NeuralDSP / Darkglass helix type thing....? Now with Rabea demo!

fretmeister

NelsonP said:

£399 and a similar form factor, with an expression pedal. The tones in the neural quad are going to have to be amazing to justify an extra £1000. 

They must be pretty miffed with Line 6, who have not only stolen their thunder, but also have the POD in the hands of the 'influencers' and are already shipping it.

Not remotely the same product. The Pod Go has a simple signal path, no midi, no XLR, no amp control. No multiple instruments / dual paths.

Its like comparing a road car with the Merc W10.
Its not even the same sport.

TeleMaster

Aha. 

Are they the same amp models/sounds? 

fretmeister

TeleMaster said:

Aha. 

Are they the same amp models/sounds? 

Same inspiration - everyone wants an old Plexi / Dual Rec / Twin etc.

But spend any time with a Helix and a Fractal and a Kemper and you'll discover that the model for the, for example, Marshall JCM 800 2203 will sound different on all 3 platforms.

Part of that will be due to the individual physical amp used as the reference point by the maker and a lot of it will be what their algorithm is doing and how it recreates the sound.

An original decades old POD has a Plexi model. So does the current daddy, the Axe-FX 3.

They do not sound the same, and they don't feel similar either.

fretmeister

Nww vid from Rabea

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OMVXZYBUhpU

John_A

fretmeister said:

Nww vid from Rabea

That sounds great, much better then earlier demos

PolarityMan

Sounds better but still not setting the world on fire, particularly on the cleans I didnt like the way it distorted as he dug in, it was almost like it was just distorting on the low end only with a bit of fizz on the highs and the main body of the tone was left behind..kinda weird to explain. 

The crunch with delay was my favourite tone from that vid. 

Jonathanthomas83

PolarityMan said:

Sounds better but still not setting the world on fire, particularly on the cleans I didnt like the way it distorted as he dug in, it was almost like it was just distorting on the low end only with a bit of fizz on the highs and the main body of the tone was left behind..kinda weird to explain. 

The crunch with delay was my favourite tone from that vid. 

He said at the beginning, as he does with every clean setting that he sets up...he likes a bit of grit on it. That distortion on his cleans is dialled in on purpose.

lysander

I thought the clean and crunch sounded really bad, and it doesn't seem like Rabea was enjoying the sounds at all, given how he played and his reaction. Didn't bother listening past half.

Edit: having listening to the whole thing now I haven’t changed my mind, the tones were just poor IMO. And I often watch Rabea’s reviews and you can tell when he’s genuinely enjoying the gear and digging in rather than saying ‘cool’ and moving to the next preset.

TeleMaster

I thought it sounds decent from 6.30. I have heard similar from the Helix. 

I'm not blown away though. But it's one guy demoing it. 

PolarityMan

Jonathanthomas83 said:

PolarityMan said:

Sounds better but still not setting the world on fire, particularly on the cleans I didnt like the way it distorted as he dug in, it was almost like it was just distorting on the low end only with a bit of fizz on the highs and the main body of the tone was left behind..kinda weird to explain. 

The crunch with delay was my favourite tone from that vid. 

He said at the beginning, as he does with every clean setting that he sets up...he likes a bit of grit on it. That distortion on his cleans is dialled in on purpose.

It's weird though it doesn't break up like a clean on an amp does. At least not the ones I like.

smudge_lad

TeleMaster said:

I thought it sounds decent from 6.30. I have heard similar from the Helix. 

I'm not blown away though. But it's one guy demoing it. 

Why are people expecting to be “blown away”?No offence meant here btw, just a general wondering on my part.

The Helix, Kemper etc are all producing some outstanding sounds and tones, and we are surely almost at a point now where online demo’s are all going to sound fairly similar and just as good as each other? The difference will be using one in the flesh, through our own rigs, and will also come down to form factor etc

PolarityMan

Given the established playerd quality bar I think that people recognise in order to compete at the top end of the price spectrum a new player needs to bring something beyond the incumbents just to differentiate.

TeleMaster

smudge_lad said:

TeleMaster said:

I thought it sounds decent from 6.30. I have heard similar from the Helix. 

I'm not blown away though. But it's one guy demoing it. 

Why are people expecting to be “blown away”?No offence meant here btw, just a general wondering on my part.

The Helix, Kemper etc are all producing some outstanding sounds and tones, and we are surely almost at a point now where online demo’s are all going to sound fairly similar and just as good as each other? The difference will be using one in the flesh, through our own rigs, and will also come down to form factor etc

Well this is a new product that's come out 10 years after the Kemper, 5 years after the Helix and based on the demos released by the company it doesn't sound as good as these much older products. 

