Ian Elson Guitars - AVOID!!

Danielsguitars

Onpar said:

Danielsguitars said:

It's people like this that give a proper custom builder a bad name and potentially put off anyone ever ordering anything again.

A custom flat top build is still more expensive to do than any mass made sub £1500 guitar.

I built a strat for someone and the whole lot works out about £1,000 in parts then add time and paying for a workshop etc, even at £2k no one is getting rich, I also had to customise the neck after it was finished to suit him a little better, it was only a small amount needed but still that's extra time doing it and refinishing it, that's what I hope a custom build gets you anyway, main thing he loves the guitar.

By contrast I set up a £150 squire tele bullet and was genuinely shocked how good it was, change the electrics and you have a good gigging guitar, we small builders cannot compete with this, we're a different market and only the individual can justify if it's worth it, just do your homework and go by recommendations if possible and visit the workshop.

Not sure how he comes back from this tbh but he'll have to work twice as hard now and get to some shows if possible, this is not an easy fix, good luck to him.

If it's a change to the guitar after it's been built to spec, like the neck example you gave, I assume the customer has to pay extra for the modification?

No they did not and what I got asked was to build something vintage spec which I did, turns out he likes a modern neck with narrower string spacing.

A custom build is just that imo, I had the guy come in while I tweaked it, was just a bit to come off the shoulders, then he left and I finished it and gave it back.

FastEddie

The blog post shows just how much attention to detail and effort is put into a well made guitar. 
Makes me want to pay for craftsmanship. 

Danielsguitars

FastEddie said:

The blog post shows just how much attention to detail and effort is put into a well made guitar. 
Makes me want to pay for craftsmanship. 

 I don't even keep count how many hours I put in, I should do but it's done when it's done and I'm happy with it, I'm also a very slow builder.

TeleMaster

Switch625 said:

I want to see more content with this dog

The guitar or?

Very out of tune isn’t it. 

mendy

 

dindude

My builds take so long because all my tools are manual.

And blunt.

And from the cutlery draw.

horse

My builds take so long because I make my own tools. By hand

viclennard

IanElsonGuitar said:

I totally take responsibility for this fuck up and I gave a full and immediate refund. I shouldn't have tried to do it for the budget I was given and took my eye off the ball...after lockdown I couldn't afford not to take it on and it bit my arse big time. If I'm judged on this one cock-up rather than the 50 or so guitars that are out in the world then fair play but I did mess up and I admit it. Hopefully, people may take the time to check out all my others and see this was a one-off aberration. You are judged by your worst effort, not your best so I guess I just have to wear this one and hope it takes its place as the only one I'll ever fuck up. My bad. 

I have to respond to this.

"If I'm judged on this one cock-up rather than the 50 or so guitars that are out in the world then fair play"

One cock-up. 

1. There's my guitar. The admin of this website has seen the photos and is suitably horrified.
2. There's Ivan G's guitar. That was from the same batch. Same problems as mine. He paid for a local luthier to make it playable but in the end he gave up, scrapped the woodwork and kept the hardware.
3. There's the guitar Jim Croisdale has worked on and started this thread.
4. There's the winner of a competition Elson organised in April 2020, Tom K. Guitar has just been delivered after 13 months. In Tom's words: "Look at the neck joint - 2mm gap. His response was it didn't ship like that... 'Never had a guitar that's shifted like that in transit ever. Try screwing it in tighter,' when the screw is stripped and isn't budging anywhere. Action's high and there's no way of lowering any more. Sharp frets. Nut poorly fitted and glued. Oh and the varnish sanded off the neck too."
That's four so far, all with similar appalling luthiery. 

Even the guy who wires up the guitars warned Elson that there were problems with mine. He's incompetent - and then he lies and lies and lies...

@IanElsonGuitar - please feel free to respond. I have documented and photographic evidence of every claim I've made.

CoffeeAndTV

horse said:

My builds take so long because I make my own tools. By hand

My build takes even longer because I make my own hands first. By feet

mendy

 

skunkwerx

CoffeeAndTV said:

horse said:

My builds take so long because I make my own tools. By hand

My build takes even longer because I make my own hands first. By feet

Your builds must cost an arm and a leg!

Gassage

skunkwerx said:

CoffeeAndTV said:

horse said:

My builds take so long because I make my own tools. By hand

My build takes even longer because I make my own hands first. By feet

Your builds must cost an arm and a leg!

