Rich Tone Music

KevS

It is good we have this forum..I have considered buying secondhand from here a few times..They seem to have a better choice than most......I am sorry this happened to you...And yes they should pay the return postage...They have probably lost one potential customer here...Plus potentially others..

imalrightjack

lustycourtier said:

StefB said:

RobG3294 said:

Shocking way to lose a customer who's probably spent in excess of 10k with them over £20.

Perhaps they are trying to recoup some of the loss they made on that hideous Supreme Strat they took in a few months ago.

Originally listed at £4,499 it is now down to £3,299 and still about £3k more than I'd pay for it - https://richtonemusic.co.uk/fender-ltd-ed-supreme-stratocaster-white-case-2nd-hand/

to be fair, that will sell. Last couple on reverb sold over 4k, but no clue why or what the point of it is.. 

 Supreme clothing is even more insanely priced 

Glad you commented. I had no idea what Supreme meant! What a monstrosity. 

Nerine

Some of the clothing isn’t expensive at all. I think it’s just very limited edition and it changes hands for silly money on the used market due to scarcity etc. 

fretfinder

It’s easy being wise after the event but perhaps it would’ve been worth having the conversation with them before you sent the guitar back. It’s an opportunity to explain the problem and ask them to collect it for a refund, and if they say no, insist on speaking to a manager until you get someone sensible enough to make the right decision. It’s what I had to do with Guitar Guitar a while ago when I bought a used guitar from them that was not as described. 

Offset

Do distance-welling regs cover return postage/courier costs?

borntohang

I'll say I've always had positive dealings with Richtone, online or in person, but that does seem a bit petty for them to argue over £20. Good news is you're only really one step away from dealing with the head guy, so I'd try ringing up and causing a bit of fuss. I was actually in the store today and the guy on the phone was bending over backwards to sort a return issue out, so maybe hope you get him!

borntohang

Offset said:

Do distance-welling regs cover return postage/courier costs?

Only if returned as faulty. Sellers also only have to refund basic postage costs, so if you paid for NDD you wouldn't get the extra back.

BillDL

Unless a retailer is convinced by your "proof" (eg. photos) in your return request that an item is faulty, damaged (other than as mentioned in a description), not fit for purpose, or was mis-described, then it is quite normal for them to either ask you to return it yourself and pay for the return shipping that they will reimburse along with a refund OR they will arrange it and bear the shipping costs, but only if they agree with your proof.  If they have arranged the collection and paid for it, and if they disagree with your proof, then they can and will deduct the shipping costs from your refund.  The problem has always been that once the retailer has your goods back with them you no longer have the physical proof to argue your point and you would have to rely on photos you took before returning it, or they can allege damage incurred in return transit.

On the GuitarGuitar website they grade the condition of the neck and body separately on a 1 to 5 scale, although they will never use a 5 even for a truly pristine guitar.  A 3 for the neck means that the frets are showing some wear that will need to be addressed in the future, but that it is playing well and intonating up and down the board for the time being.  I have never seen a 2, which I presume would say something like "frets are deeply worn and will need to be attended to imminently", or similar wording.  In the case of the Richtone guitar the description should have between a 2 and a 3, but Richtone's "condition report" is limited to one word that in this case would appear to have been "good".  It is not.  At best the condition is "fair" verging on "poor", whether or not it currently plays OK.

DrJazzTap

I've sold guitars to richtone, never had an issue. I do think they should grade the fret and neck like guitarguitar.co.uk do. That may help, although open to interpretation. What constitutes a 4 over a 3 etc?

Gandalph

£20 isn't just £20 when if's not as described. They should refund you, I'd chase it up. 

Been in once to look at an Eric Clapton that was rough as arse holes. Description said very good. Always been non plussed by the sheer lack of effort they put into their descriptions for second hand gear. 

Schnozz

Yeah I think they've been picked up a few times for not describing accurately. 

normula1

They're my local store and I used to visit and purchase regularly, but since a poor experience visits have been quite rare. Last time I went in I had a "discussion" about their description of a guitar I was really interested in and the guy insisted he was correct .. he wasn't and I passed on it.

chris78

Gilly said:

chris78 said:

Simples - it's £20. Get over it, move on, don't buy from them again. 

I’m sure you’d feel differently if it was you getting ripped off.

Let’s get it into context here- nobody is being ripped off. 

The guitar has been returned and they’ve refunded the OP.
The argument here is about the postage return costs. My view is that Richtone not covering this isn’t great, so as a buyer, I wouldn’t use them again. I wouldn’t get het up over £20 which doesn’t buy a round at a pub. 

However, I also get it from a store’s point of view- plenty of people buy stuff online and return it without good reason and the store are then out of pocket for the original shipping cost.

My business goes to the great stores who look after customers- Coda are top of that list, I wouldn’t hesitate to use Peach or Mark at guitars4you. I’ve had a poor return experience with guitarguitar so I’d be unlikely to buy from them.

Gilly

chris78 said:

Gilly said:

chris78 said:

Simples - it's £20. Get over it, move on, don't buy from them again. 

I’m sure you’d feel differently if it was you getting ripped off.

Let’s get it into context here- nobody is being ripped off. 

The guitar has been returned and they’ve refunded the OP.
The argument here is about the postage return costs. My view is that Richtone not covering this isn’t great, so as a buyer, I wouldn’t use them again. I wouldn’t get het up over £20 which doesn’t buy a round at a pub. 

My business goes to the great stores who look after customers- Coda are top of that list, I wouldn’t hesitate to use Peach or Mark at guitars4you. I’ve had a poor return experience with guitarguitar so I’d be unlikely to buy from them.

