So it's a NO.. so what happens now?

suspiciousminds

Blummen double post!

suspiciousminds

Blummen double post!
God damn ios8!

chillidoggy

suspiciousminds said:

suspiciousminds;358632" said:

On a lighter note - my boss who's scottish is gonna do us a "scottish nite" to celebrate, which will contain something called clootie dumplings.
Problem is, as her accent is broad scots it sounds to all us blokes like "clitty dumplings"!

Cant wait personally!

Photos for the lads?

johnnyurq

Try as I might the thought of a clit the size and shape of a dumpling fails to arouse.

historyisjunk

Thanks to those who've signed this-
https://secure.38degrees.org.uk/promise-for-Scotland

Explained more fully in post earlier in this thread. It would be really good if we could get the numbers up past the 100,000 mark.

If anyone is minded perhaps they could share the petition on FB or Twitter, forward to friends....

Would also be really good if a lot of people in the UK outside of Scotland signed & pointed this out in their comments so the party leaders know people across the country want to see these promises kept.

Thanks

ewal

 

Evilmags said:

If Millaband stands in the way of Devo max labour will be buggered in Scotland for a long time. Which it should be as it has run every shite and corrupt municipality in the country.

From what I'm seeing on social media etc, I think Labour are buggered in Scotland for a long time, regardless of what happens with Devo Max... In fact I think Labour are going to be by far the biggest losers out of this...

PolarityMan

I'm pleased that it was a no vote and I'm also glad that the further devo measures are also being framed as having wider applicability than just the scottish parliament.

My view all along is that this is largely a symptom of getting the delegation level incorrect between local and national govenrment.

Well that and a certain subset of the population in cities like Dundee and Glasgow being hard hit by the decline of heavy industry but obviously that's a problem that has been faced by other areas in the UK as well.

sinbaadi

johnnyurq said:

sinbaadi;358247" said:

TLDR, I just find myself wondering who's the more scared that they're getting the worse end of the deal?  The Scots that think England will just continue to use and abuse them, or the English that think Scotland is going to be given unfair powers/freedom/finances as a reward for voting No.

For me it's obvious what will happen.  Westminster will drag their heels with anything important.  Parties will build election campaigns around the delivery (or not) of these promises to Scotland (and the rest of the UK), and the treadmill continues.  Nobody will benefit, really.

No offence dude but I hope you are wrong and they deliver for us all this time.

Sadly in the real world it is certainly very plausable that it will go down exactly as you say here though.

None taken.  My cynicism is itself a source of depression for me

They're already at it, of course, each setting their stalls out over how they'll deliver the promises.  Every MP's number one goal for his/her term in office is to get re-elected, terms are too short to do a great deal much else anyway.

Labour are a mystery to me at the moment.  Don't they realise that the country remembers that their long stretch in charge descended us into this abyss, but that support for their party would double overnight if they dropped that cartoon character from the leadership position?  Or is it just me that finds him even more abhorrent than Gordon fake-smile Brown? 

ICBM

sinbaadi said:

Labour are a mystery to me at the moment.  Don't they realise that the country remembers that their long stretch in charge descended us into this abyss, but that support for their party would double overnight if they dropped that cartoon character from the leadership position?  Or is it just me that finds him even more abhorrent than Gordon fake-smile Brown?

I can't take Miliband seriously, but he has a long way to go before he could equal the track record of stupidity, deceit and arrogance that Brown displayed as Chancellor and Prime Minister.

johnnyurq

Cannot disagree at all with any of what you both have said @ICBM and @sinbaadi Labour seem to be determined to replace the Tories as most unelectable in Scotland, as well as all over the UK.

10 year strategy my arse Millitwat.

Most of my friends, family and colleagues throughout Scotland are similarly bemused and pissed off with Labour and Milliband. Most like me were pretty much lifelong Labour voters, until recent years and of course weeks.

What do we think of the murmurs on allowing 16 year olds to vote in the GE etc?

My take is that the ones who did so for the referendum were more thoughtful and enquiring than us jaded old farts. Some very intelligent commentary and full engagement on the whole process.

I look at young uns like @Bucket and @Hertz and my sons mates and friends young uns and see that they are much more sophisticated re these and a lot of other matters we hadn't a scooby's about at 16/17.

It would certainly shake up votes if they vote to vote and engage in large numbers.

Of course it would be interesting to get some stats as to how many voted in the referendum and how they affected the vote one way or the other.

Does the argument old enough to die for yiur country old rnough to vote ho,d any water?

littlegreenman

johnnyurq said:

What do we think of the murmurs on allowing 16 year olds to vote in the GE etc?

Does the argument old enough to die for yiur country old rnough to vote ho,d any water?

Old enough to die, definitely old enough to vote. IMHO. 17, IIRC.

johnnyurq

I would tend to agree @littlegreenman and would welcome younger ones to have the vote.

Some of them out so called grown ups to shame here in the referendum. Less baggage too so less bollocky arguing too.

ICBM

I'm not sure. There is a lot of illogicality in that age range concerning sex, marriage, living independently, school, driving, drinking, voting and probably some other things... I think the real problem is that for every responsible, well-informed 16-year-old there is probably an irresponsible ill-educated 17-year-old as well. Children/young adults are changing very fast at that age and not all at the same speed.

The question is, does it matter. The number of 16 and 17-year-olds voting is unlikely to be decisive in most elections, and it might also give an increased sense of responsibility to those who do which could have a positive effect. The ones who are not ready are possibly more likely just to have no interest than to 'vote irrationally'.

littlegreenman

'tis rare that the youngest are called upon to fight, but 17 YO can be called up in times of war.

Although I have to say that the youngsters near me wouldn't know what a vote even was, never mind what to do with it!!!!

johnnyurq

That would be my hope @ICBM that the feckless and truly illogical ones would just bodyswerve voting entirely, leaving the zenzible ones voting.

As for illogical and that some older ones were far worse with one I saw where in event of a yes they would move to Norway (or similar) because they don't pay tax there.

I am sure it will become an issue that is well debated more as the GE machine trundles on.

If any party/parties perceive an advantage to allowing it in future votes then it will be championed by them I am sure.

Still be interesting to see what if any impact that demographic made to the referendum, I suspect not too much.

More of them voting yes and we may have had shaded a yes and gained Doncaster into the bargain.    

 

holnrew

Old enough to die, old enough to bum.

ICBM

johnnyurq said:

As for illogical and that some older ones were far worse with one I saw where in event of a yes they would move to Norway (or similar) because they don't pay tax there.

There is also a problem with older people voting based on issues that were important to them twenty or thirty years ago and not on what the parties actually stand for today. At least 16/17-year-olds might be more aware of the world as it is now.

johnnyurq said:

Still be interesting to see what if any impact that demographic made to the referendum, I suspect not too much.

None at all to the actual result - 16/17-year-olds are only 2.5% of the electorate.