The Football Thread.

TheBigDipper

As a life-long Rs fan, I've known more downs than ups. They're still living with the consequences of breaching EFL Fair Play spending rules when Tony Fernandes was in charge.

In 2018, they negotiated a settlement with the EFL that means the club is paying a £17m fine (to charity) in ten annual instalments. It was originally set at £42m, but renegotiated down. The current board has no intention of breaching FFP rules again - and certainly (unlike the Fernandes era) not spending like crazy in the hope that they'll get back into the Premier League and avoid having to answer to the EFL for the breaking FFP rules to do so. You can spend your way to the PL and get away with it if you actually do get promoted - until you're relegated again and fall back under EFL jurisdiction. 

So QPR cannot afford to buy players at the moment unless they sell first. EFL clubs need to spend from their income and aren't allowed to overspend from unpaid directors loans or cash injections. Loftus Road holds 18,000 at best (IIRC), so gate receipts are not enough. There's little TV money for EFL clubs. Newly-relegated PL clubs have parachute payments (which are reduced compared to earlier years?) which they can use to pay PL wages and therefore maintain squad depth without breaching EFL FFP regs. 

The best hope QPR has of raising revenue for investment in players next year is if Crystal Palace sells Eze. When QPR sold him to Palace, there was a contract clause that gives QPR 20% of the fee if/when Palace sells him on. 

And that's one of the reasons why QPR has struggled this year - they've been living within their means since 2018, trying to sell out an inner city ground that is within a mile or two of Chelsea, Fulham and Brentford. The LB of Hammersmith and Fulham has a lot of football clubs in the borough! 

The other is that the board has made a couple of poor decisions in recent years regarding the first team coach. It's worth remembering that dear old Gareth Ainsworth was fired after a run of six losses on the trot put the club 8 points away from being out of the relegation zone. He had all the passion he needed for the club but no idea how to make the team work properly. Marti Cifuentes has done a fantastic job at getting the same players (pretty much) to work to his plan, and get themselves out of trouble. He did get two players in the January window, one has sort-of worked out, the other hasn't. 

TheBigDipper

guitars4you said:

Wazmeister said:

Very proud of my QPR today… truly thumped the mighty Leeds last night.

It wasn't just the score line it was a total inept performance by Leeds - Best Chair I've seen for years

Was it Leeds not performing or was it Rangers stopping them? I saw enough periods of the game where Leeds looked pretty dominant and impressive - with a couple of last minute tackles and saves keeping them out. So maybe the QPR game plan disrupted Leeds rather than Leeds sabotaged themselves? Curious as to what you think, because I haven't seen Leeds at all this year. 

guitars4you

TTony said:

guitars4you said:

TTony said:

Just a couple more games to lose, and Leeds can avoid relegation from the PL next season

Leicester have lost 10 games this season, including 2 of their last 4.  They need to sort that out, or they'll get hammered next season.

Ipswich have conceded 53 goals this season - they're going to need a new back 5 before next season or their goalie will be getting a bad back from all the bending down to pick the ball out of the net.

I don't see any really strong team likely to get promoted and survive next season.

That either tells us all we need to know what is wrong with the PL - And/or shows the arrogance of an elite club, in that 'we are big, strong and safe'

That wasn't written by "an elite club" - it was written by me!

EFL obviously clubs play more league games, but cup and European games add to games played for (some, not all!) PL teams.

I was not denigrating the level of play or difficulty of competition in the Championship, merely that this season's promotion contenders do not appear to have been clearly stronger than the rest of the teams in that Division.  Given the - generally accepted - gulf between EFL and PL levels, if a team isn't far and away better against Championship opposition, then they're likely going to struggle in the PL.

Burnley, last season, were much stronger in the Championship, but have obviously struggled this season.  Last season's  stats for Sheffield Utd and Luton look very similar to Ipswich/Leeds this season.  Hence the comment that whoever gets promoted will have a lot to sort out if they are to survive in the PL.

