Line 6 Helix

zenzeypher

...or to create demand.

I recently had a tinker on Sweepy's - I was very impressed.

siremoon

It's obvious that they under estimated the demand but I suspect the problem is that ramping up production is not straight forward.  You can't just turn on the tap  It seems improbable to me that Line 6 has its own factories and so they will place contracts with electronic manufacturing companies.  Those contracts will result in the reserving of one or more manufacturing slots over a given period and the batch sizes to be manufactured in each slot.  The contracts will no doubt reflect what Line 6 expected the demand to be and will probably be conservative. 

Getting more slots at short-ish notice and/or producing bigger batch sizes will only be possible if the factories concerned have spare capacity or can adjust delivery timescales and/or batch sizes for other contracts without incurring penalties.  I think what we're seeing suggests this hasn't been possible.  My guess is that Line 6 have booked more slots and/or larger batch sizes for contracts in H1 2016 which would be consistent with more stock becoming available around Q2 2016.

Frustrating for those of us that can't get one but sort of understandable imo

guitargeek62

^ wis'd.

handsomerik

It's an interesting theory but it is only a theory. It would be nice if line 6 would issue a statement explaining exactly what the situation is so people can make realistic plans as to when to expect the item to be available. If I know it's a 3 month wait from now it's easy to plan ahead. When you're told it's a 3 week wait and each time it keeps getting pushed back another month it's pretty unhelpful. I don't remember them ever having any such issues with other releases, most of which have also been popular and in much demand. Makes me wonder if the issue lies with the fact that they are now owned by Yamaha.

siremoon

It's not really a theory it's the way that modern production is for companies that contract out their manufacturing. 

I don't think it's anything to do with being owned by Yamaha.  I think it's simply that they can't make enough to meet the demand and there is not much they can do to increase production in the short term.  I have no doubt that they are trying to increase production but I doubt that the factory had people and machines on stand by just in case Line 6 wanted more in a hurry.

I don't have a pre-order but I'm assuming it will be 3 - 6 months before I get one.  If it turns out to be 3-6 weeks then I will treat that as a bonus.

handsomerik

Yeah I'm not holding my breath. The helix looks amazing and the solution to all of my needs guitar wise so I'm trying to just be patient and hope for the best. Everyone who owns one says it's worth the wait.

siremoon

Also, I too wish they'd tell us but they won't because it's not in their interests to imo.  If they say nothing most people with pre-orders will hang on for however long it takes, many will complain and chunter about it but that is all.  A few will cancel, most won't.  If they turn round and say "it'll be June", then I think more will think they can't wait that long and buy something else.

I've not been into guitars etc that long having started late in life but in the time I have I can't say that I've seen the level of clamour for a bit of gear as there has been for this.  To hear some of the desperation from people on other fora to get hold of this thing you could be forgiven for thinking that Line 6 had discovered the secret of eternal life.   

handsomerik

Can't argue with that!

digitalscream

The delays are probably a good thing for me - I'm still waiting for them to release a version of the firmware which allows delay/reverb spillover. Once that's out, I'm all-in especially given that my pedalboard crapped out on me at our EP launch last night, with what turned out to be a dodgy coupling between the power supply and the daisy chain and practically ruined my performance (I don't concentrate well on two things at once).

Heartfeltdawn

siremoon said:

Also, I too wish they'd tell us but they won't because it's not in their interests to imo.  If they say nothing most people with pre-orders will hang on for however long it takes, many will complain and chunter about it but that is all.  A few will cancel, most won't.  If they turn round and say "it'll be June", then I think more will think they can't wait that long and buy something else.

I've not been into guitars etc that long having started late in life but in the time I have I can't say that I've seen the level of clamour for a bit of gear as there has been for this.  To hear some of the desperation from people on other fora to get hold of this thing you could be forgiven for thinking that Line 6 had discovered the secret of eternal life.   

I think most folk would be more interested if Line 6 had discovered the secret of 'non-crapping out footswitches'. 

guitargeek62

^ mine haven't so far, so maybe they have?

handsomerik

These are not the same terrible foot switches that the m series pedals had. They were truly terrible and the reason I sold my m9.

Wazmeister

I think that the frustration here could be the nature of the Helix itself. 

Many of us think that this could be the start of a new direction pedal wise; older wiring hassles and problems are removed by a new 'black box' invention.

Yet underneath, we remain cynical and doubtful. We so want this 'new dawn' but maybe think it can't happen...

And then, they are delays and Line 6 silence. It just doesn't help build confidence - whatever the reason for the delay is.

Some guys have even sold / are selling their beloved pedal in preparation for the Helix.

I myself, like many, are waiting to see if the 'new dawn' can be realised.

It may prove to be a long wait

impmann

From what I have gleaned from talking to horses mouths that had been loosened by a touch of alcohol... The new European distribution model is causing some of the issues - Yamaha EU *buy* stock from Line6 US to sell onto stores. This supply chain is dependant on forecasts and put simply, the demand has been greater than expected - and what has been forecasted. Therefore more need to be built which takes time because the contract manufacturers that build these need to schedule the next run - and they're building stuff for all manner of other manufacturers, so that takes time. Then shipping from the other side of the world... and then shipping to Yamaha and then onto the stores etc.


From what I've heard EVERYONE is frustrated. Line6, Yamaha, the stores and customers. Believe me, EVERYONE wants them to be available as there is a lot of money at stake.

It will resolve - Ive been talking to people about as high up the company as you can get and they ARE doing everything possible. They will be available. That mail from Yamaha is just frustration - don't read too much into it. :-)

BintyTwanger77

I might get one of these when I grow up.

Digital_Igloo

Basically, the run rate of Helix manufacturing isn't based on how many people Line 6 believed would buy Helix; it was based on initial dealer orders (all taken before the big market launch this past June).

So if we're convinced people will buy 6, but dealers only order 3, we might build 4 just to be safe.

Then when 10 preorders come in months before the thing even ships... (!!!)

FWIU, we haven't stopped building Helices since June. The trick is that these are sophisticated, expensive boxes with tight tolerances and a pretty elaborate test procedure, so we're not able to crank them out like MIDI Mobilizers. We'll get to everyone as soon as we can, but we're not willing to skimp on manufacturing procedures or testing to speed things up. If there's an upside, it's that Helix will continue to get new features and models, so by the time yours comes in, it'll be even better.

Okay, so that's a total cop out. Sorry.

handsomerik

Thanks. We appreciate any updates and info you offer. Though the wait is disappointing for us with preorders it's good to know that you're not cutting corners with quality to churn them out quicker.

rossyamaha

Yeah, what Igloo said innit! ;-)

impmann

Having shared a stage with one last month.. It's worth the wait, guys.
It *is* the best sounding box Line6 have made...

sweepy

It is by far, it's going to be the the hot ticket for 2016, when supply catches up with demand