I'm expecting advancements in the sound, something that brings us closer to a real amp (because Helix/Kemper are not 100%) and its not happened. Its more advanced in the user interface but the sound quality hasn't moved forward.

So I was expecting/hoping that this product, with the reputation of the company and the time that's passed might give us something that will make me go wow, but it hasn't. 

I'm not saying it's not a good product but based on what I've heard so far nothing has convinced me that this is better than the Kemper, which I think is the closest to a real amp. 

Jonathanthomas83

I agree with @smudge_lad. If we keep saying that we're at the point of diminishing returns in terms of the sounds we can get from Axe FX, Kemper and Helix, that we keep saying are almost dead on the same as the real thing, then expecting even more from this is a bit much.

p90fool

Jonathanthomas83 said:

I agree with @smudge_lad. If we keep saying that we're at the point of diminishing returns in terms of the sounds we can get from Axe FX, Kemper and Helix, that we keep saying are almost dead on the same as the real thing, then expecting even more from this is a bit much.

We're not all saying that, they still don't react to volume and playing input changes like a real amp. If that's not a part of you're style then you're in luck, but a lot of us are crying out for advances in modelling rather than just the user interface. 

Rabea is a very nice player, but he plays like someone who grew up with "patches" rather than someone who had to wring every nuance out of one sound, like an acoustic guitarist or old school electric player. 

That's not a criticism btw, but you can almost always tell a pre- or post-POD kid in a blind test. 

TeleMaster

Jonathanthomas83 said:

I agree with @smudge_lad. If we keep saying that we're at the point of diminishing returns in terms of the sounds we can get from Axe FX, Kemper and Helix, that we keep saying are almost dead on the same as the real thing, then expecting even more from this is a bit much.

Maybe from them yea, but those products are fairly old now. 

If the Kemper is still the best sounding thing about in 20 years I'll be very surprised. The technology will always improve. 

kennedydream1980

This seems a bit ridiculous now!!

https://imgur.com/gallery/ALvMGQj

TeleMaster

kennedydream1980 said:

This seems a bit ridiculous now!!

https://imgur.com/gallery/ALvMGQj

I can definitely see why they'd give it that award, I just don't know if it'll live up to the hype.

We'll see. I'm trying to have an open mind!

smudge_lad

TeleMaster said:

smudge_lad said:

TeleMaster said:

I thought it sounds decent from 6.30. I have heard similar from the Helix. 

I'm not blown away though. But it's one guy demoing it. 

Why are people expecting to be “blown away”?No offence meant here btw, just a general wondering on my part.

The Helix, Kemper etc are all producing some outstanding sounds and tones, and we are surely almost at a point now where online demo’s are all going to sound fairly similar and just as good as each other? The difference will be using one in the flesh, through our own rigs, and will also come down to form factor etc

Well this is a new product that's come out 10 years after the Kemper, 5 years after the Helix and based on the demos released by the company it doesn't sound as good as these much older products. 

I'm expecting advancements in the sound, something that brings us closer to a real amp (because Helix/Kemper are not 100%) and its not happened. Its more advanced in the user interface but the sound quality hasn't moved forward.

So I was expecting/hoping that this product, with the reputation of the company and the time that's passed might give us something that will make me go wow, but it hasn't. 

I'm not saying it's not a good product but based on what I've heard so far nothing has convinced me that this is better than the Kemper, which I think is the closest to a real amp. 

You’re basing all of this on YouTube videos though, aren’t you? 

Maybe it hasn’t progressed, but my point is that surely we’ll get to a point where they all sound amazing/the same?

Jonathanthomas83

p90fool said:

Jonathanthomas83 said:

I agree with @smudge_lad. If we keep saying that we're at the point of diminishing returns in terms of the sounds we can get from Axe FX, Kemper and Helix, that we keep saying are almost dead on the same as the real thing, then expecting even more from this is a bit much.

We're not all saying that, they still don't react to volume and playing input changes like a real amp. If that's not a part of you're style then you're in luck, but a lot of us are crying out for advances in modelling rather than just the user interface. 

Rabea is a very nice player, but he plays like someone who grew up with "patches" rather than someone who had to wring every nuance out of one sound, like an acoustic guitarist or old school electric player. 

That's not a criticism btw, but you can almost always tell a pre- or post-POD kid in a blind test. 

With due respect, you don't need to wring every nuance out of one sound any more either.