Disagree - Leeds, Ipswich and Leics have been far ahead of the others with maybe the exception of Soton, who came up on the rail for a while - Leics had a 17 point gap at one time to 3rd place - Ipswich something like 10 points to 3rd place - Goals scored for those 4 clubs is well ahead of anyone else and goal difference is nearly double in some cases of any other club between 4th and 10th - Goals against for Leeds and Leics is better than that of any PL club other than the top 3 - Currently Ipswich are 20 points clear of the bottom play off position - First time that a club with 90 plus points won't be promoted 

At the 17th March Leeds had won 12 and drawn one of their 13 Championship outings in 2024. Leeds' aggregate Championship score in 2024 is 28-3. – Farke's men have kept 10 clean sheets and conceded just three goals in their 13 league outings in 2024. And they haven't conceded a single Championship goal from open play this calendar year - Not bad for a mediocre team

 I think that any promoted team knows it has a challenge - Equally there are 10 clubs in the PL at the start of Aug, who know their only goal is survival - With a game to go, our stats for this season are pretty much identical to Bielsa's title winning promotion season , leaving Fulham and Brentford in 3rd and 4th - First season back in the PL and none of the top 6 elite PL clubs beat Leeds at ER - Not bad for a newly promoted mediocre club - I'm sure many would have had Bournemouth favourites to go back down - But they have showed great spirit with some great performances to sustain another year in the PL - With I believe the smallest support, facilities, set-u etc so great credit to them - A bench mark for others to follow - ditto Fulham, Brighton, Brentford 

Domestic cup games and nearly all PL clubs put out a B team - So little respect for the competition these days, hence the way Pep, chief executives and the PL brushed away the EFL, without consultation, to finish replays in the FA Cup  - As such the pampered stars have another day off work - Early stages of a European competition and many of those games are against the champions, or 2nd/3rd place clubs from Bulgaria, Sweden, Finland etc - Hence teams from a league level that is probably below that of the  EFL

We'll probably forget about this post in 10 years time - But look at the PL table today and I bet in 10 years time that 8/9/10 of the clubs currently between 20th and 10th will have had another spell in the EFL , as certain EFL promoted clubs initially put their foot in the door, and establish a platform, for at least a couple of seasons

guitars4you

TheBigDipper said:

guitars4you said:

Wazmeister said:

Very proud of my QPR today… truly thumped the mighty Leeds last night.

It wasn't just the score line it was a total inept performance by Leeds - Best Chair I've seen for years

Was it Leeds not performing or was it Rangers stopping them? I saw enough periods of the game where Leeds looked pretty dominant and impressive - with a couple of last minute tackles and saves keeping them out. So maybe the QPR game plan disrupted Leeds rather than Leeds sabotaged themselves? Curious as to what you think, because I haven't seen Leeds at all this year. 

Probably a mix of both and questions we are asking as well - From the off you asked questions and we never recovered - We've had similar performances for 3-5 games now (since the international break) - Have we been sussed as to how we like to play or are we a bit tired - Plus I think the 2nd youngest team in the league behind Sunderland, so maybe need an older head pulling the strings  

I think Chair was excellent and would certainly have helped us - You dominated midfield and as such controlled large parts of the game - What annoyed me at 1/2 time, when we were 2-0 down, coupled with a poor performance that Farke did nothing - That tells me that either he was happy as it stood, was relying on hope to change something, or had no idea of how to change it - Around the 60 min mark he change from two genuine midfield players to one - Smart move when 2 players already struggled to boss the game

A credit to QPR as they deserved it - My question to you and indeed Blackburn who beat us 2 games ago - Why are you down there - You look far better than that - Part of me thinks that you also raise your game for a visit from the likes of Leeds (did I hear them say it was the seasons best crowd for you) - Chair certainly looks promising and if it wasn't a one off performance last night from him, then I'd have him to play in a #10 role - You fully deserved the win and the score line

TTony

[edit] Actually, I'm really not that bothered and the lawn needs mowing!

guitars4you

TTony said:

[edit] Actually, I'm really not that bothered and the lawn needs mowing!