I don't like digital products.

photek

Don’t panic folks, just seen an advert on Facebook, Ian is building 2 Specials for £650 each! Better get in quickly it’s got 4 likes in 4 days!

poopot

CoffeeAndTV said:

horse said:

My builds take so long because I make my own tools. By hand

My build takes even longer because I make my own hands first. By feet

6months minimum for feet...

Sassafras

Switch625 said:

I want to see more content with this dog

He can always blame the dog for not letting him get on with his guitar building.

ToneControl

viz said:

Regarding the pricing, I really do think that is the seller’s choice and it’s not up to us to challenge his motivations or business model. There is not necessarily a hard link between price and cost, or price and quality. Maybe the seller is fabulously rich and is doing this charitably as a hobby, and happy to make a loss on each guitar. 

I do understand that undercuts professionals (which is fair game for discussion, of course) but we can’t really infer much from the pricing. 

true, some builders may just have very low overheads (i.e. none), and/or already have a pension or other job to pay the bills. I recently saw some UK hand-assembled, hand-finished guitars for £700-£800 made by someone in this position, based on ordered in UK-made CNC'd bodies and necks, with Lace sensor and other decent-brand pickups

Offset

Switch625 said:

I want to see more content with this dog

The dog appears to be pleading with him to stop playing.  Or making guitars.  Or possibly both.

Onpar

Danielsguitars said:

Onpar said:

Danielsguitars said:

It's people like this that give a proper custom builder a bad name and potentially put off anyone ever ordering anything again.

A custom flat top build is still more expensive to do than any mass made sub £1500 guitar.

I built a strat for someone and the whole lot works out about £1,000 in parts then add time and paying for a workshop etc, even at £2k no one is getting rich, I also had to customise the neck after it was finished to suit him a little better, it was only a small amount needed but still that's extra time doing it and refinishing it, that's what I hope a custom build gets you anyway, main thing he loves the guitar.

By contrast I set up a £150 squire tele bullet and was genuinely shocked how good it was, change the electrics and you have a good gigging guitar, we small builders cannot compete with this, we're a different market and only the individual can justify if it's worth it, just do your homework and go by recommendations if possible and visit the workshop.

Not sure how he comes back from this tbh but he'll have to work twice as hard now and get to some shows if possible, this is not an easy fix, good luck to him.

If it's a change to the guitar after it's been built to spec, like the neck example you gave, I assume the customer has to pay extra for the modification?

No they did not and what I got asked was to build something vintage spec which I did, turns out he likes a modern neck with narrower string spacing.

A custom build is just that imo, I had the guy come in while I tweaked it, was just a bit to come off the shoulders, then he left and I finished it and gave it back.

That is very honourable of you and great customer service. From a business perspective, you delivered what was originally requested so I believe it would have been perfectly reasonable to invoice for the additional work. 

I assume it's the Bradcaster you are referring to so its also good PR. That's a stunning looking and sounding guitar BTW. 

DefaultM

You sometimes get cheaper custom guitars like this coming up on the cash converters website and I give them a go. It's almost always the case that it looks good in photos, but up close not so much. There will be filler between pieces of wood that they couldn't get to line up, and the cavities and covers will be a bit wonky. I've not seen anything like this though haha.

octatonic

Some general thoughts about my own adventures in guitar building.

Building guitars well is pretty hard, especially without training.
I would never have been able to output anything as good as I have without that training.

Even with training it is pretty laborious and you need to have the right mindset to do it well, be happy with repetitive tasks.
The most important skill though is attention to detail.
I have ADHD which means I can hyper focus on things I am really motivated to do and get bored easily by things I am not motivated to do.
Fortunately for me, at that time, guitar building was something I was hugely motivated to do so I stayed on point.

In my 3 year degree we covered a lot of territory- manual/practical stuff like sharpening, how to use the tools safely and what tools to use for what job.

Just keeping blades sharp is like 25% of the work, if you are building by hand.

Then we built one guitar a year- the first year was a simple travel guitar (because half the year was spent learning how to sharpen).
Second year I made a parlour guitar.
Third year I made a 000 and wrote a dissertation.

Then there is the more advanced stuff which really only applies to acoustic guitars- about the acoustical properties of materials, how to alter stiffness with different approaches to thicknessing and bracing alteration, Young's modulus of materials and such.

As much as you try to distill it down a science there is still an art to it too.

My 000 was the best realised on a technical level but even still it isn't perfect.
Learning to cover your tracks, hide the rough bits is a big part of hand-making anything.
With guitars there isn't just the structural and aesthetic elements of the build- it also needs to be playable and have good tone.
I liken it to the difference between driving a car and flying a plane- the third axis is a real bugger and makes things more complex.