24hrs later, It strikes me that ...

capo4th

chillidoggy said:

capo4th said:

The leave voters have voted leave based on half a dozen popular sound bites which will never actually happen eg stop immigration, stop the £350million weekly direct debit to Europe, screw the bankers....

Delusional people who believed everything that Farage and Boris and The Daily Mail said.

Yet another Remain voter suggesting that anyone who didn't agree with him must be delusional, I can only conclude that this particular record is well and truly stuck.

I voted out, and I can assure you I knew exactly what I was doing when I voted. And I am not delusional, racist, or any other name that Remain voters wish to call me.

at no point did I mention you were racist please keep it on topic and accurate maybe you are racist I don't know and am not really interested in your delusional opinions.

capo4th

I also agree we need to control the level of immigration into the UK

camf

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capo4th

chrispy108 said:

quarky said:

It is pretty disgraceful how the remain camp are talking the country down.

The way some people talk you'd think we were living in caves without fire before the EU started.

Why give the EU credit for everything good in the country and your life?

Things will get a lot worse for large numbers of leave voters in the coming months. I have many ties to northern working class families who voted to leave and understand some of their motivations. 

It is gonna hit lots of people in the pocket in the coming months. 

Lets see how people feel next week after filling the car up a few times for example.

No credit given to the EU btw

Mkjackary

Not going to read 10 pages of the same old shit we all know.

Our economy is taking a hit short term but no proof whatsoever that the economy is going to take a hit long term.

The EU is going in a completely different direction to the UK, eventually we will have to leave or join them, being half arsed isn't going to last for much more, if it does it won't be in either of our interests.

So eventually, as EU gains more power and the argument for 'brexit' gets stronger and stronger we will leave.

So why put us through another two periods of economic uncertainty, just to get the same result, but with a much worse outcome for our economy. The re-referendum to not leave, and another one in 5-20 years.

No matter what everyone's opinion was before the result, now we have made up our mind, and the economic shock has set in and has started to return to okay levels, going back now would royaly fuck our economy beyond repair, the world would see us as indecisive and know that they shouldn't invest in us because in 5 years we will change our mind again.

In is in, out is out.

Can't we just leave this now, it is already getting old

octatonic

Mkjackary said:

Not going to read 10 pages of the same old shit we all know.

Our economy is taking a hit short term but no proof whatsoever that the economy is going to take a hit long term.

The EU is going in a completely different direction to the UK, eventually we will have to leave or join them, being half arsed isn't going to last for much more, if it does it won't be in either of our interests.

So eventually, as EU gains more power and the argument for 'brexit' gets stronger and stronger we will leave.

So why put us through another two periods of economic uncertainty, just to get the same result, but with a much worse outcome for our economy. The re-referendum to not leave, and another one in 5-20 years.

No matter what everyone's opinion was before the result, now we have made up our mind, and the economic shock has set in and has started to return to okay levels, going back now would royaly fuck our economy beyond repair, the world would see us as indecisive and know that they shouldn't invest in us because in 5 years we will change our mind again.

In is in, out is out.

Can't we just leave this now, it is already getting old

Reading threads is optional, you know.

And it isn't the same thing over and over.

We comment on developments as they... er... develop.

ewal

Exactly my point re the break up of the UK - can't we not just get it over with at the same time rather than have another bout of political and economic uncertainty a few years down the line. Just as England appears to be out of step with the EU, Scotland is out of step with England. Let's just get it all sorted out once and for all. However I don't think that will happen - compromises will be made in order to save both unions.

octatonic

ewal said:

Exactly my point re the break up of the UK - can't we not just get it over with at the same time rather than have another bout of political and economic uncertainty a few years down the line. Just as England appears to be out of step with the EU, Scotland is out of step with England. Let's just get it all sorted out once and for all. However I don't think that will happen - compromises will be made in order to save both unions.

People seem to not be in much of a mood for compromise.

People are going to be looking to protect their own interests more than ever.

Brexit has awoken my inner selfish bastard.

I'm a fairly easy going guy, for the most part, but my attitude has hardened sharply over the last few days and I'm going to be much more cost conscious about things given the imminent economic downturn.

capo4th

My sons new mountain bike might have to go the back burner.....

ewal

I'm hopelessly in debt already so it won't make much difference to me.

Sambostar

I've never seen so many young British homeless boys and girls on the streets willing to take food.

I've never believed in poaching educated and skilled people because you're country feels it's above them to train and educate them themselves.  I can't see it does mucyh good for the poorer countries of Europe.  Well all I can say is that in Romania, they must pull their own teeth, because all their dentists are here.

I always thought it was fairer and more sustainable to help build countries up from themselves, rather than have everyone here to serve the greed ridden for a lowest denominator.

I always agreed with international medical research partnerships, I don't see why we ever needed the EU for those.  It's something that domestic government's should cater for.  It's just common decency.

Mkjackary

octatonic said:

Mkjackary said:

Not going to read 10 pages of the same old shit we all know.

Our economy is taking a hit short term but no proof whatsoever that the economy is going to take a hit long term.

The EU is going in a completely different direction to the UK, eventually we will have to leave or join them, being half arsed isn't going to last for much more, if it does it won't be in either of our interests.

So eventually, as EU gains more power and the argument for 'brexit' gets stronger and stronger we will leave.