I think we both know that there are many aspects of running a team and so many variables within such an organisation - Take Spurs - New season, sell the big star and bring in a new manager and it is a breath of fresh air for all - The style of play - It might not be the be all and end all every game but it sure looks to me as a better option than in previous seasons when a few big 'hot shots' were in charge - Spirit means so much and that is what Bielsa initially brought to Leeds using by and large the same players as his predecessor

But do you buy and adopt a spend spend spend policy - Or recruit as per Brentford and Brighton  - Do you develop a youth program but then the class of 92 might be a one off event - To be fair Man U do keep finding some good youngsters - Think Leeds currently have the 2nd youngest EFL team something like ave age of 23 and have just reached the U18 final v Man City so some strength in that area - But how often do you find another James Milner 

Maybe the big American owners favour a franchise system as per the NFL, NBA etc - But maybe it is already here, as you suggest, but in a different guise in that promotion from the EFL is quickly followed by relegation as they can't compete - Is that good  - I'm not asking if it is fair as business isn't 

TheBigDipper

guitars4you said:

TheBigDipper said:

guitars4you said:

Wazmeister said:

Very proud of my QPR today… truly thumped the mighty Leeds last night.

It wasn't just the score line it was a total inept performance by Leeds - Best Chair I've seen for years

Was it Leeds not performing or was it Rangers stopping them? I saw enough periods of the game where Leeds looked pretty dominant and impressive - with a couple of last minute tackles and saves keeping them out. So maybe the QPR game plan disrupted Leeds rather than Leeds sabotaged themselves? Curious as to what you think, because I haven't seen Leeds at all this year. 

Probably a mix of both and questions we are asking as well - From the off you asked questions and we never recovered - We've had similar performances for 3-5 games now (since the international break) - Have we been sussed as to how we like to play or are we a bit tired - Plus I think the 2nd youngest team in the league behind Sunderland, so maybe need an older head pulling the strings  

I think Chair was excellent and would certainly have helped us - You dominated midfield and as such controlled large parts of the game - What annoyed me at 1/2 time, when we were 2-0 down, coupled with a poor performance that Farke did nothing - That tells me that either he was happy as it stood, was relying on hope to change something, or had no idea of how to change it - Around the 60 min mark he change from two genuine midfield players to one - Smart move when 2 players already struggled to boss the game

A credit to QPR as they deserved it - My question to you and indeed Blackburn who beat us 2 games ago - Why are you down there - You look far better than that - Part of me thinks that you also raise your game for a visit from the likes of Leeds (did I hear them say it was the seasons best crowd for you) - Chair certainly looks promising and if it wasn't a one off performance last night from him, then I'd have him to play in a #10 role - You fully deserved the win and the score line

Chair is a good player and important to the current team setup. That was typical of him on a good day. There are bad days, too, where his body turns up but his brain does not, so his work has no end product, despite lots of effort.  He might not be available for selection soon, as he was recently convicted of assault (in Antwerp) and sentenced to 12 months in prison. He's appealing. He was born in Belgium - even though people keep on calling him Moroccan because he plays for Morocco. 

Loftus Road has been sold out a few times this season (for home fans) but this might have been the first match where all the away supporters tickets were sold.

I don't believe the team ever raises its game because of who the opposition is. I do think they might have been motivated by the fact they needed at least one more point last night to keep control of their own destiny and some players want new clubs with better prospects. 

Why were we in trouble this year? Several years of no money available to invest in better players because previous boards fell foul of FFP regs, the club has only recently returned to a policy of growing your own (in the Fernandes years they bought useless-yet-expensive older players) and poor decisions when appointing first team coaches. Mark Hughes and Harry Redknapp were not good managers for the club in the longer term. Gareth Ainsworth couldn't communicate a credible plan to the team this year, so even headless chickens looked more organised than us earlier in the season. We were in free fall. No longer, it seems, which is nice. Now the coaching team will need to work out what to do when some of this team gets sold before next season starts (as they inevitably will) and how to fill the gaps. 

thecolourbox

thecolourbox said:

So the annual West Brom bottle job seems to have begun - two 2-2 draws in a week against lower half teams, we've got already-relegated Rotherham who are 19 points behind the team one place above them, so I imagine they'll play a blinder and beat us as well haha

