.