Lab grown meat approved for use in the UK

digitalscream

FastEddie said:

digitalscream said:

FastEddie said:

digitalscream said:

FastEddie said:

Lab grown meat is a slow death. It is simply a means of population control from the ingestion of industrial waste. 

Do you have a factual reference for that?

Yes.
Go to the beach on a sunny day. The supermarket. Any Greggs.
That is dying (did you get the play on words, living) proof that a modern diet is slowly killing the population.

Stats of heart disease and diabeties before 19440 or so to the modern day.

What else do you need? It's all around you. 

https://saifedean.com/tfs

This is absolutely nothing to do with a "modern diet". This is an entirely new method of food production. I'm asking you for a justification for your statement that "lab grown meat is a slow death". Do you know anything about that specifically relating to lab-grown meat which isn't just generic statements about processed food and modern diets?

Does anyone have the exact paper which you wish for?
Nobody will have it because there is never funding to disprove anything.
My point is that since the beginning of the FDA (USA) the Gov have been manipulating diets for their own ends. Saifedean Ammous documents this in the book I referenced.

No, nobody has the information that would support your assertions. That's precisely my point - you're just making it up and referring to completely unrelated things to support it. That's the very definition of "disingenuous".

EricTheWeary

FastEddie said:

How about this as a method of food production - cow, grass, plate.

Just to state the (I presume) obvious that it isn't a sustainable way of feeding the number of people on the planet, certainly not at the levels of meat consumption that many people in the West are used to.

Benm39

Yup,  the cow is entirely surplus to requirements. Lovely animals I'm sure but not necessary for healthy dietetc. 

Petepassion

FastEddie said:

digitalscream said:

FastEddie said:

Lab grown meat is a slow death. It is simply a means of population control from the ingestion of industrial waste. 

Do you have a factual reference for that?

https://saifedean.com/tfs

Looks quite similar to the work Peter Joseph has done, does he reference Peter Joseph or Jacque Fresco at all?

Kittyfrisk

Couple of overviews for those that might be interested (no affiliations)  https://www.eufic.org/en/food-production/article/lab-grown-meat-how-it-is-made-and-what-are-the-pros-and-cons

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultured_meat

No mentions of industrial waste so far, more that the degree of scientific purity of ingredients, nutrients, lab practices etc. are far more prevalent.

Hoof

If lab grown meat becomes the norm, livestock is eliminated and the cow, pig, sheep, chicken etc become effectively extinct, how will we get products such as leather, eggs, wool, natural fertilizers? The production of meat makes these economically viable.

Petepassion

Hoof said:

If lab grown meat becomes the norm, livestock is eliminated and the cow, pig, sheep, chicken etc become effectively extinct, how will we get products such as leather, eggs, wool, natural fertilizers? The production of meat makes these economically viable.

Does the use of these animals need to be the current level to maintain the current production of the goods you list?

Benm39

Hoof said:

If lab grown meat becomes the norm, livestock is eliminated and the cow, pig, sheep, chicken etc become effectively extinct, how will we get products such as leather, eggs, wool, natural fertilizers? The production of meat makes these economically viable.

Intensive farming methods for beef,  chicken and pigs (* upto 30 storey high rise blocks in later case increasingly) are atrocities which should be eradicated.  Sheep farming (*provided upland grazing of sensitive habitats is stock controlled) is perhaps less problematic as wool is harvested from sheep typically not used for production of lamb. But in any case none of the by products listed are actually necessary.  Agriculture and horticulture relies almost entirely on chemical rather than natural fertiliser as nutrient requirements can then be more accurately dialed in etc.  Using animal by-products/ Co products makes sense certainly but doesnt really stack up as an argument for continued reliance on meat based diets. 

It takes roughly 10-11x the amount of land to produce a 'unit' of beef to feed someone compared to a plant based diet.  That alone means that there simply isn't enough planet to feed a growing population in that way,  somethings gotta give... ditto re the significant problems of air quality and agricultural run off 

Rocker

We are carnivores so eating meat is how we evolved to what we are.  I think it might take a thousand years evolution for us to become 100% vegetarians.  

Kittyfrisk

Rocker said:

We are carnivores so eating meat is how we evolved to what we are.  I think it might take a thousand years evolution for us to become 100% vegetarians.  

I think you'll find we are omnivores.

Offset

VimFuego said:

Adey said:

VimFuego said:

Kurtis said:

I'd imagine it's very unlikely it will have the same nutritional value as real meat. 

what are you basing that on?

That's nearly another...

hahaha, the forums bargain basement troll has surfaced. Was wondering when you'd get triggered, you never disappoint. 

I think that's a bit unfair Vim.  Adey is far more upmarket than that :-)

darthed1981

Offset said:

VimFuego said:

Adey said:

VimFuego said:

Kurtis said:

I'd imagine it's very unlikely it will have the same nutritional value as real meat. 

what are you basing that on?