We've got 6 points on 7th place and 5 games to play (although Coventry in 7th have 6 games remaining...). Hmmm

This unfortunately has come to pass - losing 3-0 to Sheffield., Hull right on our tails now with a game in hand. Either our players are inherently "loser" mentality or they've just realised there's no point getting promoted as they'll be out of the club either way

TTony

thecolourbox said:

Hull right on our tails now with a game in hand

Hull v Ipswich up later.  That could be quite a decisive game.

guitars4you

TTony said:

thecolourbox said:

Hull right on our tails now with a game in hand

Hull v Ipswich up later.  That could be quite a decisive game.

I’ve got to go for my Yorkshire colleagues on this one - Then the Sky Blues in midweek- Just to keep some hope alive - Otherwise wise we’ll probably be playing West Brom

thecolourbox

guitars4you said:

TTony said:

thecolourbox said:

Hull right on our tails now with a game in hand

Hull v Ipswich up later.  That could be quite a decisive game.

I’ve got to go for my Yorkshire colleagues on this one - Then the Sky Blues in midweek- Just to keep some hope alive - Otherwise wise we’ll probably be playing West Brom

I think we would probably be the ideal opposition in playoffs for you guys surely? No momentum and also you lot always beat us

guitars4you

thecolourbox said:

guitars4you said:

TTony said:

thecolourbox said:

Hull right on our tails now with a game in hand

Hull v Ipswich up later.  That could be quite a decisive game.

I’ve got to go for my Yorkshire colleagues on this one - Then the Sky Blues in midweek- Just to keep some hope alive - Otherwise wise we’ll probably be playing West Brom

I think we would probably be the ideal opposition in playoffs for you guys surely? No momentum and also you lot always beat us

And this season you took 4 points from us - And who can forget Ray Tinkler (not that that is WBA’s fault)

guitars4you

Who saw the West Ham v LFC - Why didn’t Gakpo just kick the ball in the net  - You’ll know what I mean if you saw it

Plus what is the Salah and Klopp row about 

thecolourbox

guitars4you said:

thecolourbox said:

guitars4you said:

TTony said:

thecolourbox said:

Hull right on our tails now with a game in hand

Hull v Ipswich up later.  That could be quite a decisive game.

I’ve got to go for my Yorkshire colleagues on this one - Then the Sky Blues in midweek- Just to keep some hope alive - Otherwise wise we’ll probably be playing West Brom

I think we would probably be the ideal opposition in playoffs for you guys surely? No momentum and also you lot always beat us

And this season you took 4 points from us - And who can forget Ray Tinkler (not that that is WBA’s fault)

We seem to have forgotten how to bore teams to death in order to win though, so I don't think you'd have any problems against us 

guitars4you

Well it probably won’t be in our control by then but it will go down to the last game of the season regardless 

Come on Coventry 

tony99

guitars4you said:

Who saw the West Ham v LFC - Why didn’t Gakpo just kick the ball in the net  - You’ll know what I mean if you saw it

Plus what is the Salah and Klopp row about 

Think Salah probably finally realised that Klopp's a bellend.

Philly_Q

tony99 said:

guitars4you said:

Who saw the West Ham v LFC - Why didn’t Gakpo just kick the ball in the net  - You’ll know what I mean if you saw it

Plus what is the Salah and Klopp row about 

Think Salah probably finally realised that Klopp's a bellend.

I think there might have been a bit of mutual bellendery.

tony99

https://twitter.com/i/status/1784233141827244226

Lestratcaster

Very rare we have a full-strength team to choose from, and its come at a good time today! Come on you Arsenal!

guitars4you

Come on Arsenal - Not because I don't like Spurs - I don't dislike City but it is not good if they keep on winning the PL - So a change is as good as a rest - So don't worry, I'll be cheering on Spurs when they play City in a couple of weeks time

Would love to see a great game today - 5/6 goal thriller and show us why the PL is so good 

Cherries fans - Are my old mates still injured again ? - waste of space and funds IMO - talented at times yes, but crap attitude - Adams and Sinisterra