Did Corbyn intentionally not support Remain properly, or is he not very good at politics?

Heartfeltdawn

lloyd said:

There's conventions to uphold though isn't there?

A butcher doesn't need to wear white, or check pants or even have an apron, but they do because that's what butchers do.

By the same token, dressing formally and neatly for certain jobs is something that should be followed, an MP is one of those jobs IMO, especially someone looking to be the leader of a country.

Is he going to go to the Remembrance Day gatherings with all the other dignitaries with gravy down last decades suit? It's about a show of respect.

And I'm a scruffy cunt at the best of times, but an MP I am not.

If we upheld conventions, every chef you know would be going round in a fucking stupid paper hat. Conventions change. Go and see the staff at the Coach, Tom Kerridge's place: aprons and white T-shirts on the website and nary a hat in sight. 

Where exactly was he wearing a suit covered in gravy at the Remembrance Day gathering? 

http://static1.purepeople.com/articles/1/16/79/01/@/1987420-angus-robertson-jeremy-corbyn-david-950x0-1.jpg

Heartfeltdawn

UnclePsychosis said:

You're right, but there are many people to whom appearance matters a great deal. Many of whom come from other countries and cultures---and being PM (which is a role to which Corbyn supposedly aspires) is a role in which he would be expected to interact with these people.

Hmmm. Interesting. So a less than immaculate Corbyn would be culturally insensitive to some people for whom appearance matters a great deal. 

So if she met a Muslim leader and her hair was exposed, would that be showing cultural insensitivity? 

I'm not trying to make the case that everyone should be dressed in a potato sack but I do find some of the convention around dress code to be utterly ridiculous. 

digitalscream said:

Thus proving the point that the overwhelming likelihood is that his relative scruffiness isn't an accident, particularly since his take-home is in the region of £6,300 a month (assuming no entitlements or dodgy tricks). Just a "regular guy"? Nah, not likely. He hasn't seen anything less than double the average wage since he became an MP in the early 80s.

So he earns decent money and so he should be spending it on better more expensive clothing. Why? If he were driving around a clapped out Honda Civic, would you tell him that he should be driving something better because he earns more?

The regularity with which his appearance comes up baffles me. When there's so much Corbyn material with which he can be damned, focusing on the cut of his trousers seems fairly pointless compared to the nonsensical nature of some of his policies. 

digitalscream

Heartfeltdawn said:

digitalscream said:

Thus proving the point that the overwhelming likelihood is that his relative scruffiness isn't an accident, particularly since his take-home is in the region of £6,300 a month (assuming no entitlements or dodgy tricks). Just a "regular guy"? Nah, not likely. He hasn't seen anything less than double the average wage since he became an MP in the early 80s.

So he earns decent money and so he should be spending it on better more expensive clothing. Why? If he were driving around a clapped out Honda Civic, would you tell him that he should be driving something better because he earns more? 

The regularity with which his appearance comes up baffles me. When there's so much Corbyn material with which he can be damned, focusing on the cut of his trousers seems bizarrely irrelevant to me. 

No, you're missing my point completely. In general, somebody who earns that much would have a totally different approach. In the political world, even more so. He has more than enough opportunity to do so, so the question is: why not? Possible answers are:

1 - He genuinely doesn't care
2 - It's a carefully-crafted image to appeal to make him look like he's not earning five times the national average and appeal to exactly the kind of people he thinks will vote for him

I'm betting on #2, because...politicians. It's their job to appeal to people to bring in the votes.

The second you can't find yourself believing that a politician would do something because he's such a nice, down-to-earth guy is the very second you've lost your objectivity. That's exactly what happened with Tony Blair, and exactly what's happening with Trump - the cult of personality matters more than the realism of their policies.

(not saying "you" specifically, but in a more general sense)

Heartfeltdawn

Digi, I get it. I simply don't agree with the notion of the carefully cultivated image. It's funny Mags mentioning Branson in the other thread because surely there we have an example of a successful professional who isn't exactly famed for his suit and tie ensembles. Battle of the scruffs!

Evilmags

Heartfeltdawn said:

Digi, I get it. I simply don't agree with the notion of the carefully cultivated image. It's funny Mags mentioning Branson in the other thread because surely there we have an example of a successful professional who isn't exactly famed for his suit and tie ensembles. Battle of the scruffs!

Branson owns his business and can cultivate his image in any way that he likes (And it is very carefully constructed I suspect). In his case I suspect ruthlessness is what he´s trying to hide from his buying public. Nothing about his appearance could every be called "cheap and nasty" though. Branson also has the sort of marketing machine that any politician should be wary of. You don´t do what he is done without knowing the game of hardball. 