Yes he is. He’s being ripped off £20. Regardless of whether it buys a round or not it’s the principle - why let them get away with such poor service? Not only is he losing £20, he’s had the hassle (and risk) of having to return the guitar. All because Richtone can’t, or rather won’t, describe their items properly.

chris78

Gilly said:

Yes he is. He’s being ripped off £20. Regardless of whether it buys a round or not it’s the principle - why let them get away with such poor service? Not only is he losing £20, he’s had the hassle (and risk) of having to return the guitar. All because Richtone can’t, or rather won’t, describe their items properly.

With respect to the OP, he bought the item from Richtone knowing they describe very little about their guitars - their listings all say "give us a call to discuss". Personally, I wouldn't buy a used guitar from them because they can't be bothered to tell me about it. Andertons are the same on used gear. Compare that to Coda/Peach/Guitars4you who offer a detailed breakdown about the guitar, individual and detailed studio photos.

Due to the lack of description, the buyer hasn't done his due diligence on the guitar. I realise thats a tough lesson to learn, but my guess is that Richtone deliberately offer next to no info for this exact reason. 

Dumodal

Jonathangus said:

What I dislike about Richer Sounds is their total lack of guitar gear.


  

Hahaha my bad, Brain fart! 

Cols

chris78 said:

Gilly said:

chris78 said:

Simples - it's £20. Get over it, move on, don't buy from them again. 

I’m sure you’d feel differently if it was you getting ripped off.

Let’s get it into context here- nobody is being ripped off. 

The guitar has been returned and they’ve refunded the OP.
The argument here is about the postage return costs. My view is that Richtone not covering this isn’t great, so as a buyer, I wouldn’t use them again. I wouldn’t get het up over £20 which doesn’t buy a round at a pub. 

However, I also get it from a store’s point of view- plenty of people buy stuff online and return it without good reason and the store are then out of pocket for the original shipping cost.

My business goes to the great stores who look after customers- Coda are top of that list, I wouldn’t hesitate to use Peach or Mark at guitars4you. I’ve had a poor return experience with guitarguitar so I’d be unlikely to buy from them.

To be fair, the frets do indeed look like chewing gum wrappers.  I wouldn’t be happy with that either.

But that aside, £20 isn’t too far off what I would pay to travel to the nearest guitar shop and try something in person.  Not to mention my travel time.

So I’d be annoyed as well, but not any more so then if I’d driven out to check out a piece of kit only to find out it was a dud.

RaptorCheeses

I'll admit my heart sank when I saw the thread title. It sank a fair bit more when I saw the words '2010 Fender Strat Deluxe'. Rob, are you talking about this one? https://richtonemusic.co.uk/fender-american-deluxe-strat-sunset-metallic-kinman-pickups-case-2nd-hand/

If so, then I bought this off their website last friday (19th), it turned up on sunday, and I've just spent the last few days assuming they'd send the frets in a separate parcel at some point.

Sad thing is, before buying, I messaged them on ebay to ask what the fret wear was like as this is a 14 year old guitar and I assumed there would be quite a bit, their reply was, "Thanks for your enquiry. There is very little fret wear on this guitar, it is 14 years old but has probably had very little use or has been played by someone with a light touch."

Screencap here: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1WPnRHvnG1LFu7UWcFH8NkWuJNsaN2hQg/view?usp=sharing

Just out of interest, did you contact richtone and tell them about how shite the frets were before sending it back? If so, do you remember what date you did this on? I asked them about the fret wear on the 19th.

Gilly

chris78 said:

Gilly said:

Yes he is. He’s being ripped off £20. Regardless of whether it buys a round or not it’s the principle - why let them get away with such poor service? Not only is he losing £20, he’s had the hassle (and risk) of having to return the guitar. All because Richtone can’t, or rather won’t, describe their items properly.

With respect to the OP, he bought the item from Richtone knowing they describe very little about their guitars - their listings all say "give us a call to discuss". Personally, I wouldn't buy a used guitar from them because they can't be bothered to tell me about it. Andertons are the same on used gear. Compare that to Coda/Peach/Guitars4you who offer a detailed breakdown about the guitar, individual and detailed studio photos.

Due to the lack of description, the buyer hasn't done his due diligence on the guitar. I realise thats a tough lesson to learn, but my guess is that Richtone deliberately offer next to no info for this exact reason. 

Again I disagree. The guitar was listed as in “good” condition. So the OP could reasonably expect the frets to be in good condition, which if they’re excessively worn they clearly are not. So he’s done absolutely nothing wrong and Richtone are bang out of order. 

RobG3294

Well I've had about fifty percent tell me to build a bridge and stuck it up, and the other half telling me to chase it up (which without sounding like I respect one side more than the other, thanks everyone for their input), I'm inclined to do.

They simply cannot claim that "well you should ring us beforehand" is a coverall against online distance selling regulations and/or best practice and duty of care. The onus is on them to describe things properly - and because they're too lazy too either a) do this or b) correctly appraise their stock when they take it in, they open themselves up to this situation in my personal opinion. 

Of course it's passed off as fussy customers, but what realistically am I supposed to do with frets like those? 

I did indeed send them an email articulating the issue prior to return and they never mentioned not refunding me wholly - "they just said no problem to return" (verbatim). 

If they 'deemed it fit for resale' I genuinely worry about the standard of employee/techs they have working for them.

I'm not going to go without bread and water because of the 20 notes, but why should I (or anyone else in the situation) be out of pocket for a single penny and also have to foot the risk of return transit (which was fine in this case) because of their apathetic approach to selling stuff.