That's nearly another...

hahaha, the forums bargain basement troll has surfaced. Was wondering when you'd get triggered, you never disappoint. 

I think that's a bit unfair Vim.  Adey is far more upmarket than that :-)

Yeah there has been some proper bargain-basement trolling in here - Adey is well above that.

He's more like Aldi, but the nice bits of Aldi, like the bakery section.

darthed1981

Kittyfrisk said:

Rocker said:

We are carnivores so eating meat is how we evolved to what we are.  I think it might take a thousand years evolution for us to become 100% vegetarians.  

I think you'll find we are omnivores.

I just read quite a lot of this thread and rocker's nonsense statement is nothing on some of the preceding stuff.

VimFuego

darthed1981 said:

Offset said:

VimFuego said:

Adey said:

VimFuego said:

Kurtis said:

I'd imagine it's very unlikely it will have the same nutritional value as real meat. 

what are you basing that on?

That's nearly another...

hahaha, the forums bargain basement troll has surfaced. Was wondering when you'd get triggered, you never disappoint. 

I think that's a bit unfair Vim.  Adey is far more upmarket than that :-)

Yeah there has been some proper bargain-basement trolling in here - Adey is well above that.

He's more like Aldi, but the nice bits of Aldi, like the bakery section.

each to their own of course, but for me he's a gregg's sausage roll of a troll. 

VimFuego

re the whole processed food being bad, fast eddie has a point there (though this is a point that has already been raised in this thread before he said it, so it's not really his point at all) although it doesn't constitute evidence to support anything he's said (he does seem to struggle with the concept of evidence or proof). It's almost similar to the argument made by vegans about diet, that we should be eating way less of the processed crap and as much food in its natural state as we can. 
Lab grown meat has come about because of market forces, the market demands cheap meat, but the current system cannot hope to provide the quantities demanded, so manufacturers have come up with a solution. I guess another solution, one that I assume fast eddie would be more approving of, is to consume only high quality meat, but in massively lower quantities.
I do recall reading several things about how much healthier our diet was during the war because of rationing, food for thought there maybe...

monquixote

Hoof said:

If lab grown meat becomes the norm, livestock is eliminated and the cow, pig, sheep, chicken etc become effectively extinct, how will we get products such as leather, eggs, wool, natural fertilizers? The production of meat makes these economically viable.

I think this is a non problem

Gandalph

VimFuego said:

darthed1981 said:

Offset said:

VimFuego said:

Adey said:

VimFuego said:

Kurtis said:

I'd imagine it's very unlikely it will have the same nutritional value as real meat. 

what are you basing that on?

That's nearly another...

hahaha, the forums bargain basement troll has surfaced. Was wondering when you'd get triggered, you never disappoint. 

I think that's a bit unfair Vim.  Adey is far more upmarket than that :-)

Yeah there has been some proper bargain-basement trolling in here - Adey is well above that.

He's more like Aldi, but the nice bits of Aldi, like the bakery section.

each to their own of course, but for me he's a gregg's sausage roll of a troll. 

He's not a troll though is he. 

Just because he shakes some of you lot up in the P&E section. Doesn't make him a troll. 

VimFuego

Gandalph said:

VimFuego said:

darthed1981 said:

Offset said:

VimFuego said:

Adey said:

VimFuego said:

Kurtis said:

I'd imagine it's very unlikely it will have the same nutritional value as real meat. 

what are you basing that on?

That's nearly another...

hahaha, the forums bargain basement troll has surfaced. Was wondering when you'd get triggered, you never disappoint. 

I think that's a bit unfair Vim.  Adey is far more upmarket than that :-)

Yeah there has been some proper bargain-basement trolling in here - Adey is well above that.

He's more like Aldi, but the nice bits of Aldi, like the bakery section.

each to their own of course, but for me he's a gregg's sausage roll of a troll. 

He's not a troll though is he. 

Just because he shakes some of you lot up in the P&E section. Don't make him a troll. 

incorrect. And I don't go to P&E, but thanks for playing, better luck next time

digitalscream

monquixote said:

Hoof said:

If lab grown meat becomes the norm, livestock is eliminated and the cow, pig, sheep, chicken etc become effectively extinct, how will we get products such as leather, eggs, wool, natural fertilizers? The production of meat makes these economically viable.

I think this is a non problem

Leather, maybe. Eggs are a massively important source of protein, and there's no viable substitute in a hell of a lot of foodstuffs.

Natural fertilisers are also an issue, because the fact that they're effectively a byproduct makes crop production viable for those farmers focused on not actively harming the environment they rely on.

I'm not saying there's no solution to the latter, but it would take a lot more work. Eggs...I don't think there is any other option there.

Gandalph

VimFuego said:

incorrect. And I don't go to P&E, but thanks for playing, better luck next time

I suppose I should be thankful for small mercies.