So why put us through another two periods of economic uncertainty, just to get the same result, but with a much worse outcome for our economy. The re-referendum to not leave, and another one in 5-20 years.

No matter what everyone's opinion was before the result, now we have made up our mind, and the economic shock has set in and has started to return to okay levels, going back now would royaly fuck our economy beyond repair, the world would see us as indecisive and know that they shouldn't invest in us because in 5 years we will change our mind again.

In is in, out is out.

Can't we just leave this now, it is already getting old

Reading threads is optional, you know.

And it isn't the same thing over and over.

We comment on developments as they... er... develop.

Yes I know it is optional, hence why I didn't do it.

I get that, but it seems that most of the stuff said now is just what everyone else has said chopped up and re ordered with some new metaphors.

There are some new developments and some great comments on it, but they are hidden amongst everything else.

I like reading people's views, particularly ones I haven't seen before/views about new developments. 

We need a highlights thread or something, 

plus it doesn't help that each new development gets 5 new threads, and is also brought up in each other brexit thread, bloody confusing.

Clarky

something occurred to me today [I may be wrong in this - and hope I am actually] which amazed me..

whilst a great many out voters did so with the opinion that this was the right thing to do for various reasons [which is fair enough]..

I've seen folks on various tv programmes over the last few days saying that they didn't vote out because of economics or immigration etc.. that it was more of a protest vote to Brussels and London than anything else..

so it seems that it's quite possible that if a sizeable enough number of people voted out just to stick it to Cameron, the Tories, the EU top nobs etc.. essentially sticking it to the man.. they could have tipped the balance..

what amazed me about this is that when they read the question on the ballot card and the options for leave or remain, they read leave as equating to 'screw London and Brussels'.. which seems just totally mental..

and the outcome of these few million people that potentially tipped the balance has been to wipe billions off the global markets, throw the major parties into chaos, cause all kinds of agro in Europe etc etc.. and many other effects being felt globally..

if this is actually true, it seems kinda nuts to me.. and they really did stick it to the man..

capo4th

Older people who hark back to their rosy past and don't realise the global world has moved on and plenty of morons with nothing to lose.

p90fool

quarky;1127775" said:

I am trying to understand how you think the EU turns £1,000 into £9,000?

Thomann shares?

p90fool

chrispy108;1129053" said:

quarky said:

It is pretty disgraceful how the remain camp are talking the country down.










The way some people talk you'd think we were living in caves without fire before the EU started.

Why give the EU credit for everything good in the country and your life?

A girl in work said the other day "Europe was fine before the EU"

Er, no love, it was actually on fire.

chillidoggy

capo4th said:

chillidoggy said:

capo4th said:

The leave voters have voted leave based on half a dozen popular sound bites which will never actually happen eg stop immigration, stop the £350million weekly direct debit to Europe, screw the bankers....

Delusional people who believed everything that Farage and Boris and The Daily Mail said.

Yet another Remain voter suggesting that anyone who didn't agree with him must be delusional, I can only conclude that this particular record is well and truly stuck.

I voted out, and I can assure you I knew exactly what I was doing when I voted. And I am not delusional, racist, or any other name that Remain voters wish to call me.

at no point did I mention you were racist please keep it on topic and accurate maybe you are racist I don't know and am not really interested in your delusional opinions.

 Yup, definitely stuck!

Emp_Fab

siremoon said:

The whole exercise was badly conceived and executed from start to finish.  Cameron and his inner circle are wholly responsible for the outcome imo.

Cameron entered negotiations with no understanding of the mandate he had and the feeling in the country at large.  No excuse and a damning indictment of the Westminster bubble.

He believed he had no leverage, as did the EU establishment and the deal he got reflected that.  No excuse.  Lack of preparation, research, understanding and unbelievable given the seriousness of the issue.

He called the referendum far too quickly because he believed there was no appetite to leave.  No excuse. See above.

He assumed Labour would get their vote out, and they would support remain. Totally failed to understand the mood and splits in the Labour party and Corbyn's less than inspiring leadership style.  Stupid and no excuse.

He failed to have a clear understanding of which side major Tory players would support.  Most notably Boris.  No excuse.

He allowed the Remain campaign to develop into a torrent of threats rather than clearly setting out the positive benefits of the EU in a way "ordinary" people could understand.  Second biggest mistake of all probably and no excuse.

He failed to understand that rightly or wrongly, many people were concerned about immigration.  Because of his weak preparation he failed to make any inroads into Schengen.  There is a French proposal to change Schengen so it only applies to EU passport holders, this has been around for a while and has some support.  This shows that Schengen is not immutable as Juncker kept saying.  Cameron could and should have exploited this.  It would for example make it harder for Calais to become a congregating point for non EU migrants.  That might have swayed some opinion in Kent for example.  This and other things should have been persued rigorously.  They weren't.  No excuse and probably the biggest mistake.

In short Cameron was badly prepared and badly advised.  He screwed up big time and now has the consequences.

Absolutely.  Nail on the head in one post.  With the exception of your final sentence; He screwed up big time and now we have the consequences.

quarky

p90fool said:

A girl in work said the other day "Europe was fine before the EU"

Er, no love, it was actually on fire.

Oh right. So nothing to do with NATO?

chrispy108

I think the Balkans and Ukraine would disagree with the common line of thinking that the EU stops anything bad happening...