ICBM

I don't think it's an image - or not a deliberately contrived one, anyway - I think he just doesn't care. It would only be a contrived image if he had a natural tendency to dress smartly and chose not to, which I doubt. I think it's highly unlikely he ever has.

Remember that until last year he expected to end his career as the same sort of irrelevant, constantly-rebelling backbencher that he started as - there's no need to dress up for that.

Evilmags

Nitefly

ICBM said:

Remember that until last year he expected to end his career as the same sort of irrelevant, constantly-rebelling backbencher that he started as - there's no need to dress up for that.

I suspect he'll probably get his wish...

Heartfeltdawn

Evilmags said:

Above: a dirty scruffbag who shames politics. 

Below: an example of how a suit makes a politician appear dignified (shortly before executing his personal tailor). 

http://static.independent.co.uk/s3fs-public/thumbnails/image/2016/05/08/09/kim-jong-un.jpg

lloyd

Heartfeltdawn said:

lloyd said:

There's conventions to uphold though isn't there?

A butcher doesn't need to wear white, or check pants or even have an apron, but they do because that's what butchers do.

By the same token, dressing formally and neatly for certain jobs is something that should be followed, an MP is one of those jobs IMO, especially someone looking to be the leader of a country.

Is he going to go to the Remembrance Day gatherings with all the other dignitaries with gravy down last decades suit? It's about a show of respect.

And I'm a scruffy cunt at the best of times, but an MP I am not.

If we upheld conventions, every chef you know would be going round in a fucking stupid paper hat. Conventions change. Go and see the staff at the Coach, Tom Kerridge's place: aprons and white T-shirts on the website and nary a hat in sight. 

Where exactly was he wearing a suit covered in gravy at the Remembrance Day gathering? 

http://static1.purepeople.com/articles/1/16/79/01/@/1987420-angus-robertson-jeremy-corbyn-david-950x0-1.jpg

I asked a question about the gravy stained suit not an assertion so not sure what that's about?

Yeah conventions change but for me people in professional jobs should dress professionally, for me he doesn't do that a lot of the time, and like his sitting on the train bullshit it comes across like a bit of an act.

But he's no different from all the other politicians-he just has a different end product.

Heartfeltdawn

lloyd said:

I asked a question about the gravy stained suit not an assertion so not sure what that's about?

Yeah conventions change but for me people in professional jobs should dress professionally, for me he doesn't do that a lot of the time, and like his sitting on the train bullshit it comes across like a bit of an act.

But he's no different from all the other politicians-he just has a different end product.

So if he wore leopardskin pumps, would that be professional? 

http://i3.mirror.co.uk/incoming/article8403302.ece/ALTERNATES/s615b/12-Jan-The-shoes-of-Home-Secretary-Theresa-May-as-she-arrives-in-Downing-Street-London-for-the-final-Cabinet-meeting.jpg

scrumhalf

Heartfeltdawn said:

lloyd said:

I asked a question about the gravy stained suit not an assertion so not sure what that's about?

Yeah conventions change but for me people in professional jobs should dress professionally, for me he doesn't do that a lot of the time, and like his sitting on the train bullshit it comes across like a bit of an act.

But he's no different from all the other politicians-he just has a different end product.

So if he wore leopardskin pumps, would that be professional? 

http://i3.mirror.co.uk/incoming/article8403302.ece/ALTERNATES/s615b/12-Jan-The-shoes-of-Home-Secretary-Theresa-May-as-she-arrives-in-Downing-Street-London-for-the-final-Cabinet-meeting.jpg

Yes, but the profession wouldn't be politics.

littlegreenman

scrumhalf said:

Heartfeltdawn said:

lloyd said:

I asked a question about the gravy stained suit not an assertion so not sure what that's about?

Yeah conventions change but for me people in professional jobs should dress professionally, for me he doesn't do that a lot of the time, and like his sitting on the train bullshit it comes across like a bit of an act.

But he's no different from all the other politicians-he just has a different end product.

So if he wore leopardskin pumps, would that be professional? 

http://i3.mirror.co.uk/incoming/article8403302.ece/ALTERNATES/s615b/12-Jan-The-shoes-of-Home-Secretary-Theresa-May-as-she-arrives-in-Downing-Street-London-for-the-final-Cabinet-meeting.jpg

Yes, but the profession wouldn't be politics.

So what profession should she be in with those shoes?